Been having suspected oil pressure/flow issues recently: noisy valvetrain hot high RPM and cold. Was blaming the oil. So I cut open a NAPA PRO-S 21394 (toyota) I had used in the past from my used stash(the filter I am currently running). I cant find a proper bypass valve! Only a tall, loose fitting nitrile rubber grommet. The media assy and steel end caps look good, as does the assy coil spring. It appears the unit bypasses by the grommet under high PSID but there is not a good seal to the can and can leak by the top of the media cartridge assy. The filter will be coming off and my standby WIX 51396 will be on there tomorrow (if the parts store is open!). Anybody else cut one open or use the pro select?
Problem With NAPA Pro-Select Oil Filter
- Thread starter ARCOgraphite
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I have a bunch of of 1394 Proselects that I run on my 2200 Toyota. I have never had a problem.
Oh, good. I was worried that a leaky ADBV assy that allows oil to bypass the filter most of the time was an actual problem in an oil filter. Whew!
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I will try to get some pics up - but I cant "show" the fit/leak issue of the ADBV grommet on the filter media assy outlet I mentioned above.
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I will try to get some pics up - but I cant "show" the fit/leak issue of the ADBV grommet on the filter media assy outlet I mentioned above.
JHZR2
Staff member
It amazes me that you have more problems with most everything than anyone else
Pictures of what you are talking about would be great for us all to see and learn from.
Pictures of what you are talking about would be great for us all to see and learn from.
Originally Posted By: JHZR2
It amazes me that you have more problems with most everything than anyone else
+1
It amazes me that you have more problems with most everything than anyone else
+1
Compare these to yours and you might even notice a similar comment by you on one of the threads.
My bet, if the filter specs for a bypass, it's got one. Can't say whether it's "proper" or not but it's got one. It does appear that some of the PS may be different construction depending on where made. It also appears that some do now use the Champ-like combo valve.
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/napa-pro-select-21334-cut-open.136950/
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/napa-pro-select-21348-cut-open-as-promised.135427/
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/napa-proselect-21356-picture.109573/
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/new-napa-proselect-21356.130539/
My bet, if the filter specs for a bypass, it's got one. Can't say whether it's "proper" or not but it's got one. It does appear that some of the PS may be different construction depending on where made. It also appears that some do now use the Champ-like combo valve.
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/napa-pro-select-21334-cut-open.136950/
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/napa-pro-select-21348-cut-open-as-promised.135427/
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/napa-proselect-21356-picture.109573/
https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/new-napa-proselect-21356.130539/
Originally Posted By: JHZR2
It amazes me that you have more problems with most everything than anyone else
Ha! That sounds like a friend of mine he has problems with things that nobody else has problems with.
It amazes me that you have more problems with most everything than anyone else
Ha! That sounds like a friend of mine he has problems with things that nobody else has problems with.
Originally Posted By: sayjac
Compare these to yours and you might even notice a similar comment by you on one of the threads.
My bet, if the filter specs for a bypass, it's got one. Can't say whether it's "proper" or not but it's got one. It does appear that some of the PS may be different construction depending on where made. It also appears that some do now use the Champ-like combo valve.
I don't like "Combo Valves" ... give me a good old fashioned spring loaded bypass valve !
Compare these to yours and you might even notice a similar comment by you on one of the threads.
My bet, if the filter specs for a bypass, it's got one. Can't say whether it's "proper" or not but it's got one. It does appear that some of the PS may be different construction depending on where made. It also appears that some do now use the Champ-like combo valve.
I don't like "Combo Valves" ... give me a good old fashioned spring loaded bypass valve !
Here is the 21394 that I cut up awhile ago.. To me it is a high quality/low priced filter. Mine say Afina Gastonia NC (wix) however I'm not sure they are outsourced or not. Anyway, it has the Wix front end bypass on it, and a Parker adbv. I have no problem running these.
Those pictured above are Wix classic design with metal thread end bypass. Some applications are now using a nitrile combo valve design. Likely what the OP calls a "rubber grommet."
The pics below are from a 3 year old thread, and it does appear NPS are now using the combo valve on more applications than on the original release.
Now as to whether the combo valve actually caused the OP's "noisey valvetrain" is another matter altogether. Seeing as the OP has a history of startup noise and VVI cam phase issues when using other filters like the Fram XG, and grenading two engines on the first day of ownership in the past 3 years, might lead one to have just tad of doubt.
Now as to whether the combo valve actually caused the OP's "noisey valvetrain" is another matter altogether. Seeing as the OP has a history of startup noise and VVI cam phase issues when using other filters like the Fram XG, and grenading two engines on the first day of ownership in the past 3 years, might lead one to have just tad of doubt.
