Questions to people who plow snow with a pickup.

[Popinski]

1. How much profit do you make after paying fuel, maintenance and wear and tear on the truck?

2. Big 3 or foreign brands? Why?

3. Do you prefer Diesel or Gas? Why?

4. Manual or Automatic? Why?

I've always wondered about this.

Bonus Question: What kind of oil and tranny fluid/oil?

Thanks.

 

[tomcat27]

I have two friends who own landscaping companies and one who has two trucks that he runs as a side business. I dont have exact financials - there's alot of variables.

One just bought a fleet of used Chevy's and Fords to beat on - lowering his costs. one runs new chevy's, and one runs an old chevy and a new tundra.

they all run automatics - the most abused part of the truck is the tranny. make sure it has a good cooler and change the fluid after each season.

are you charging by the visit or offering seasonal rates? commercial accounts or homeowners? one friend runs commercial accounts only - the other two run residential. I believe the first makes the most money - of course, he runs it as a full-service year-round company: mowing, planting, plowing.

In talking with a local mechanic, he has never had to repair an Aisin Warner (Toyota, some older Jeep models) tranny due to plowing. all other makes do not fare as well - but certainly not awful.

 

[renegade_987]

I dont plow, but I'll answer what I can anyways (I guess what I prefer)

1. No idea
2. Ford. Because I like Ford
3. Diesel. Because they sound cool. And something about the smell of burning diesel at 5 in the AM is appealing
4. Auto. Easy to drive

As you cal see, I have no desire to plow

 

[MNgopher]

Not currently plowing, but on the municipal side I have some experience:

1. Not doing it for profit, public service (think public buildings, parks, streets, etc...)

2. Ford Superduties. They've served us well over the years, so no need or desire to check on the others.

3. We usually run gas engines. We don't do a lot of trailer towing nor do we rack up a ton of miles - both where the diesel shines. Thus, we run gas. In the superduties, we run the 5.4 or the 6.8 V10. The 6.8 V10 preferred. The 5.4 will get the job done, but its slower and works much harder.

4. Auto, hands down. Less fatiguing over a long event. Regular fluid changes and heavy duty coolers are mandatory. The other trick - actually stop the truck before shifting gears - sounds simple, but with the amount of backing done, its easy to cheat (and its hard on the tranny!). Our street rigs (Mixed fleet of Sterling, Mack, and Internationals) are also Autos, believe it or not.

Oil is low bid meeting Ford Specifications.

 

[simple_gifts]

The town in which I live runs ford diesel with auto for 1 lane dead end roads like the one on which I live.

I have never seen a Tundra or Titan plowing in a municipal situation.

 

[MrHorspwer]

Plow trucks. I hate plow trucks. The most beat up, abused, ragged out trucks on earth... are plow trucks.

You're putting way too much thought into what a plow truck is. A plow truck is one thing: Cheap. You don't make money plowing snow if you go dump $40,000 into a new truck just for the purpose. Snow is never guaranteed. Income is never guaranteed. If you run a landscaping business, you buy new trucks for the summer and your old trucks, the throw-away ones, become your plows.

Plowing itself isn't all that hard of the truck. It's what's hiding under the snow that hurts. Manhole covers, curbs, and parking blocks are just sitting there, waiting to beat your plow and truck into submission when you put the blade down.

I did a bunch of fleet work for a large landscape company when I was at the dealership. Actually, they were one of only two or three fleets we serviced. I'll give you my experiences. Mind you, this is commercial, not municipal, work.

1. Here in the Detroit area, making money really depends on the weather. Snowfall from year to year varies greatly. If you're a landscape company, most of your crew is just kept on call and not working. If it snows, you call them in and pay most under the table. This keeps things economical. Some of the seasonal guys even run their own beater trucks. I have three friends who do seasonal plow work for local landscapers in their own trucks. This saves them the trouble of having to seek out the business themselves and puts a little extra cash in their pockets.

Trucks are maintained minimally. Like I said, you never buy a new truck for the express purpose of plowing. It's always the old ones. The more money you put into the truck, the less money you make working them. Repairs were always haphazard. Only the minimum to get them back up and on the road. This usually happened two days before the big storm with the owner calling every two hours to check if the work is finished.

