PP 5w20 SM 2003 Toyota Sienna 82,149 miles

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The posting of these UOA's are always a challenge, this is my 2nd UOA on this vehicle. Blackstone ran this analysis. I was very happy with how PP handled the many short trips this van sees. There were some out of state trips in this run too, but the van is mostly a short tripper. The van was fully warmed up and I did note to the lab that I nearly forgot to pull a sample, so this oil was taken near the end of the drain. I was happy the fuel went down in this run. I put in QSUD 5w20 in for this current oil change, interested to see how that oil does.


Toyota 3.0L V-6 (1MZFE)MAKE/MODEL: OIL TYPE & GRADE: Pennzoil Platinum 5W/20 SM
OIL USE INTERVAL: 6,547 Miles
COMMENTS BRAD: It doesn't look like either the longer oil run or the fact that the sample was taken near the end of the drain altered
your engine's results. Metals are nearly perfectly steady since last time, and that's a great indication that the engine didn't mind
the extra miles on the oil. Chrome and copper have fluctuated by amere 1 ppm each, but that's not enough to worry about the health of this
engine. You shouldn't have any problems running your next oil longer since wear is quite steady and the TBN is still above 1.0 (it read 2.0).
Add 2,000 miles to your next fill. Nice report!

ELEMENTS IN PARTS PER MILLION
First number is new UOA, 2nd number is last years UOA
MI/HR on Oil 6,547 4,862
MI/HR on Unit 82,152 UNIT / 75,605
Sample Dates 02/17/12 & 04/16/11
Make Up Oil Added 0 qts
First number is most recent UOA, middle number is the universal averages, and the last number is the previous UOA from last year:
Code:


ALUMINUM 3 3 3

CHROMIUM 1 1 0

IRON 7 7 7

COPPER 3 4 2

LEAD 0 0 3

TIN 0 0 1

MOLYBDENUM 48 49 63

NICKEL 0 0 0

MANGANESE 0 0 0

SILVER 0 0 0

TITANIUM 0 0 0

POTASSIUM 2 2 2

BORON 11 20 28

SILICON 16 13 9

SODIUM 8 12 15

CALCIUM 2353 2360 2367

MAGNESIUM 10 11 11

PHOSPHORUS 606 607 607

ZINC 672 674 776

BARIUM 0 0 0



PROPERTIES -

again first number is the newest UOA,

middle number is averages and final number is previous UOA.

SUS Viscosity @ 210°F 50.7 46-59 53.7

cSt Viscosity @ 100°C 7.47 6.0-10.2 8.39

Flashpoint in °F 360 >355 330

Fuel %
Antifreeze % 0.0 0.0 0.0

Water % 0.0
Insolubles % 0.2
TBN 2.0 2.8


Advice and discussion encouraged!! Thanks all!
 
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It looks like it did the job to me. 7,500 miles should be safely do-able based on your driving style / conditions and engine health.
 
Looks like great wear rates and low contamination. However ...

TBN seems low after only 5k and 6k miles. Kind of disappointing to see such low wear, and yet think TBN won't hold out much longer. I'd say 7.5k miles was doable for sure, but not really sure how much further past that.

Given the TBN situation, I'd have to ask if you've considered using a good quality dino oil, and see how far it can run? You might be suprised to find many of them can provide the same wear protection under such "normal" OCI circumstances. The one caveot here would be if this is one of the infamous "sludger" engines (I don't know; that's why I ask).
 
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Nice UOA, but forget the Blackstone useless (hey buddy) comments. I might go another 1000 miles next time for the OCI, but not 2000, not at least until you see what the UOA is at 7500 OCI. If you are not going to continue with UOA, then stick with 6500 to 7000 OCIs. I realize TBN depletion is not linear, but you do not want to get down to 1.0.

At $21.00 per jug at Walmart and 7000 OCI, you are paying $3.00 per 1000/miles for the oil and maybe another $1.00 for the filter per 1000/miles. So pushing the oil beyond a reasonable limit will only save you $4.00 (to push it an extra 1000 miles).

How about going to PU? Its only another $5 per jug at Walmart (if you can find it).
 
Nice to see excellent results with the back-spec'ed 20-weight oils. Have you seen any improvement in fuel economy, versus xW-30 oils?

Thanks for posting.
 
Originally Posted By: chubbs1
Great engine, not much to say here, just another boring PP UOA. Just the kind we like to see;)


Boring is good for me!!
thumbsup2.gif
 
Originally Posted By: dnewton3
Looks like great wear rates and low contamination. However ...

TBN seems low after only 5k and 6k miles. Kind of disappointing to see such low wear, and yet think TBN won't hold out much longer. I'd say 7.5k miles was doable for sure, but not really sure how much further past that.

Given the TBN situation, I'd have to ask if you've considered using a good quality dino oil, and see how far it can run? You might be suprised to find many of them can provide the same wear protection under such "normal" OCI circumstances. The one caveot here would be if this is one of the infamous "sludger" engines (I don't know; that's why I ask).


From the research I have done, the 2003 version of this engine is not the sludger motor. I have the threaded in PCV, the sludge engines (pre 2003) have the weaker PCV system (the PCV pops in and out of the engine)

I am currently running QSUD 5w20 since I got it free after rebate and I wanted to try it, and I have 15 quarts of PP 5w20 to use after that. I am kinda anal about my cars, so this engine will see synthetic for the forseeable future. 15 quarts is 3+ years of use @ 5-7k per year. Synthetic will be part of the mix at least as long as I can pick up PP or PU (if I can find it) reasonable with mail in rebate or on sale, preferably both!
 
