Post pandemic housing change by county

GON

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White Sands, NM
No surprises here, except maybe Cuyahoga County, OH.

Long term the population changes in places like Los Angelos, San Francisco, and Alameda CA will not impact long term housing prices. In places like Cook, IL--- the population decline will without question deeply negatively impact long term housing prices.

Not to get into politics, but population gains/ losses also impact congressional seats. Those seats are key in redistribution of taxpayers' monies.

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per capita would be nice :sneaky:

Brooklyn, Queens, and the Bronx are counted separately since each boro is its own county, but together they're higher than LA. Manhattan didn't make the cut, and anyway, less than 20k is negligible since it has so many people
 
People still flocking to Florida. I thought there was an exodus due to insurance rates, etc.. Oh well.
 
Good thing Texas is a big state, 550K gain total in those areas.

@GON, does this give you new areas of interest?
@AZjeff

Greetings.

The biggest concern, and it is of critical importance, is the nation's debt and deficit. Currently, our nation is reported to borrow monies just to make the interest payment on the debt. I can't play a single scenario where this ends up ok down the road. When you and I were kids, politicians were challenged on fiscal responsibility of the federal government. That is without a doubt no longer an issue of concern for voters.

In 2015 I taught a class at a top 30 rated university. Part of the syllabus was could ISIS become a force in the U.S. When I surveyed these very smart young adults, the immediate and resounding answer was a powerful NO. To get accepted into this private university, one needed a very high SAT, great high school grades, well rounded (like high school athlete), etc. Almost all of these students came from comfortable financial backgrounds and nice public or private schools.

After the ISIS survey, I would go line by line into entitlements. What would happen if the federal government would no longer be able to pay these entitlements. After going through the entitlements, loss of entitlements, and no hope for young men......... the students changed their position that not only could ISIS (or like organization) be a force in the US, but it would happen very quickly.

To answer your question, unless the government reduces entitlements, increases exports, decreases imports, increases adult employment participation rate, and increases adults that pay taxes....... I think it is prudent on look at living in a location that they can survive, feed their family, and protect their family.
 
The amount of people moving to Florida despite the increasing hurricane risk and number of years left before a substantial portion of the state is underwater tell me a lot of people aren't very good at risk assessment. They just think "New York/Illinois cold, Florida warm". Texas is a little better off, but their electrical grid has already been demonstrated to be incredibly susceptible to adverse weather conditions (which are becoming more frequent by the year) and that's only being compounded by increased demand due to population increase. They certainly won't stay cheap for long at this rate. Austin is one of the only cities in Texas which is actually attempting to do something about the housing crisis by actually building lots of housing, and incentivizing doing so.
 
@AZjeff

Greetings.

The biggest concern, and it is of critical importance, is the nation's debt and deficit. Currently, our nation is reported to borrow monies just to make the interest payment on the debt. I can't play a single scenario where this ends up ok down the road. When you and I were kids, politicians were challenged on fiscal responsibility of the federal government. That is without a doubt no longer an issue of concern for voters.

In 2015 I taught a class at a top 30 rated university. Part of the syllabus was could ISIS become a force in the U.S. When I surveyed these very smart young adults, the immediate and resounding answer was a powerful NO. To get accepted into this private university, one needed a very high SAT, great high school grades, well rounded (like high school athlete), etc. Almost all of these students came from comfortable financial backgrounds and nice public or private schools.

After the ISIS survey, I would go line by line into entitlements. What would happen if the federal government would no longer be able to pay these entitlements. After going through the entitlements, loss of entitlements, and no hope for young men......... the students changed their position that not only could ISIS (or like organization) be a force in the US, but it would happen very quickly.

To answer your question, unless the government reduces entitlements, increases exports, decreases imports, increases adult employment participation rate, and increases adults that pay taxes....... I think it is prudent on look at living in a location that they can survive, feed their family, and protect their family.

Increase exports? Sounds good (and easy!) in theory, but what industries? Where's the supply chain for those industries? Politicians like to talk big about manufacturing iphones etc in the US, but if you actually were to break down the cost of manufacturing all of those components (of which there are many) in the US, the phones would be several thousand dollars at minimum. And it would take many years to actually build that supply chain which no longer exists (and in many cases, never did) and train a workforce.

