PureONE Flow vs. PSID Data from Purolator
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Originally Posted By: Jim Allen
And what is the bypass setting on that filter?
The main reason I emailed Purolator and asked them for this data (explained in detail in the first post) was to ensure the filter bypass valve built into the engine (opens around 8 PSI I believe for a Chevy small block LS6 application) did not go into bypass mode at high RPM with hot oil. As you can see, it doesn't as this PureONE only produces 5 PSID with 12 GPM of hot oil flow.
And what is the bypass setting on that filter?
The main reason I emailed Purolator and asked them for this data (explained in detail in the first post) was to ensure the filter bypass valve built into the engine (opens around 8 PSI I believe for a Chevy small block LS6 application) did not go into bypass mode at high RPM with hot oil. As you can see, it doesn't as this PureONE only produces 5 PSID with 12 GPM of hot oil flow.
Originally Posted By: river_rat
Originally Posted By: Jim Allen
And what is the bypass setting on that filter?
PL14006 has no bypass valve.
Most PL's run 12-15 psi, if they have one.
There may bo a bypass valve in the block at the oil filter adapter.
Originally Posted By: Jim Allen
And what is the bypass setting on that filter?
PL14006 has no bypass valve.
Most PL's run 12-15 psi, if they have one.
There may bo a bypass valve in the block at the oil filter adapter.
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Originally Posted By: SuperBusa
Originally Posted By: river_rat
12 GPM seems high to me, too, like racing.
Most big hi-performance V8s (ie, LS6, LS3, LS7 Vette engines) will be putting out 10 ~ 12 GPM at redline.
As well as 170hp four cylinder Subaru's
Originally Posted By: river_rat
12 GPM seems high to me, too, like racing.
Most big hi-performance V8s (ie, LS6, LS3, LS7 Vette engines) will be putting out 10 ~ 12 GPM at redline.
As well as 170hp four cylinder Subaru's
Originally Posted By: LoneRanger
Originally Posted By: SuperBusa
Originally Posted By: river_rat
12 GPM seems high to me, too, like racing.
Most big hi-performance V8s (ie, LS6, LS3, LS7 Vette engines) will be putting out 10 ~ 12 GPM at redline.
As well as 170hp four cylinder Subaru's
Yes ... can't forget those high volume oil pumped Subies.
Originally Posted By: SuperBusa
Originally Posted By: river_rat
12 GPM seems high to me, too, like racing.
Most big hi-performance V8s (ie, LS6, LS3, LS7 Vette engines) will be putting out 10 ~ 12 GPM at redline.
As well as 170hp four cylinder Subaru's
Yes ... can't forget those high volume oil pumped Subies.
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So Busa, do you think this info you found out means a Purolator Pure One can work okay on Subie's with their 12gpm (@ 5000rpm) system?
Originally Posted By: LoneRanger
So Busa, do you think this info you found out means a Purolator Pure One can work okay on Subie's with their 12gpm (@ 5000rpm) system?
Good question. My initial response is "Yes" since the PureONEs that have a bypass valve in the filter are usually set to 14 ~ 16 psi.
The test data from Purolator was for the PL14006. As you can see from the test data graph, Purolator tested the filter up to 18 GPM where it developed ~9 PSID. At 12 GPM it developed ~5 PSID ... well below 14~16 if this one had a built in bypass valve.
First thing I would do is compare the physical size of the PL14006 to the physical size of the PureONE for the Subaru in question. The PL14006 is an average sized filter, so if the filter for the Subaru is similar in size I'd day you are plenty safe from going into bypass mode with hot oil at high flow.
http://www.purolatorautofilters.net/resources/Popup/Pages/PartDetailPopup.aspx?partnum=PL14006
So Busa, do you think this info you found out means a Purolator Pure One can work okay on Subie's with their 12gpm (@ 5000rpm) system?
Good question. My initial response is "Yes" since the PureONEs that have a bypass valve in the filter are usually set to 14 ~ 16 psi.
The test data from Purolator was for the PL14006. As you can see from the test data graph, Purolator tested the filter up to 18 GPM where it developed ~9 PSID. At 12 GPM it developed ~5 PSID ... well below 14~16 if this one had a built in bypass valve.
First thing I would do is compare the physical size of the PL14006 to the physical size of the PureONE for the Subaru in question. The PL14006 is an average sized filter, so if the filter for the Subaru is similar in size I'd day you are plenty safe from going into bypass mode with hot oil at high flow.
http://www.purolatorautofilters.net/resources/Popup/Pages/PartDetailPopup.aspx?partnum=PL14006
So for those of us who's heads are now aching... Are the PureOnes restrictive or not?
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If your filter is restrictive, it probably has nothing to do with the filter. Filters, by themselves, are very restrictive to flow. Filters with a solid wall of oil behind them ..trying to cram its way through an EXTREMELY restrictive engine ..are hardly a virtual speed bump.
Originally Posted By: Gary Allan
Filters, by themselves, are very restrictive to flow. Filters with a solid wall of oil behind them ..trying to cram its way through an EXTREMELY restrictive engine ..are hardly a virtual speed bump.
Not sure what you really mean by the statement in red above ... but a filter is really not very restrictive to flow unless it's almost clogged up with debris.
