Rear Sway Bar/Front Strut Brace

Status
Not open for further replies.
404 silly not found. There are plenty of economy cars that handle WAY better than a Corolla, enough to be worth considering. Some of them even handle better than more "upscale" cars.

I'd take a 2006-2011 Civic Si over pretty much any new car under $40k, sports cars and Autobahn bombers included.
 
Perhaps, but you can bet the better they get in handling, the further they get from being an actual economy car.


Your opinion, I wouldn't. In that price category it would be FRS/BRZ without question and every singe car enthusiast from Motor Trend to Top Gear would agree. Economy cars are geared towards fuel economy. The Civic SI is an economy car that gets carpy economy.
 
Originally Posted By: Smokescreen
Perhaps, but you can bet the better they get in handling, the further they get from being an actual economy car.

In what sense?

If a firmer ride qualifies as "further from being an actual economy car," then I think I see your point, but I think that's a bit of a stretch...


Originally Posted By: Smokescreen
Your opinion, I wouldn't. In that price category it would be FRS/BRZ without question and every singe car enthusiast from Motor Trend to Top Gear would agree. Economy cars are geared towards fuel economy. The Civic SI is an economy car that gets carpy economy.

I apologize if my posts are confusing, but I suspect you're just skimming and not actually reading closely. What I said was that I'd pick an '06-11 Civic Si over ALMOST anything new. The point was simply that I think it drives better than a lot of more expensive cars that supposedly have more sport cred, and that it is therefore a huge leap over something like a Corolla for which handling is essentially nowhere on the map.

If I actually had the money to change cars, I can imagine exactly one scenario in which I would buy any economy car at all (including the Civic Si), and that scenario is highly unlikely. But that's another story.

As for fuel economy, as you get above the 20-30 MPG range, the returns diminish sharply. Do some gallons-per-mile calculations and you'll see what I mean. In general, you have to take a HUGE hit to driving enjoyment to squeeze out significant savings on fuel at that point.
 
Your posts aren't confusing at all, but what you mean and what you write...might be.

My lifetime average is in just shy of 39mpgUS and I have nearly 112,000 miles on my Corolla. My best fuel tanks are in the high 46mpgUS range. Yet, I drive my Corolla with enough enthusiasm to invoke lift off over-steer at least once a month...so not a crazy hyper-miler either. Generally speaking cars that get decent fuel economy don't focus on handling, but that is not to say they can't be improved upon. This is changing since 2009 however.

Any econo-box (non-hybrid) that gets worse than 35mpg highway and costs more than a the standard econo-box is a carpy economy car...no matter to how it handles. So the Civic SI and others on purchase price and fuel economy pushes itself outside the economy car range...for my standards anyway.

For the record I have never claimed the Corolla to be a sporty car or even have good handling, so please stop saying it. I merely mentioned that for $350 you can greatly improve on its stock handling and address the concerns of the OP. It was the best tool for the job in my definition of economy car (namely fuel economy and purchase price) in 2009.

For me, a great handling car would take a thought out balanced chassis, rear wheel drive and enough power. Whether a built Miata, an FRS/BRZ or an M3 or what have you. IMO Fwd econo-boxes don't at the present time fit that bill.
 
The electric power steering in new Corolla/Matrix is terrible. Test drove one and hated it. Mind you I have EPS in Prius and RAV4 and they are not bad at all. Hydraulic power steering in 9th gen Corolla was great.
 
so far, I haven't seen anyone ask what the end goals for this car are.

If its just for a better feel of the car on on/off ramps etc, I say go for it IF you're going to keep the car for a while. If you're trading it in in a year, why bother?

I'd like to do this to my crown vic, as I drive it like I do my M3 frequently... but I've had it for 5 years and its time for a change....
 
Originally Posted By: d00df00d

I'd take a 2006-2011 Civic Si over pretty much any new car under $40k, sports cars and Autobahn bombers included.


Well you might have a point. They had a really nice si at my Honda dealer with a 6 speed manual and fat tires. But it still is a "poor man's" BMW.
grin2.gif
 
Exactly. I'd say that's a very good thing, since BMW is no longer the BMW that driving enthusiasts loved. The 128i is the last car that sticks to the old values.
 
Originally Posted By: Smokescreen

For me, a great handling car would take a thought out balanced chassis, rear wheel drive and enough power. Whether a built Miata, an FRS/BRZ or an M3 or what have you. IMO Fwd econo-boxes don't at the present time fit that bill.


Agreed. But we're not going for great here, are we? I thought we were just going for better.
 
Originally Posted By: Smokescreen
... I merely mentioned that for $350 you can greatly improve on its stock handling and address the concerns of the OP....


& as I have already mentioned, adding the bars addresses the OP problems sufficiently, making it better.
 
Thanks for all the replies!

So it seems to be worth it. I don't really want a "sports car", I'm quite happy with a commuter car for now, I just want to remedy the "all over the place" highway issue.

So the sway bars I will do, lowering springs I'll skip for now.