There are some possible spots of hope, but people should stop kidding themselves about what can actually be made here. Cars? Only if we actually start building cars other countries would actually want to buy. Does anyone seriously think Japan wants Ford F-150s? I promise you as someone that spends considerable time there, they do not. They certainly don't want Expeditions, Tahoes, etc (well, outside of a very select, special group which is growing less relevant by the year, and those are the same people who also give bulletproof glass industry a shot in the arm, pun intended).

The US steel industry is a possible spot of hope right now, it's as cyclical as it's ever been. And right now, a lot of the older folks (a large percentage of the userbase on this site) are underestimating the impact that AI will and is having. As much as many of us hate it, and think the LLM model (think chatGPT, Gemini, etc) is inherently flawed and useless, there are lots of positions that are rapidly being replaced by technology and AI, and those are the places that historically are filled by young people.

You can whinge and say "young people don't want to work anymore!" I can show you a hilarious compilation of newspaper articles going back literally hundreds of years where people said the exact same thing, and it's not any truer now than it was then. The unemployment rate among recent college grads is over 25% in most of the country, because those entry level jobs have disappeared. You want to get rid of entitlements, is that going to magically reappear those jobs which have vanished into the ether?

It's easy to say "we need to cut entitlements so people want to work" Work where? How much are those jobs paying? Sure, Harbor Freight might always have hiring signs up, but will that job pay enough to pay rent in this country? This isn't Japan, where even in a major city like Tokyo or Fukuoka you can find apartments for less than $500/mo. Good luck finding anything remotely that cheap in most of the US.

You want people to have kids? With what money? With what time, when they're working 2 or 3 jobs just to pay rent for themselves? Again, it's easy to say "cut entitlements, increase exports". Sure, now give me some concrete ideas how you plan on doing those things while considering the possible consequences for others. "build stuff in the US", okay, as I said earlier, you don't have supply chains or raw materials for those things. You don't have a skilled labor pool to do those jobs, almost no companies/jobs do internships or traineeships anymore to learn those jobs, even if they existed.

It's an unpopular opinion, but I think little of the country (or the west in general) has woken up to the notion that our current economic system is inherently incompatible with the current trajectory of the world and economy. This isn't the 1950s, you can't just "pull yourself up by your bootstraps and walk into a place and ask for a job".
 
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About deficit and debt.

The problem today in almost every country is that they are in a competition between each other on who gets to print the most without taking the consequences. In theory if you have to pay up on every debt using no inflation and no way of forcing other people to lend you money then yes, you have to cut debt and increase tax. Not all nations are the same in taking the consequences of QE however.

QE being diluted due to spreading out money circulation outside of your country is one way to get a free loan, and why would people accept that would be because their own currency is in an even worse state. I would imagine even ISIS would prefer to accept USD instead of the Afghan's own currency in a war of their own. Same for many other nations on earths. This IMO is the main reason we are establishing stable coins back by US short term debt, it is not useful inside the US but would be useful as an alt currency system like USD is accepted everywhere in Latin America.

I also think that most of the time economic boom would absorb the inflationary pressure of QE. Without QE, in an economic boom, the non booming assets (food, gas, rent in the non booming area) would be dropping in price to support the increase in spending in the booming assets (smart phone, Costco stores, etc) and ended up as deflation. A successful cooldown of a QE would need economic boom to absorb that to avoid being inflationary. Yes compare to gold your income drop, your food price went down, your gas price went down, etc, but in terms of USD they probably didn't by too much. That would reduce the impact of inflation by a lot.

Because of the above viewpoint I don't invest in bonds anymore, just gold and tech stocks.
 
Increase exports? Sounds good (and easy!) in theory, but what industries? Where's the supply chain for those industries? Politicians like to talk big about manufacturing iphones etc in the US, but if you actually were to break down the cost of manufacturing all of those components (of which there are many) in the US, the phones would be several thousand dollars at minimum. And it would take many years to actually build that supply chain which no longer exists (and in many cases, never did) and train a workforce.

