Questionable mnx intervals for Toyota 2.4L 2AZ-FE

[guile]

I recently purchased a new 2005 Toyota Camry and was somewhat amazed at the lack of recommended maintenance for it (as prescribed in the provided Scheduled Maintenance Guide).

For example; the first recommended air filter change is at 30,000 miles/36 months. Now the manual does recommend inspection every 5K/6 months, ONLY if you "drive in desert or on dirt roads." I can't recall any manufacturers that didn't recommend an annual air filter change regardless of the conditions the vehicle is driven in.

Also, no recommended brake fluid changes. Though we now have long-life antifreeze, I don't believe we have long-life brake fluid, even if it's available no mention by Toyota that they use it. My 2001 Odyssey manual recommended brake fluid inspections/changes every 36K.

Toyota also doesn't recommend any transmission fluid changes, (automatic 5-speed).


I realize my thinking on this subject reflects conventional, and perhaps dated, thought. However, my concern is this ... I don't have a problem with longer recommended mnx intervals if the technology has improved to the point that longer intervals are now logical (example long-life antifreeze), but to the best of my knowledge none of the above mentioned mnx items have experienced significant advances in technology and thus don't support the longer recommended intervals.

 

[Mickey_M]

quote:

---

guile:

I recently purchased a new 2005 Toyota Camry and was somewhat amazed at the lack of recommended maintenance ....

For example; the first recommended air filter change is at 30,000 miles/36 months. .... I can't recall any manufacturers that didn't recommend an annual air filter change regardless of the conditions the vehicle is driven in. ....

---

When you see the size of the element and price it, you'll understand.

When you see what they want for Toyota Type IV ATF, you'll change your mind about drain intervals.

Here's the regime I adopted for my wife's 2002 Camry:

six months or 5,000 miles - Oil & Filter
six months, wiper blade refills
two years - flush brakes
20,000 miles - air filter
20,000 miles - cabin filter
30,000 miles / 3 years / Antifreeze
50,000 miles - ATF
60,000 miles - belts
80,000 spark plugs

 

[guile]

Originally posted by Mickey_M:

quote:

---

When you see the size of the element and price it, you'll understand.

---

To me the price of a replacement air filter seems quite reasonable, just priced a Purolator replacement air filter at Advance Auto Parts for $9.95. I realize an OEM Toyota replacement might be more, but doubtful it would too expensive as I also priced a K&N replacement air filter for $37.95 on a Toyota parts website ... typically an OEM will be priced between an OTC replacement like Purolator and a performance replacement like K&N.

I'm not trying to find fault in your statement ... just trying to consider all points. I could certainly understand a longer mnx interval recommendation if the technology was sufficiently advanced as to make the longer interval logical as well as cost efficient. However in this case I don't believe that to be true.

Without conducting extensive research into this topic, I feel the reason behind the longer mnx interval recommendations is simply to enhance the attractiveness of the car, i.e. fewer mnx requirements equals more cars sold. I'm certain the manufactures have considered this, as they also stand to make money by recommending shorter intervals, parts and service revenues would potentially increase. Other companies have adopted this strategy, e.g. Sears loves to sell mnx warranties with their appliances, adds to their bottom line/profit.

Putting aside the marketing discussion, I'm not certain I feel comfortable with Toyota's recommendations. Previous OEM mnx recommendations were typically to change brake fluid every 3 or so years, air filters annually, transmission fluid every 30K or so ... why does it make sense not to do the same now. As I stated previously the technology (in most cases) hasn't improved significantly.

 

[brianl703]

This is what Chevrolet recommends for the 2004 Malibu Classic for "severe" service:

Inspect the air cleaner/filter every 15,000 miles (25 000 km) and replace every 30,000 miles (50 000 km). If you are driving in dusty/dirty conditions, inspect the filter at each engine oil change.

50,000 Miles (83 000 km)
Change automatic transaxle fluid and filter if the vehicle is mainly driven under one or more of these conditions:
In heavy city traffic where the outside temperature regularly reaches 90°F (32°C) or higher.
In hilly or mountainous terrain.
When doing frequent trailer towing.
Uses such as found in taxi, police or delivery service.
If you do not use your vehicle under any of these conditions, the fluid and filter do not require changing.

100,000 Miles (166 000 km)
Inspect spark plug wires. An Emission Control Service.
Replace spark plugs. An Emission Control Service.
Change automatic transaxle fluid and filter if the vehicle is mainly driven under one or more of these conditions:
In heavy city traffic where the outside temperature regularly reaches 90°F (32°C) or higher.
In hilly or mountainous terrain.
When doing frequent trailer towing.
Uses such as found in taxi, police or delivery service.
If you do not use your vehicle any of these conditions, the fluid and filter do not require changing.

150,000 Miles (240 000 km)
Drain, flush and refill cooling system (or every 60 months since last service, whichever occurs first). See Engine Coolant for what to use. Inspect hoses. Clean radiator, condenser, pressure cap and neck. Pressure test the cooling system and pressure cap. An Emission Control Service.
Inspect engine accessory drive belt. An Emission Control Service.


Beyond this and tire rotations every 6K miles, and oil changes every 3K or 7.5K, there are no other scheduled services. Apparently the Ecotec engine does not have a PCV valve (it has some sort of orifice in the intake manifold which performs the same function) so that doesn't need to be replaced.

It does have a replaceable fuel filter, I wonder why they think it never needs to be replaced?

 

[The Critic]

guile,
My 96 Saturn never recommended a brake fluid change, nor did it recommend an annual air filter change. No Toyota, Honda, or Saturn that I can remember required an annual air filter change, they simply required for it to be checked periodically.

Take this: GM doesn't have a service interval for air filters any more, they simply tell owners to check it at every oil change and replace it as needed.

The cost of the air cleaner element is $20 give or take, so take that into consideration. The OEM ones are a felt-like material, and work quite well for the 3-yr/30K service intervals suggested by Toyota. I've had no problems with the seal or material in the Toyotas that I've used it in.

The Toyota T-IV ATF is considered lifetime fill in the Lexus ES series. Contrary to popular belief, the lifetime Volvo ATF is actually Toyota T-IV, since the Volvo units are Aisin-Warner transmissions. Most ATFs can be considered a lifetime fill, as GM considers DexIII lifetime fill in the SRX and STS transissions.

Now, the Toyota 5-speed Automatic has a drain plug on the pan, and only takes 4 quarts for a drain and refill. The Fluid is only $4-$5/qt at most dealers, so for $20 I don't see why you should not drain/refill every 15K as inexpensive insurance.

Hope this helps,
Michael

 

[Mickey_M]

quote:

---

guile:

.... To me the price of a replacement air filter seems quite reasonable, just priced a Purolator replacement air filter at Advance Auto Parts for $9.95. I realize an OEM Toyota replacement might be more .....

---

Based on my own cost/performance considerations, I went with 20,000 as the change interval.

The Toyota T-IV (same as ExxonMobil's 3309 ATF:

http://www.mobil.com/USA-English/Lubes/PDS/NAUSENPVLMOMobil_ATF_3309.asp

is a synthetic blend with a goodly dose of antioxidants. It should last quite some time, but I'm planning on dumping it at 50,000 to keep the particulates down.


.

 

[Matt_S]

My car (a 2000 Monte Carlo) has similar air filter and brake fluid maintenance. The air filter is 30k normally or 15k for dusty, dirty environments. There is no mention of brake fluid changes. My transmission fluid is supposed to be good for 50k severe, 100k normal. Lifetime fill is getting more common these days. Like you, I don't trust that. I've found that the air filter will usually last 30k, though.