Red Line oil in passenger cars

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12,310
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Colorado Springs
Thanks. I think when you take into account what I spent on the car, about $24k, spending $120 a year on two oil changes isn't going to cause me any concerns....what will cause me concerns is if I'm damaging my car in anyway. As they say, engines are expensive and oil is cheap. I have used conventional oil in a 2001 civic that went 250k miles (~7500 mile OCI)...sold it for $2500 :) and the engine was in perfect condition. So you are right, the engines will outlive me even if I used the cheapest synthetic or even conventional. I just wanted to use RL to see if it would clean out the piston rings (if that is what is the cause of my increased oil burning).
How you know that RL is better for your engine than what manufacturer recommends? RL Performance is best suited for track use and shorter OCI. So yeah, if you track your car and use it on daily basis, sure. If not, you really do not know if RL is any better than your usual suspect in Wal Mart shelfs.
 
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12,310
Location
Colorado Springs
i've used Redline 0w20 in 2 of my previous oil changes for my 2014 Subaru Crosstrek. i bought it because i was curious, had coupons, and I knew it was going to be overkill for my car; i wanted to maximize antiwear basically. My car is out of warranty too so I didn't mind that Red Line isn't officially certified, despite claiming API SN / GF-5.

Overall, once the car reaches operating temperatures, it felt smoother and more responsive and it was quieter. In the winter, it does take a while for the car to feel normal.Currently, I'm using Motul because its cheaper and with covid, i'm not driving as much, so Redline feels even more of a waste.

Once the world's back to normal, I would continue using Redline until my stash is all gone. After that, who knows?

Since your car is burning oil, why not use a thicker oil or High Mileage oil?
So, how much of iron, copper, lead did you save?
 

EEE

Thread starter
Messages
22
Another option is the ask Dave over at Redline and get an answer from the source:

Red Line Synthetic Oil is open for business Monday through Friday, 7:00 a.m. to 3:30 p.m. PST.

Red Line Synthetic Oil
6100 Egret Court Benicia, CA 94510
Phone: (707) 745-6100 or (800) 624-7958

I used a lot of Redline over the years in many engines and really like their products. Now however I prefer a vegetable based oil, Renewable Lubricants. 'Not because it is a bio based oil but rather it has resulted in less wear in my engines.

AEHaas
Thanks. I just got an email from Dave. Very satisfied with his reply. The esters used in the RL line are fully compatible with RTV and other gaskets. My concerns stemmed from this http://ultimatesyntheticoil.com/oil-seal-gasket-leaks-from-changing-to-synthetic-oil where the author says

"However, a few synthetics on the market are Group V: esters can chemically attack some plastics, and some seal or gasket materials including RTV. This issue has likely contributed to the belief that synthetics can cause oil seals or gaskets to leak. RTV is sometimes used in aftermarket shop work in place of a sealing gasket, or combined with a gasket either to help hold the gasket in position during tricky installations, or to ensure sealing of a damaged or re-used gasket. Since AMSOIL does not use Group V base-stocks, AMSOIL synthetic engine and gear oils are fully compatible with all standard gasket and seal materials."

I'm impressed with Dave's timely response and his explanation.
 

EEE

Thread starter
Messages
22
i've used Redline 0w20 in 2 of my previous oil changes for my 2014 Subaru Crosstrek. i bought it because i was curious, had coupons, and I knew it was going to be overkill for my car; i wanted to maximize antiwear basically. My car is out of warranty too so I didn't mind that Red Line isn't officially certified, despite claiming API SN / GF-5.

Overall, once the car reaches operating temperatures, it felt smoother and more responsive and it was quieter. In the winter, it does take a while for the car to feel normal.Currently, I'm using Motul because its cheaper and with covid, i'm not driving as much, so Redline feels even more of a waste.

Once the world's back to normal, I would continue using Redline until my stash is all gone. After that, who knows?