Originally Posted By: Donald
Nice UOA, but forget the Blackstone useless (hey buddy) comments. I might go another 1000 miles next time for the OCI, but not 2000, not at least until you see what the UOA is at 7500 OCI. If you are not going to continue with UOA, then stick with 6500 to 7000 OCIs. I realize TBN depletion is not linear, but you do not want to get down to 1.0.

At $21.00 per jug at Walmart and 7000 OCI, you are paying $3.00 per 1000/miles for the oil and maybe another $1.00 for the filter per 1000/miles. So pushing the oil beyond a reasonable limit will only save you $4.00 (to push it an extra 1000 miles).

How about going to PU? Its only another $5 per jug at Walmart (if you can find it).


I cannot find PU here in West MI - but did see it at a Walmart in Lansing. It was $27.xx, PP is $24.xx here. I really wanted to pick up a jug, but I was already buying some QSUD for my parents motorhome and knew I would be in trouble with the Mrs if I came home with more oil for the stash..... I will try PU at some point.

In terms of miles, this year was somewhat high for this van, we had a trip to Minneapolis in June last year that was 1500 or so miles by itself. A typical year is around 5000 miles. I might push the oil change to 7500 at some point, but will not go past that. We are talking about a trip out west in 2013, I will extend the OCI with all those highway miles. With the QSUD I have in the van now, I will only go 5000-6000 miles or so on that oil. I am not sure how similar QSUD is to PP, but I could not beat the price(FAR).
 
Originally Posted By: Pete
Nice to see excellent results with the back-spec'ed 20-weight oils. Have you seen any improvement in fuel economy, versus xW-30 oils?

Thanks for posting.


I cannot say there has been much of a difference in gas mileage. I average around 18 mpg in town, on our trip to Minneapolis we got 24 mpg out there, and 23.8 on the way back. That was a 70-75mph. At some point I want to try 0w20 if I can find a deal on that weight, curious to see if it consumes any and if the gas mileage improves at all.
 
Has it used any oil since you made the switch? I also see your using PYB 5W-20 in your Chevy van. Interesting.
 
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Originally Posted By: lexus114
Has it used any oil since you made the switch? I also see your using PYB 5W-20 in your Chevy van. Interesting.


No oil use when I switched brands. The van has never consumed any oil regardless of the type of oil I run.

On my Chevy Astro - again another short trip van. I moved to 5w20 since the oil is hardly ever up to temp... Have not noticed any consumption issues or any issues for that matter. With all the free or nearly free oil in my stash, most oil going forward in that van will be 5w30. I have not noticed much of a fuel economy advantage with the lighter oil in that van either. It only gets around 14 mpg in the winter (in town) and 15-16 mpg in the summer. On the highway I have gotten as high as 21 mpg, but highway runs are quite rare....
 
Originally Posted By: DutchBrad
Originally Posted By: dnewton3
Looks like great wear rates and low contamination. However ...

TBN seems low after only 5k and 6k miles. Kind of disappointing to see such low wear, and yet think TBN won't hold out much longer. I'd say 7.5k miles was doable for sure, but not really sure how much further past that.

Given the TBN situation, I'd have to ask if you've considered using a good quality dino oil, and see how far it can run? You might be suprised to find many of them can provide the same wear protection under such "normal" OCI circumstances. The one caveot here would be if this is one of the infamous "sludger" engines (I don't know; that's why I ask).


From the research I have done, the 2003 version of this engine is not the sludger motor. I have the threaded in PCV, the sludge engines (pre 2003) have the weaker PCV system (the PCV pops in and out of the engine)

I am currently running QSUD 5w20 since I got it free after rebate and I wanted to try it, and I have 15 quarts of PP 5w20 to use after that. I am kinda anal about my cars, so this engine will see synthetic for the forseeable future. 15 quarts is 3+ years of use @ 5-7k per year. Synthetic will be part of the mix at least as long as I can pick up PP or PU (if I can find it) reasonable with mail in rebate or on sale, preferably both!


Correct, 2003 is not part of the sludge problems. Having tried everything, will tell you Toyota engines love M1, don't rule out a run.
 
Originally Posted By: LeakySeals
Originally Posted By: DutchBrad
Originally Posted By: dnewton3
Looks like great wear rates and low contamination. However ...

TBN seems low after only 5k and 6k miles. Kind of disappointing to see such low wear, and yet think TBN won't hold out much longer. I'd say 7.5k miles was doable for sure, but not really sure how much further past that.

Given the TBN situation, I'd have to ask if you've considered using a good quality dino oil, and see how far it can run? You might be suprised to find many of them can provide the same wear protection under such "normal" OCI circumstances. The one caveot here would be if this is one of the infamous "sludger" engines (I don't know; that's why I ask).


From the research I have done, the 2003 version of this engine is not the sludger motor. I have the threaded in PCV, the sludge engines (pre 2003) have the weaker PCV system (the PCV pops in and out of the engine)

I am currently running QSUD 5w20 since I got it free after rebate and I wanted to try it, and I have 15 quarts of PP 5w20 to use after that. I am kinda anal about my cars, so this engine will see synthetic for the forseeable future. 15 quarts is 3+ years of use @ 5-7k per year. Synthetic will be part of the mix at least as long as I can pick up PP or PU (if I can find it) reasonable with mail in rebate or on sale, preferably both!


Correct, 2003 is not part of the sludge problems. Having tried everything, will tell you Toyota engines love M1, don't rule out a run.



I agree, both of the RX`s I have/had really like the MB-1 0W-30.
 
Great to see this post as I will be doing the 1st UOA on my '03 Sienna next week. Mine has almost double the miles, but this will give me something to compare to. Congrats on the solid #'s!! I have been running 5000 miles on M1 and hope to go to 7500 if everything looks good. Zak
 
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