As the test data shows from Purolator (see graph a few posts above), the filter produced ~5 PSID with ~12 GPM of hot oil flowing through it.
Other 'Flow vs. PSID' data given my ACDelco (links someplace in this thread) show that most filters will produce the same PSID with hot oil within +/- a few PSID of each other. Seems there is a much larger spread of PSID between different filters when the cold oil data is plotted for the same group of filters.
It is true the engine's oiling circuit is about 15 times more flow restrictive than the oil filter ... but when you look at the filter by itself (out of the system), it is not very flow restrictive.
Originally Posted By: skunkstevens1
So for those of us who's heads are now aching... Are the PureOnes restrictive or not?
The PureONE is about as free flowing as filters get from the data I've seen so far.
Filters, by themselves, are very restrictive to flow. Filters with a solid wall of oil behind them ..trying to cram its way through an EXTREMELY restrictive engine ..are hardly a virtual speed bump.
Not sure what you really mean by the statement in red above ... but a filter is really not very restrictive to flow unless it's almost clogged up with debris.
As the test data shows from Purolator (see graph a few posts above), the filter produced ~5 PSID with ~12 GPM of hot oil flowing through it.
Other 'Flow vs. PSID' data given my ACDelco (links someplace in this thread) show that most filters will produce the same PSID with hot oil within +/- a few PSID of each other. Seems there is a much larger spread of PSID between different filters when the cold oil data is plotted for the same group of filters.
It is true the engine's oiling circuit is about 15 times more flow restrictive than the oil filter ... but when you look at the filter by itself (out of the system), it is not very flow restrictive.
Originally Posted By: skunkstevens1
So for those of us who's heads are now aching... Are the PureOnes restrictive or not?
The PureONE is about as free flowing as filters get from the data I've seen so far.
SuperBusa, who did you contact to get this information? I'd like to find out if the PL14610 filter will stay out of bypass with the 22gpm pump that comes standard on the 2.5L turbo STi motors from Subaru.
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I thought it was 15gpm ..and how often and for how long can you possibly be at that level of output?
Subaru makes pumps with rotors from 7mm (14gpm) to 12mm (22gpm). The 15gpm would represent a non-active-valve-timing turbo model with 9mm rotor pump.
As far as how often? Depends on the driver and usage. For me, the car sees redline many, many, many times a day in normal usage, plus will see sustained 80-100% of redline for a couple of hours without a break on race days.
As far as how often? Depends on the driver and usage. For me, the car sees redline many, many, many times a day in normal usage, plus will see sustained 80-100% of redline for a couple of hours without a break on race days.
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Quote:
As far as how often? For me, the car sees redline many, many, many times a day in normal usage, plus will see sustained 80-100% of redline for a couple of hours without a break on race days.
Naturally. I'd imagine trips to the Bonneville salt flats are routine for some. Races back and forth across Death Valley @ WOT.
That's more than a Cummins diesel and close to a Power Stroke. The Power Stroke having a 1.5" thread and 30 gpm potential on the filter.
At that flow rate through such a small filter it's one of the few times that the filter itself can present significant resistance in the circuit.
The bypass valve is slightly under rated for the OEM, iirc, which I think is 23.
No loss of oil flow will occur as long as pressures remains below the oil pump's relief limit. There will be some loss in filtration if the bypass opens. One should not assume that it will @ the 22gal flow rate ..or you may
The filter isn't going to react the same way new as it will when saturated. The newer the filter the less likely it is to occur and the PSID @ 22gpm will be lower.
There are longer 20M filters out there with slightly bigger diameters (same gasket) but unfortunately they don't x'ref to PURO nor Wix ..nor do they have bypass valves. They do have 20+ PSID tolerance, but that probably would not be wise.
http://www.filtermart.com/fpdbdb/fmclist.asp?fmartno=25-0415
https://dynamic.donaldson.com/webc/WebStore/search/item_detail.html?item=138949&kiosk=false
As far as how often? For me, the car sees redline many, many, many times a day in normal usage, plus will see sustained 80-100% of redline for a couple of hours without a break on race days.
Naturally. I'd imagine trips to the Bonneville salt flats are routine for some. Races back and forth across Death Valley @ WOT.
That's more than a Cummins diesel and close to a Power Stroke. The Power Stroke having a 1.5" thread and 30 gpm potential on the filter.
At that flow rate through such a small filter it's one of the few times that the filter itself can present significant resistance in the circuit.
The bypass valve is slightly under rated for the OEM, iirc, which I think is 23.
No loss of oil flow will occur as long as pressures remains below the oil pump's relief limit. There will be some loss in filtration if the bypass opens. One should not assume that it will @ the 22gal flow rate ..or you may
There are longer 20M filters out there with slightly bigger diameters (same gasket) but unfortunately they don't x'ref to PURO nor Wix ..nor do they have bypass valves. They do have 20+ PSID tolerance, but that probably would not be wise.
http://www.filtermart.com/fpdbdb/fmclist.asp?fmartno=25-0415
https://dynamic.donaldson.com/webc/WebStore/search/item_detail.html?item=138949&kiosk=false
This filter is not a 20 Micron filter. 99%@40um
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