Since your car is burning oil, why not use a thicker oil or High Mileage oil?
I may try more viscous oil at some point, but would prefer to stick with what the car was designed for. I'm not sure what damage, if any, would be caused by a more viscous oil. I'm willing to try a few different oils to see what happens. Some say "my car burns x brand oil, when I switched to y brand oil it stopped burning". I don't know how much truth there is in that statement, but I'm willing to try a few oils before I give up on this car. My other car is a civic with over 220k on it. I will need a new car in a while, so I may dump the oil burner and keep the civic.
 

OVERKILL

$100 Site Donor 2021
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46,022
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Ontario, Canada
Thanks. I just got an email from Dave. Very satisfied with his reply. The esters used in the RL line are fully compatible with RTV and other gaskets. My concerns stemmed from this http://ultimatesyntheticoil.com/oil-seal-gasket-leaks-from-changing-to-synthetic-oil where the author says

"However, a few synthetics on the market are Group V: esters can chemically attack some plastics, and some seal or gasket materials including RTV. This issue has likely contributed to the belief that synthetics can cause oil seals or gaskets to leak. RTV is sometimes used in aftermarket shop work in place of a sealing gasket, or combined with a gasket either to help hold the gasket in position during tricky installations, or to ensure sealing of a damaged or re-used gasket. Since AMSOIL does not use Group V base-stocks, AMSOIL synthetic engine and gear oils are fully compatible with all standard gasket and seal materials."

I'm impressed with Dave's timely response and his explanation.

That's just an AMSOIL dealer website, I'd take that with a grain of salt.

Redline isn't majority POE, it's majority PAO with a solid splash of POE. PAO needs to be balanced with other additives because PAO is hard on seals in the other direction: it shrinks them, whereas esters can swell them. A bit of an over-simplification here but: you can balance those two bases to neutralize those effects. AN's are also used to balance PAO out for the same reason.

AMSOIL uses a lot of PAO so....

:whistle:
 
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47,786
Location
Everson WA - Pacific NW USA
That's just an AMSOIL dealer website, I'd take that with a grain of salt.

Redline isn't majority POE, it's majority PAO with a solid splash of POE. PAO needs to be balanced with other additives because PAO is hard on seals in the other direction: it shrinks them, whereas esters can swell them. A bit of an over-simplification here but: you can balance those two bases to neutralize those effects. AN's are also used to balance PAO out for the same reason.

AMSOIL uses a lot of PAO so....

:whistle:
Yep. And not even an Amsoil approved site at that, for sure that page isn't.

"AMSOIL does not use Group V base-stocks"

Dude knows nothing.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
OP is way way way way overthinking this. And definitely made some critical errors in the first post. My first bit of advice, STOP trying to be base oil chemist. Some few wrong assumptions (example, RP is not a PAO oil) - and frankly no oil is a pure any base oil. The new Redline isn't. And you certainly do NOT want a race oil in a street engine.

Choose an oil the meets the required specs for the engine and driving conditions. Maybe the choice can be improved from there, maybe it can't.
 
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1,097
Location
TX
Not all Red Line is a "race oil". They do sell a line of race oils, but that's not what people are putting into their daily driven cars; they're putting the "high performance" line in. Or "professional" line, I guess, but that's not usually what people are talking about.
 

OVERKILL

$100 Site Donor 2021
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Location
Ontario, Canada
Not all Red Line is a "race oil". They do sell a line of race oils, but that's not what people are putting into their daily driven cars; they're putting the "high performance" line in. Or "professional" line, I guess, but that's not usually what people are talking about.

The "professional" series is just re-bottled Kendall or Phillips 66. The white bottle stuff (High Performance) does tend to have "race" levels of additives, but the M1 0w-40 is a popular race oil, so that isn't immediately a knock against products used in that manner.
 
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8
I may try more viscous oil at some point, but would prefer to stick with what the car was designed for. I'm not sure what damage, if any, would be caused by a more viscous oil.
check your manual to see if multiple viscosities are listed.
 
