"Premium" vs. "Regular" Gas??

Status
Not open for further replies.
Joined
Aug 10, 2003
Messages
2,569
Location
College Dorm...
Here are some statements regarding premium (93 or so octane) vs. regular gasoline (87 or so) in HIGHWAY USE...

On an average vehicle, premium gas gets about 10% better fuel economy compared to the same vehicle running on regular gas.
Running Premium, the engine will burn cleaner.
Running Premium, the engine will burn cooler.
Running Premium, the engine will have greater power.

Now, shoot some holes in these statements...
grin.gif
 
quote:

On an average vehicle, premium gas gets about 10% better fuel economy compared to the same vehicle running on regular gas.

It depends.....My 4Runner betters that. If it's got a knock sensor and runs retarded on regular, then premium will improve mileage. Some of the new high density premiums down under do better even than that.

quote:

Running Premium, the engine will burn cleaner.

Should have no change. Some octane improving additives may lead to more deposits.

quote:

Running Premium, the engine will burn cooler.

Nope. Energy content and flame speed are about the same.

quote:

Running Premium, the engine will have greater power.

Depends, as per the first answer, if it's running retarded, then premium will boost power. Otherwise, no difference.
 
Doesn't it depend on the vehicle? If you have an older model that isn't computer controled then the timing can't be adjusted per the octane used and so your just wasting money. Right?

I was also under the impression that higher octane burns slower, so in a low compression engine that means carbon build up due to low flame speed, which in turn leads to less energy and lower mpg.

Don't ask me why but my father-in-law and I did a little test. On our trip to Fl. a 9 hour drive we filled up his 98 Eldorado with the NorthStar engine, which requires premium, with regular gas. When we stopped for gas after one tankfull ran through the engine we averaged 27 mpg, filled up with premium, same brand of gas, ran that tank the second leg of the trip, same speed, same driving style the works, when we filled up we lost 2mpg. Didn't make sense and to this day he will not run premium in it. I know it is not a good thing but try to tell that to a 79 year old who is set in his ways.

I run what ever my manual calls for. Don't see the need to spend the extra cash on something that I don't see a benefit using in a stock non highperformance vehicle. Now in my 65 Impala that has close to 11:1 compression then the higher octane works well and it runs better. Plus I think that back in the day with leaded gas the octane was a little higher then anyway, correct?

Now like in his vehicle you would think that running premium the mpg would go up because the computer can advance the timming as far as possible and with highway driving the higher advanced timing the better economy, at least that is my understanding. Just don't see why we got less mileage.
pat.gif
 
With the premium, the engine might be running aat maximum power, but it may comsume more fuel. With the regular, it may be on some sort of "economy" program within the computer, thereby giving the better mileage results. Just speculation...
dunno.gif
 
Depends on the engine and PCM calibration. My PCM is calibrated for 87 octane gas. Running higher than 87 octane will do nothing for me except cost more money. Regular vs Premium only refers to octane, not quality.

Octane only refers to it's resistance to preignition, allowing more timing and/or compression. If the engine and/or PCM are not designed/calibrated for it, you are just wasting money.
 
I thought there was a slightly higher BTU content in 87 than in 93? Assuming this is true, that would certainly account for why you might get better mileage on 87 on the highway.

In the case of the Caddy, running at a light load steady speed condition, 87 octane is just fine. When accelerating constantly like you do driving around time, if running 87 it could cost you mileage. My reasoning is that the computer will sense knock caused by the lower octane and retard the timing to protect the engine, thus reducing power. The end result is that you have to press harder on the gas to get the desired acceleration, which of course burns more fuel.
 
A couple of years ago "Car & Driver" magazine tested several modern, computer controlled cars on a dynamometer with different octane gasolines.

They found that if the car calls for high octane and low octane is used, the resulting hp loss and fuel mileage loss just about equals the gasoline cost savings.

For cars that call for low octane, high octane didn't give enough power improvement to show on the dyno's instruments.


Ken
 
Hi All!

This is my first posting here, although I've been hanging out a while and have already learned a great deal about oils.

Anyway, back to the topic at hand, I had an '87 Chevy Nova, with the 1.6L carbureted 4 banger. The manual spec'd 87 octane, but that thing would knock under any type of load if I used less than premium (93 around here). Looking back, I probably had a carbon buildup problem, but it seems to go along with what Gundam has said about older vehicles running better with premium.

Of course, the proper thing would have been to remove the carbon, but hindsight is always 20/20.