I was looking at getting the Michelin Primacy MXV4 tires. My questions is, do I get the 16" alloys to help the ride, or do I just get the 15" version of the tire and put it on the steelies?
 
SMC:
You have to get new tires, so 1st evaluate the impact better tires have on directional stability, and then you may know better how to proceed with suspension mods.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: surfstar
This is why I threw around the $1k figure:

Originally Posted By: smc733


I can get a TRD rear sway bar, front strut brace parts + install for $600. Is there any chance this would solve my issues, along with perhaps new tires? I also wanted to do the lowering springs to see if that helped the wind issue on the highway, but parts + labor on that is nearly $800.



A 2011 Corolla might trade in decently towards a 2012 Mazda3 skyactiv that will get 40mpg hwy and be fun to drive. And last about half as long.
 
Originally Posted By: KitaCam
SMC:
You have to get new tires, so 1st evaluate the impact better tires have on directional stability, and then you may know better how to proceed with suspension mods.


Should I get the 16" alloys to pair with them? I figured larger wheel/smaller sidewall could help the handling...
 
Originally Posted By: sciphi
The rear sway bar will make the handling more neutral, while the front strut brace will make the steering feel more solid. They should make the car handle better during a turn. Combine that with a decent all-season, and the car's handling will be upgraded. It'll be more willing to stay planted going around corners.

That won't really help with getting blown around on the highway, as that's more aerodynamics than anything else.
You might make sure your toe in is set to the high end of the range, and if you can for benchmark purposes, find another car of the same year to test drive. Interestingly, larger, wider tires don't always reduce "wander" but tires which run at a lower slip angle angle can improve tracking. The difference between 14 inch diameter wheels and 15's on the Gen 4 Camry is very evident. A strut bay does tighten things up, (and help to keep it that way on what passes for roads hereabouts. ) My experience with TRD is they know what they are doing, at least with Camrys.
 
Originally Posted By: HerrStig
Originally Posted By: sciphi
The rear sway bar will make the handling more neutral, while the front strut brace will make the steering feel more solid. They should make the car handle better during a turn. Combine that with a decent all-season, and the car's handling will be upgraded. It'll be more willing to stay planted going around corners.

That won't really help with getting blown around on the highway, as that's more aerodynamics than anything else.
You might make sure your toe in is set to the high end of the range, and if you can for benchmark purposes, find another car of the same year to test drive. Interestingly, larger, wider tires don't always reduce "wander" but tires which run at a lower slip angle angle can improve tracking. The difference between 14 inch diameter wheels and 15's on the Gen 4 Camry is very evident. A strut bay does tighten things up, (and help to keep it that way on what passes for roads hereabouts. ) My experience with TRD is they know what they are doing, at least with Camrys.


So should I go for both the sway bars + wheels/tires?
 
Originally Posted By: smc733
Originally Posted By: HerrStig
Originally Posted By: sciphi
The rear sway bar will make the handling more neutral, while the front strut brace will make the steering feel more solid. They should make the car handle better during a turn. Combine that with a decent all-season, and the car's handling will be upgraded. It'll be more willing to stay planted going around corners.

That won't really help with getting blown around on the highway, as that's more aerodynamics than anything else.
You might make sure your toe in is set to the high end of the range, and if you can for benchmark purposes, find another car of the same year to test drive. Interestingly, larger, wider tires don't always reduce "wander" but tires which run at a lower slip angle angle can improve tracking. The difference between 14 inch diameter wheels and 15's on the Gen 4 Camry is very evident. A strut bar does tighten things up, (and help to keep it that way on what passes for roads hereabouts. ) My experience with TRD is they know what they are doing, at least with Camrys.


So should I go for both the sway bars + wheels/tires?
Do the wheels and tires first. You are looking for straight line stability, I think, not GoKart handling. Adding a rear bar (or a thicker rear bar) will reduce understeer, which is nice, but understeering cars tend to be less twitchy (one of the few good things about understeer) and you are trying to reduce that for stability. These things involve tradeoffs. obviously.
 
Toyotanation is here:
http://www.toyotanation.com/forum/322-10th-generation-2009-2013/

specific to your interest:
http://www.toyotanation.com/forum/324-10th-gen-suspension-brakes-wheel-forum/

While many (most?) owners mod for style, you will find info there focused on performance too...

You should find someone there to offer advice re: upsizing wheels/tires...there is a tradeoff when upsizing in terms of acceleration vs handling, not to mention initial cost vs mpg increase....as well as consideration you should give to brands/models of tires built for performance (rather than MPG)...

...someone there likely has taken that step and can share their experience....enjoy Toyotanation...
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

I
Chassis braces
2
Replies
32
Views
1K
inquirer
Hermann
Made a Performance Mod to my Hybrid Maverick
Replies
4
Views
1K
Hermann
C
Hellwig Rear Sway Bar
Replies
11
Views
927
Egg_Head
Finklejag
My 06 Acura TL is pretty much brand new now
2
Replies
32
Views
3K
Slow Car Sport Mode
Twisted1
Are my new struts leaking? *Pics inside*
Replies
12
Views
1K
The Critic
Back
Top