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2,856
Location
pa
redlines premium lubes are costly but worth it in most cases but its your $$$, the only downside! i use their drivetrain lubes in my car 2001 TT + 2011 frontier SV + my enhanced TT from 225hp stock is about 300 hp + torque from the 1.8L turbo charged engine + with a small 4.25 oil pan it gets RL' premium oil 15-50 in summer as at boost it uses some + the 15-50 almost totally cut consumption + increased the vacuum i see on my boost vac gauge to about 25, a good thing! used amsoil years ago, but when they "quietly" changed to whatever they use + provide little support IMO i switched to RL!! in the TT
 
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7,042
Location
Wet side WA
redlines premium lubes are costly but worth it in most cases but its your $$$, the only downside! i use their drivetrain lubes in my car 2001 TT + 2011 frontier SV + my enhanced TT from 225hp stock is about 300 hp + torque from the 1.8L turbo charged engine + with a small 4.25 oil pan it gets RL' premium oil 15-50 in summer as at boost it uses some + the 15-50 almost totally cut consumption + increased the vacuum i see on my boost vac gauge to about 25, a good thing! used amsoil years ago, but when they "quietly" changed to whatever they use + provide little support IMO i switched to RL!! in the TT
Worth it in most cases because maybe they give your engine how many more 100's of thousand miles of life? A URL from an independent Laboratory please.
 
Messages
12,310
Location
Colorado Springs
Not all Red Line is a "race oil". They do sell a line of race oils, but that's not what people are putting into their daily driven cars; they're putting the "high performance" line in. Or "professional" line, I guess, but that's not usually what people are talking about.
There is BIG, and I MEAN BIG, difference between their performance and professional oils. Professional oils are mediocre at best. It is rebadge Kendall.
Their performance oils are different story. Theya re basically track/street oils and no one should set OCI records with them. Not sure what is their advantage in regular use. I track my BMW< and I can see benefit of using their 5W40 Performance oil. But in my Toyota? Why?
Do not get me wrong. I have their gear oil in Toyota, I use their D4 in my BMW stick (exceptional performance).
 
Messages
12,310
Location
Colorado Springs
redlines premium lubes are costly but worth it in most cases but its your $$$, the only downside! i use their drivetrain lubes in my car 2001 TT + 2011 frontier SV + my enhanced TT from 225hp stock is about 300 hp + torque from the 1.8L turbo charged engine + with a small 4.25 oil pan it gets RL' premium oil 15-50 in summer as at boost it uses some + the 15-50 almost totally cut consumption + increased the vacuum i see on my boost vac gauge to about 25, a good thing! used amsoil years ago, but when they "quietly" changed to whatever they use + provide little support IMO i switched to RL!! in the TT
WHy they are worth in my cars?
Again, I use their gear fluids. D4 works like charm in BMW stick. But, what do I get with RL in my Toyota that I do not get with M1 5W30 EP? Except, RL will oxidize more.
 
Messages
155
Location
NJ
WHy they are worth in my cars?
Again, I use their gear fluids. D4 works like charm in BMW stick. But, what do I get with RL in my Toyota that I do not get with M1 5W30 EP? Except, RL will oxidize more.
I had a problem with the MT-90 in 2 different car transmissions calling for a 75W-90 and were "recommended" by redline's website. A 1995 Pathfinder and a 2004 Audi A4 1.8t. Both shifted like **** in anything under 30 degrees F until the trans warmed up. 20 and below was like shifting through mud. Once I went back to OEM Audi fluid shifting was never an issue again. The pathfinder I ended up trashing cause the frame was rotting out. That's not to say that it is a bad product or any of their products are bad. Just my experience with MT-90 in 2 different vehicles. I haven't used their engine oils yet. I have Amsoil gear lubes, oil and ATF in my Stage 2+ 2.7t S4. I haven't had any issues. Though, my sump is ~8qts now since I use the bigger oil filter and an second oil cooler.
 
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