2. I was in a GMC store, so it was domestic for me. Even so, domestics are the ways to go. 1/2 ton trucks are not meant for plowing. Period. Plow manufacturers may make plows for 1/2 ton trucks (HTP - Half Ton Plow), but they're not designed to be worked in a commercial setting. They're for a business owner who may already own a truck and wishes to plow his own lot instead of paying to have it done or maybe a guy who does a limited number of residential driveways. Factor the weight of the plow, plus a large salt spreader in the back... 3/4 ton or bigger.

3. Gas for two reasons. The first is cost. Diesels trucks are expensive. You don't buy an expensive diesel truck to tear it up plowing. Diesels also command a higher price in the used market, making it more economical to sell it outright rather than keep it for winter use. The second is use. It's not really much work to push snow around with a plow. The trans take a bunch of abuse, but really, the torque offered by a diesel isn't necessary.

The one real exception to this is a 4500 or larger truck, usually a dump with a big salt hopper in the back. A diesel helps there.

4. Auto.

Bonus: Whatever oil is cheap. Trans fluid? Who changes that?

My fleet guy once packed snow so hard up into the bumper area that he broke the fitting on the external trans cooler (of course he finished plowing and drove it all the way to the shop, peeing trans fluid the whole way). Even then, having the cost of the cooler, lines, and 6 quarts of fluid, he wouldn't pay me to drop the pan and change the filter too.

 

[eljefino]

My work had a 2000 dodge 3/4 ton ram truck for plowing its own 60 space parking lot. It was also a kingdom builder for my boss, who strutted about how we're a 24 hour operation and couldn't rely on outside contractors, and we needed a janitor/ plow driver and it was actually cheaper to do this in house, yadda yadda.

Stupid truck ate three transmissions in 60k miles. Boss of course took the truck home and plowed his own driveway, and just plain loved driving the truck around.

It did NOT have ABS and I made it SOP to stand on the brake with my left foot when shifting gears. I could still be moving, but the wheels were locked.

I actually cared where I put the snow; around here when you get a snow bank the next storm will intrude further on your parking area. I'd put the snow where, say, it wouldn't melt and run down hill and refreeze on the parking lot. Boss and his bum janitor put it wherever, whenever.

Many contractors here reluctantly do snow removal; it doesn't make a profit but it keeps the lights on and the guys slightly busy during an otherwise non-working season. It's also good networking for selling their summer services.

If you're serious about plowing get a 1-ton, even 3/4 are pretty pansy in the front end.

 

[dwcopple]

Originally Posted By: MrHorspwer


If you're a landscape company, most of your crew is just kept on call and not working. If it snows, you call them in and pay most under the table. This keeps things economical. Some of the seasonal guys even run their own beater trucks.
Yep, my neighbor works for an asphalt company, plows all winter with his own, barely maintained Chevy. It is a '96 half ton ext cab. He puts about $200 a year into plow or other repairs but he makes a buttload of cash when he is out plowing. Stacking that dough on top of his unemployment he is drawing makes for a Merry Christmas!

 

[NHHEMI]

Originally Posted By: Popinski
1. How much profit do you make after paying fuel, maintenance and wear and tear on the truck?

2. Big 3 or foreign brands? Why?

3. Do you prefer Diesel or Gas? Why?

4. Manual or Automatic? Why?

I've always wondered about this.

Bonus Question: What kind of oil and tranny fluid/oil?

Thanks.


I have plowed before but only for an employer( dealership parking lots ). My Brother plows however.

1 - Profit depends on the number of storms, how much you charge, and how many repairs you need to make. It can be very profitable or you can lose your shirt if the vehicle breaks down a lot. Even something as simple as a blown plow hose will cost you a $100+. Maintenance and repairs get expensive. The suspensions and drivetrain take a beating. The entire truck does actually. A truck that has been used to plow with takes a huge $$$ hit when trying to resell it.

2 - Big 3 only unless you are just doing small driveways and stuff. Only the Big 3 have true heavy duty 3/4 and 1 ton trucks that can take the abuse of major plowing. The new Tundra can take more than the Titan can but neither is up to the HD models of the Big 3 for plowing. Maybe someone will chime in and say get a Ridgeline, it can do it, it is a real truck too.

3 - Gas. While diesels have more torque which wiill help pushing the snow, and actually will get better MPG, they add a lot of weight to the front end. Even on HD trucks the weight of the diesel engine which is substantial, coupled with the weight of the plow, really takes it's toll on the front ends. You will be replacing ball joints, shocks, tie rods, u-joints, tires, etc... 2X's as often with a diesel truck. They do more work though. If the truck was ONLY used for plowing I guess I would consider the diesel. If the truck doubles as a work truck in the non winter months however to me gas is the way to go( if it can handle your work needs ).