Matt
 
-*-*-*-
The best BUY, dollar for dollar, IMO is the PLUS or mid grade.... most bang for the buck, and you can luck out and actually sometimes get SUPER in it's place. Super or in my young days, Ethel, is sometimes cheated by the JOBBER, and as many people that buy gas don't buy it as often so it sits longer and many other things why I usually don't get it... I have figured my Milage for the past several million miles, and at least in the Texas market, the Medium range fuel is the best pay-off... IMHO!
 
87 has more power in it per gallon/liter than 93.

running regular in a obd2 car which requires premium will most likely cause knock, and thus the computer will initiate knock retard(as stated above. The car will run ok until you put the engine under load.

running premium in the same vehicle should reduce knock which in turn will cause the computer to increase timing, increasing the power output untill maximum timing is achieved.

a car which requires only 97 may respond to premium gas in the same way, the computer may have aggressive air fuel tables and may increase timing when using premium gas, this is rare but can happen. also an engine which is carboned up or in generally bad shape may respond to the higher octane as it would reduce knock.

try the premium and if it helps good. if not do not waste the cash.
 
Reality is there is generally no correlation between octane number and energy content in gasoline. Waaaayyyy too many variables at play!

Gasoline from different refineries will vary more in energy content than different octane ratings from the same refinery. This happens since there is more than one way to develop higher octane ratings in gasoline through the use of various additives.

As to the three comments:

Engine will run cleaner on premium: It might, as some brands have higher levels of additives added to premium grades. All gasoline must meet minimum specs in this department though.

Engine will run cooler on premium: Yeah, right...

Engine will have greater power on premium: Only if the computer can advance the timing to take advantage of the higher octane. Most cannot, but can retard based on a Knock sensor. May also be true IF (and a big IF) the energy content is actually higher, which as I pointed out above is not a given.
 
I have a '97 Taurus SHO. It has a chip to run the premium, the manufacturer recommends premium but I use 87 octane all the time. This summer I drove 3 hours and then when on the dyno for chip tuning. Only after the third run in upper 80F temps did I get any ping and that was at 6000 rpm. The gas i use has a 10% ethanol content though.

87 octane contains more usable gasoline than a higher grade due to the fact the additives to boost octane take up the space that gasoline could be using. I have used both over the years and could not justify the expense of premium. No preignition problems or cleaner benefits nor better mileage. Again this may be due to the alky.
 
quote:

Originally posted by gundam2000:
87 has more power in it per gallon/liter than 93

From what I've read, I believe this is a myth related to the fact that lower octane sometimes burns at a faster rate. Or it could be related to the fact that SOME 93 octane pump gas uses ethanol as an octane booster, which has less energy than gasoline. But neither of these are necessarily true, so 87 octane gas doesn't necessarily have more energy than high test.

AFAIK there is no direct relationship between octane, burn rate and energy content. Higher octane certainly does resist detonation better, but it may burn faster or slower, and have more or less energy, than regular 87. It all depends on the formulation of the gasoline and what kind of octane boosters they use to get the high test.

For example, Toluene and Xylene boost octane more than ethanol does, and they both have more energy than ethanol. So if you made a higher octane gas using these additives, it would give more HP and better fuel economy than ethanol based gas (though it might pollute more... who knows?).
 
Ford specifically recommends not using higher than 87 octane gasoline in truck engines. In the 93-94 truck factory service manual they discuss how to diagnose customer complaints about poor cold starting and rough running. The first thing to do was ask the customer what octane fuel they are using. If higher than 87, tell the customer to use only 87.

I have found that my BMW runs much smoother when cold on 89 than on 91. 90 is the recommended grade. I use 91 in hot weather.
 
quote:

Originally posted by Jimbo:
Ford specifically recommends not using higher than 87 octane gasoline in truck engines. In the 93-94 truck factory service manual they discuss how to diagnose customer complaints about poor cold starting and rough running. The first thing to do was ask the customer what octane fuel they are using. If higher than 87, tell the customer to use only 87.

I have found that my BMW runs much smoother when cold on 89 than on 91. 90 is the recommended grade. I use 91 in hot weather.


Interesting..."premium" is what is recommended for my girlfriends 850 Volvo, but it also says that you can run 87 as well. Figure it's the 'ol advance/retard thing.

Anyways, got her to try 92 octane for awhile, and noticed that the car was much more difficult to start in the morning...hmmmm?
 
So, assuming 87 octane gasoline, would it be better to use 87 octane with MTBE as the additive, or 87 octane with ethanol? TIA

PS: I'm referring to better performance for the vehicle, not necessarily environmental/support the farmers issues!
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top