Preparing for a 24 filter test! Help!

[texel]

Well after going through all 57 pages in this forum... I must say, you guys know your stuff! I learned quite alot! Thank you!


Anyways, I have always wanted to set aside some time and money to do a oil filter compairison like some of you have done. I am almost ready to start digging into these filters I have been gathering. Before I start getting into it I thought I would post up and ask the pros (you guys) for some pointers/tips/ideas for this review.

We are dealing with a little 1.6L, DHOC, motor, General oil pressure in this engine is about 45-65PSI.

So now you know what im working with... What kind of tests should I do on the filters? What should I look for? Anything special that I shoul note while taking these appart? I plan on cutting these apart with a dremel... any suggestions? Should I try a different method?

Here is the list of things I have decided to do thus far:

Cost:
Part Number:
Cartridge Length/Width:
Pleates:
Media Type:
Media Size:
Surface Area:
Case Thickness:
Gasket Type:
Anti-Drain Back Valve:
Weight:


Anyways, I am planning on testing with a total of 24 filters (I have found a total of 28 manufactured for this engine)

Here is what I have so far:
(7 more are being shipped right now)

Anyways, any suggestions? Comments? Ideas before I start tearing into these bad boys? Anything is welcome, I have never done this before!


/edit

I am going to be testing:

FramXG, FramTG, Defense, Pennzoil, CarQuest(red), CarQuest(blue), Pure|PremiumPlus, Pure|PureOne, Mobile1, STP, K&N, WIX, TRD(USA), ToytaOEM(USA), Denso, Nippon(ToyotaOEM(Japan), Amsoil, NAPA|Gold, NAPA|Silver, Bosch(USA), Beck/Arnley, Hastings, ACDELCO, SuperTech.

I would like to get but cannot find; Valvoline, QuakerState, Penske, Castrol.

[ January 04, 2005, 01:46 AM: Message edited by: texel ]

 

[OdinsRageSS]

what kinda car is this?

 

[sxg6]

i can not offer any suggestions, but i really appreciate you doing this test and cant wait for the results

 

[Brian Barnhart]

The best thing one could do would be to run actual tests on filters for comparison. I’ve sawed open about 20 filters, and apart from general things like construction features and assembly care, I’ve come to the conclusion that there isn’t a great deal one can learn from the practice. I just don’t think an oil filter’s capacity, filtering ability, flow performance, ADBV sealing, bypass flow/sealing, or burst strength can be measured or effectively judged by sawing open a filter.

That being said, I do place limited value on filter disassembly. I view construction materials and design as the most important, followed by ADBV material and fit. If the filter has a bypass valve, I also consider the design and materials of it to be important. I view other casual measurements like Cartridge Length/Width, Pleats, Media Size, Surface Area, Case Thickness, and Weight as essentially meaningless.

If nothing else, cutting open filters can educate one on how filters are built and how they work. Short of being severely restricted or plugged, about the only way an oil filter can cause engine damage is by releasing the filter media into the oil passages or bursting. Leaking ADBVs, bypass valves, and media tears are undesirable, but will probably go unnoticed and do no damage.

 

[texel]

quote:

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Originally posted by OdinsRageSS:
what kinda car is this?

---

This engine came in a bunch of different cars, MK1 MR2s, tons of Corollas, a few Chevrolets.
(Engine code 4A-GE)

 

[texel]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Brian Barnhart:

/snip

---

You are correct to some extent... I do agree like with anything, you cant tell 100% how its going to act when applyed to whatever use. This still doesnt meen ones theorys of filter design wont hold water unless applyed.

I also havent really geared this test to be as deep or involved as, say Bobs pressure test is. I have set this up to factor in Costs/ManufactureI.D./Avaiability, things of that nature.

But the biggest thing for me is cost, I would LOVE to do what Bob did, the acutal pressure testing of the filters but realisticly I dont care to invest that much of my money into the project, I already have over $100 invested in things, eather way I am going to get no use out of!


Lastly, I strongly belive this test is going to be very different when compaired to everyone elses, look at the filter studys that have been done to date. Notice one common factor with all of them? They are all for BIG engines! Big displacment, low pressure, BIG filters. These filters belong on a small, high pressure, HIGH revving (9k), small filter engine, the demands of this engine are totally different. Many people run full synth. in these engines, more so then the people with the bigblock, HEMIs and such. (at least im under that impression)


Lastly, I hope to bring a few new brands to the table, I dont think anywhere anyone has taken the ToyotaOEM(usa), ToyotaOEM(Japan), TRD(usa) or a denso filter!

 

[AstroVic]

First, I appreciate your efforts! Thank you!

Second, I personally don't care too much about pleat counts, etc. I just like to see the photographs. Like they say, a picture is worth a thousand words. It's no different with oil filters. You can separate the CHAMPS from the CHUMPS pretty quickly with good photographs.