4 - To me this is a no brainer = AT! I have plowed with both and trying to steer, shift as needed, and work the plow is just a PITB with a MT! You need 3 hands to do it at times. It can be done and I know some will say they prefer a MT but for me, if I am plowing with a truck, it would have an AT. It does require more maintenance( fluid and filter change yearly - period no questions asked )but just based on ease of function it is the only choice IMO.

Bonus = synthetic for sure.

 

[rjundi]

The person who does my driveway when I am away uses a early 90
s Jeep Cherokee(small one). He rebuilds junk Jeeps for offroad, resale and for fun. He charges 50% of what other guys want. However I a butt the nicest/richest neighborhood in town which always drives prices when a person shows up. Irrelevant to the fact I own a home worth about 1/3 in value of next cheapest in neighborhood.

Its a relatively large driveway. He also has a a worn out backhoe to push things driveways back for my other neighbors who use him exclusively. I snow blow normally but go away weekends and he'll do mine for a small charge.

I do not know anyone who does it as a sole profession around here. Its more filler work for landscaping, septic, and construction companies. They all use Big 3 pickups of some sort.

 

[AITG]

I've plowed snow for a large warehouse / shipping operation for over 20 years. Stuff I've learned:

1. If you aren't driving it, be sure that drivers know "you break it, YOU fix it". Abuse drops dramatically after a driver climbs under a wet/cold/drippy truck to repair preventable stupidity.

2. As others have said, the heavier the truck the better. Not just for durability, for traction. My last plow was a 1 ton dually with a V box salt spreader. It would move insane amounts of wet snow ... with Goodyear highway tread tires.

3. Narrow tires work best. Big wide tires may grip dry pavement, but narrow rubber works best on snow.

4. You can charge by the push, by the season, by the hour. Each winter one of those ways will pay well and one will be a big loser. You have no way of knowing this years' winner ... until next spring.

5. No matter how careful you are, plowing puts huge stresses on a truck. There is no way I would A.)buy a used plow, or B.) put a plow on a truck I needed for personal transportation.

JM2c, YMMV, etc.

 

[Slick17601]

My Dad and I plowed 2 large parking lots for years with a 1979 Jeep J10- with all season tires. That thing would push snow like you wouldn't believe. I will say there is NOTHING harder on a truck than plowing snow.

 

[RichR]

1. . Maybe someone will chime in and say get a Ridgeline, it can do it, it is a real truck too.

Just watch out for the dead horse carcass covered with snow.

 

[Mike98TJ]

I had a C30 Chevy 4x4 (1974) with a built 350 and a 400 trans that I used as a plow truck for about 6 years, sold it about 3 years ago...It is too seasonal and unpredictable to count on as steady income, but I made enough to buy other toys I might not have been able to without it.

People do not understand or appreciate the work, and the things that can and do happen (hidden obstructions, proximity of other vehicles and pedestrians, etc.) make it a very stressful kind of fun job. I had an automatic, and I agree that with a stick you'd have your hands full (literally) plowing a lot especially if it had lots of hazards. My truck was really a beater, but it ran well, and I took care of it-I had a 7 1/2 foot blade and it was a long bed so it was not great in tight spots, but I did jobs in over 3 feet of snow on a few occasions and it handled it easily. You should not use a small vehicle, unless it is for smaller, tighter spaces, and should have a good joystick setup-power angle, good lights, and a full tank help with moving snow too. Keep the blade on the ground when not in use to help the truck, those things are pretty heavy and take a toll on the front end if left up in the air. I removed the blade in warmer weather and used the truck for other projects, and miss having it when I do my own (and neighbors) driveways/roads now with a 26" snowblower, but it was not something I really thought I'd enjoy then-snow!

 

[Rick in PA]

I don't plow, but my brother did.

Not on list, but I'd add a tranny fluid temperature gauge. Overworked, overheated tranny: hot fluid. Main seal fails due to over-heating. Tranny fluid sprays out all over red-hot exhaust manifold, fluid bursts into flames, truck burns to a cinder. Happened to a buddy of my brother. Almost happened to my brother, but he put out the fire by catching it quickly and throwing snow on it.

 

[RichR]

Here you go NHHEMI.
http://www.ridgelineownersclub.com/forums/showpost.php?p=489808&postcount=1