There are some possible spots of hope, but people should stop kidding themselves about what can actually be made here. Cars? Only if we actually start building cars other countries would actually want to buy. Does anyone seriously think Japan wants Ford F-150s? I promise you as someone that spends considerable time there, they do not. They certainly don't want Expeditions, Tahoes, etc (well, outside of a very select, special group which is growing less relevant by the year, and those are the same people who also give bulletproof glass industry a shot in the arm, pun intended).

The US steel industry is a possible spot of hope right now, it's as cyclical as it's ever been. And right now, a lot of the older folks (a large percentage of the userbase on this site) are underestimating the impact that AI will and is having. As much as many of us hate it, and think the LLM model (think chatGPT, Gemini, etc) is inherently flawed and useless, there are lots of positions that are rapidly being replaced by technology and AI, and those are the places that historically are filled by young people.

You can whinge and say "young people don't want to work anymore!" I can show you a hilarious compilation of newspaper articles going back literally hundreds of years where people said the exact same thing, and it's not any truer now than it was then. The unemployment rate among recent college grads is over 25% in most of the country, because those entry level jobs have disappeared. You want to get rid of entitlements, is that going to magically reappear those jobs which have vanished into the ether?

It's easy to say "we need to cut entitlements so people want to work" Work where? How much are those jobs paying? Sure, Harbor Freight might always have hiring signs up, but will that job pay enough to pay rent in this country? This isn't Japan, where even in a major city like Tokyo or Fukuoka you can find apartments for less than $500/mo. Good luck finding anything remotely that cheap in most of the US.

You want people to have kids? With what money? With what time, when they're working 2 or 3 jobs just to pay rent for themselves? Again, it's easy to say "cut entitlements, increase exports". Sure, now give me some concrete ideas how you plan on doing those things while considering the possible consequences for others. "build stuff in the US", okay, as I said earlier, you don't have supply chains or raw materials for those things. You don't have a skilled labor pool to do those jobs, almost no companies/jobs do internships or traineeships anymore to learn those jobs, even if they existed.

It's an unpopular opinion, but I think little of the country (or the west in general) has woken up to the notion that our current economic system is inherently incompatible with the current trajectory of the world and economy. This isn't the 1950s, you can't just "pull yourself up by your bootstraps and walk into a place and ask for a job".

Export and import go in both direction based on exchange rate. It may not be obvious in consumer goods but say for example DRAM and NAND chips. We have supplies from US, Japan, S Korea, Taiwan and depends on exchange rate the price has to go up or down, production have to go up or down, etc.

And cars? I have bought US made and Japan made Toyota based on the exchange rate as well. You may see this not as export but it is the same as a net (import less or import more = export more or export less).

Entitlement always happen when incomes equality spread in a society, whether they are forced to or not. This is just human nature and people in all political system have this, even in dictatorship. The income gap narrowing is the only meaningful way to sway the opinion around and reduce entitlement if there is a bigger problem like hyper inflation being the alternative.
 
Export and import go in both direction based on exchange rate. It may not be obvious in consumer goods but say for example DRAM and NAND chips. We have supplies from US, Japan, S Korea, Taiwan and depends on exchange rate the price has to go up or down, production have to go up or down, etc.

And cars? I have bought US made and Japan made Toyota based on the exchange rate as well. You may see this not as export but it is the same as a net (import less or import more = export more or export less).

Entitlement always happen when incomes equality spread in a society, whether they are forced to or not. This is just human nature and people in all political system have this, even in dictatorship. The income gap narrowing is the only meaningful way to sway the opinion around and reduce entitlement if there is a bigger problem like hyper inflation being the alternative.
And how much would that difference be? In a like to like (as much as could be) vehicle comparison?
Dated example-Are you talking about buying a Buick Regal over a Toyota Camry based solely on exchange rates?
 
@AZjeff

To answer your question, unless the government reduces entitlements, increases exports, decreases imports, increases adult employment participation rate, and increases adults that pay taxes....... I think it is prudent on look at living in a location that they can survive, feed their family, and protect their family.

@GON the question was has this map and the population shift shown YOU any new areas in your nationwide search for your perfect forever home?
 
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