Originally Posted By: ARCOgraphite
Been having suspected oil pressure/flow issues recently: noisy valvetrain hot high RPM and cold. Was blaming the oil. So I cut open a NAPA PRO-S 21394 (toyota) I had used in the past from my used stash(the filter I am currently running). I cant find a proper bypass valve! Only a tall, loose fitting nitrile rubber grommet. The media assy and steel end caps look good, as does the assy coil spring. It appears the unit bypasses by the grommet under high PSID but there is not a good seal to the can and can leak by the top of the media cartridge assy. The filter will be coming off and my standby WIX 51396 will be on there tomorrow (if the parts store is open!). Anybody else cut one open or use the pro select?
Back in 09 when the local Napa's were having a buy 1 get one free with the ProSelects I got 2 for my 2008 3.4L Equinox. Instant cold start rattle and clang. Both filters. Swapped back to the AC line and it stopped( same oil ). My Sister and Brother in law got some for their vehices( same filters on both )and they worked ok with no noise issues.
I didn't cut the filters off my vehicle open I just decided to not use them after that. I used cheaper filters( ProSelect, Purolator, AC )on the Equinox and the only ones that had noise issues were the Napa ones.
Been having suspected oil pressure/flow issues recently: noisy valvetrain hot high RPM and cold. Was blaming the oil. So I cut open a NAPA PRO-S 21394 (toyota) I had used in the past from my used stash(the filter I am currently running). I cant find a proper bypass valve! Only a tall, loose fitting nitrile rubber grommet. The media assy and steel end caps look good, as does the assy coil spring. It appears the unit bypasses by the grommet under high PSID but there is not a good seal to the can and can leak by the top of the media cartridge assy. The filter will be coming off and my standby WIX 51396 will be on there tomorrow (if the parts store is open!). Anybody else cut one open or use the pro select?
Back in 09 when the local Napa's were having a buy 1 get one free with the ProSelects I got 2 for my 2008 3.4L Equinox. Instant cold start rattle and clang. Both filters. Swapped back to the AC line and it stopped( same oil ). My Sister and Brother in law got some for their vehices( same filters on both )and they worked ok with no noise issues.
I didn't cut the filters off my vehicle open I just decided to not use them after that. I used cheaper filters( ProSelect, Purolator, AC )on the Equinox and the only ones that had noise issues were the Napa ones.
Sayjac's photo is accurate to my filter. The "combo valve" does NOT seal tight on top of the assy around the perimeter of the annulus, and oil can get by at anytime bypassing the filter. The Nitrile is very stiff and gummy. No wix stores open today, and we have a heavy freezing rain storm so bad time to change out filter/oil. With all these oiling problem I will assume my car has a bad oil pump or weak internal bypass spring - and it may be by yamaha design for improved economy. Thanks to those with helpfull and professional replies.
Here is the photo of the Pro-S I removed in spring of 09. I noticed no running problems with it, even though the rubber ADBV "combo valve" does not seal onto the media endcap. When I get the current unit off, I post pics of THAT. Know that I am a big wix fan and I dont like what I see here - though I have never seen a "WIX" labeled unit built this way.
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No to belabor the point, but how is the combo valve not sealing to the endcap, any different than the Wix metal bypass not sealing? Both just rest on the endcap at the thread end and are held in place by the assembly coil spring. If anything given that set up, nitrile on the metal ledge in the centertube/endcap would seem to seal at least as well as the metal on metal of the classic design.
Not a huge fan of the nitrile combo valve design, but when compared to the Wix classic metal bypass I don't see "sealing" with the endcap as being an issue.
Not a huge fan of the nitrile combo valve design, but when compared to the Wix classic metal bypass I don't see "sealing" with the endcap as being an issue.
Wow. I've never seen that style of valve. I bought a case of those 21394 (as I pictured) so I', assuming that mine are all the wix style.
Hard to explain. There exist no 360 deg. seal around the media endcap oriface - there is a short "nipple" molded into the nitrile that fits into the endcap orifice exit, but it does not provide any seal as its OD clears the endcap exit diameter - its not an interference fit, but a very sloppy fit. You can see the rectangular "lugs" and ports of the molded nitrile "bushing" that are arrayed 360 deg around the endcap exit thru hole and these allow oil to bypass the filter. Maybe This example "shrank" whilst sitting in my used filter collection and the fit was actually intended to be an interference fit? I dont have the problematic unit off my car as yet, and dont know the quality of the fit on that unit.
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Since the one filter was removed in the spring of 09,I think that it is very possible that the bushing has shrunk and the fit is not what is was.
It would seem that the way the valve works is that the inside seal of the valve is pushed open by excessive pressure and that allows unfiltered oil to enter what is technically the outlet of the filter and then into the engine.
It seems to be similar to the way that the ST/E-Core filters bypass works,it is us just a different way of doing it.
It would seem that the way the valve works is that the inside seal of the valve is pushed open by excessive pressure and that allows unfiltered oil to enter what is technically the outlet of the filter and then into the engine.
It seems to be similar to the way that the ST/E-Core filters bypass works,it is us just a different way of doing it.
That was my thread with the pics of the combo valve thingy. At first, I thought it was a crummy design, but after having looked at it thoroughly, it seals tight and I had no noise issues with a 5,000 mile interval. I'd use one again, especially considering you can get them for 99 cents on occasion.
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