 

[3000GT VR-4]

quote:

---

Originally posted by texel:

Lastly, I strongly belive this test is going to be very different when compaired to everyone elses, look at the filter studys that have been done to date. Notice one common factor with all of them? They are all for BIG engines! Big displacment, low pressure, BIG filters. These filters belong on a small, high pressure, HIGH revving (9k), small filter engine, the demands of this engine are totally different. Many people run full synth. in these engines, more so then the people with the bigblock, HEMIs and such. (at least im under that impression)


Lastly, I hope to bring a few new brands to the table, I dont think anywhere anyone has taken the ToyotaOEM(usa), ToyotaOEM(Japan), TRD(usa) or a denso filter!

---

Here are links to a few studies for some smaller and/or Toyota/Nissan/Mazda/Honda filters:

http://www.bergware.net/tmbwww/oilfilter89honda.html

http://elabfcsvrt.fdu.edu/oil/Oil_Filter_Specs.xls

http://motorcycleinfo.calsci.com/FilterStudy.html


Thanks for your efforts. I look forward to seeing the results.

 

[texel]

quote:

---

Originally posted by AstroVic:
First, I appreciate your efforts! Thank you!

Second, I personally don't care too much about pleat counts, etc. I just like to see the photographs. Like they say, a picture is worth a thousand words. It's no different with oil filters. You can separate the CHAMPS from the CHUMPS pretty quickly with good photographs.

---

The layout will be 3 pictures, whole filter, picture of the inlets/gasket etc. and one of the filter disassmbled. Per individual filter.

 

[1kickbuttranger]

I think it is a good idea for you to cut open as many filters for your application as you can (within reason). That way you can see differences and pros and cons of each.

If you notice 2 of the main filter studies on here that come around quite often are both for GM engines, and those filters don't have bypass valves in them.

Also a good point some folks bring up is that some smaller filters have more filtering area than one that are bigger. A case in point is Wix. The ones that require a bypass, may have a much reduced filter area because they shorten the pleats to fit the flying saucer in there and still keep the canister the same length, where filters that use other styles of bypasses don't require as much room so they use a longer 'cartridge'.

So cut them open and decide which one is best for your needs and please post pics!

 

[T-Keith]

Yes it's always a good idea to have more filter studies. That's why I did My filter study. Most studies at the time were for non-GM applications, which meant a lot of worrying over bypasses, which didn't matter to me. One thing I noticed with your filter is that they are for several different applications which means you have a quite unique application.

Good luck,
-T

 

[Audioquest]

I would really like to know how good (bad) that Defense filter is. It is priced lower than the regular Frams - how do you cut quality on an already crappy product?????

 

[jsharp]

quote:

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Originally posted by Audioquest:
I would really like to know how good (bad) that Defense filter is. It is priced lower than the regular Frams - how do you cut quality on an already crappy product?????

---

Use 1/2 the amount of already skimpy media and make the cardboard 1/2 as thick? A thinner ( is that possible? ) case? Cheaper paint?

 

[Mickey_M]

quote:

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Originally posted by texel:
.... Anyways, I have always wanted to set aside some time and money to do a oil filter compairison like some of you have done. I am almost ready to start digging into these filters I have been gathering. Before I start getting into it I thought I would post up and ask the pros (you guys) for some pointers/tips/ideas for this review. ....

---

Good luck.

There has been a long debate in the industry on how to evaluate oil filters.

Most of the amateur comparisons involve disassembly, and that can provide some good information.

But once you elminate poorly constructed filters, there are three measures of interest:

- Flow - is the filter extremely restrictive or relatively free-flowing?

- Capacity - how much dirt can it capture before it bypasses and ceases to filter?

- Efficiency - how small a particular can it capture?

The basic SAE test involves a test fixture, a standard oil, and AC Fine Dust. This stuff contains a known quantity of different sized particles. In simplified terms it is added to the oil, the test fixture started, and the test runs until the filter bypasses. At that point you can measure both the amount of dust left in the oil, which tells you the capacity of the filter, and the make-up in size of the particles, which tells you about efficiency.

The problem is that this is not how the filters are used in vehicles, which involve different speeds, temperatures, and other conditions.

Some manufacturers stress flow, which is very important to high-performance engines, while others emphasize efficiency or capacity, which in some conditions in some vehicles can provide better results when oil is analyzed in actual use.

If you could remove the filter media itself and come up with some way to evaluate it, that might be interesting. Not as a suggestion but as an example, if you took a quart each of the very same oil for each filter, and added to it a fixed quantity of a known particulate, and rigged it to pour through a fixed area of the filter media (such as a 2" circle), you could find out something about how the media itself differed.

This information, BTW, is available to the manufacturers. Someone like Champion can take a basic filter design and, by selecting the media characteristics, emphasize flow, efficiency, or capacity. That's why an AC, a Mobil 1, and a K&N don't perform the same way even though the basic designs are the same.