Plumber Question: Shut Off Valve For Toilet

[DwightFrye]

My home is only 2 years old. I noticed a leak on the floor below the shut off valve sticking out of the wall that feeds the toilet. I checked the nuts on the braided feed line, the one at the tank was hand tight pretty snug. The one at the valve wasn't very snug so I gave it about another 3/4 turn. Still leaked.
I bought a brand new Fluidmaster braided water line and installed that. Still leaks.

I'm thinking now that it is the shut off valve. It doesn't leak at all if I turn it off. It is the kind that only requires a quarter turn to turn on/off. The maker is Keeney which I believe is a Lowes brand.

Is replacing the valve a straightforward job as in turn off the main water supply to the house, wrench off the old valve, put some Teflon tape on the threads and tighten on the new valve ? Is the correct type of valve a 1/2 inch FIP x 3/8 inch Compression Quarter Turn Angle Valve or 1/2 inch Compression x 3/8 inch Compression Quarter Turn Angle Valve ?

Here is a pic of the current set up. Sorry about the focus
Thank you

 

[Papa Bear]

The valve shaft has a packing gland nut on the body of the valve where the shaft turns in it - you may have to snug it up a bit.
Is the water leaking out around the valve shaft? If so, that gland nut needs tightening a bit (not TOO tight)

 

[928]

Get a DAHL brand quarter turn shutoff valve - you most likely won't find it locally and you absolutely won't find it at a box store. Figure out what
you need and get it here-

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SupplyHouse.com offers HVAC, PEX, radiant heat, hydronic heating and plumbing supplies. Shop now for great prices on PEX Tubing, thermostats, fittings & more.

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[PimTac]

Get a new shutoff. They are inexpensive. Turn off your water, take off the old one and take it with you to wherever you buy the new one.

The ¼ turn valves are good ones.

 

[doitmyself]

I always avoid replacing the valve unless it is the last resort, especially yours that has no extra pipe to work with. Try Papa Bear's idea to slightly tighten the packing nut behind the handle. Your valve looks to be a compression type, not screw on.

Lots of You Tube videos on both compression valve removal/install and packing nut tightening.

 

[y_p_w]

That looks like 1/2" FIP (female iron pipe). I know at this point because I mistakenly bought a 3/8" compression from Amazon and found mine was 1/2" FIP.

This is a 3/8" compression Fluidmaster Click-Seal toilet connector. It's actually kind of cool, where the toilet end turns until it clicks like a torque wrench at a set torque. But 3/8" is barely wider than the hose. 1/2" is about double the width of the hose. There are also universal or dual kits with little inserts. Those are 1/2" FIP but the inserts adapt to 3/8" or 7/16" compression.

I don't think turning it off is the problem. That should seal it off at the water supply so it's not going to leak at the stem. There's some sort of packing material that seals it at the stem, although I'm not sure exactly what.

Is it leaking out the stem or at the connector? That looks like Teflon tape at the outlet, which is absolutely not necessary. The threads don't form a seal. It's the compression against a captive seal (fused to the hose) that properly seals it against the outlet. If it's leaking past the seal, even if you completely seal the threads, it will just leak out the top of the connector.

 

[JeffKeryk]

Find out where it is leaking. It looks like it is leaking from the supply line connection. If so, snug it up just a little.
If you wanna replace the valve, it looks like a compression valve.
I imagine you have copper pipes? You can use a compression valve or even a Shark Bite.
But make sure the copper pipe is true (round) and clean.

Ir your house is only 2 years old, you should not need new parts.

There are a bazillion YouTube videos. Good luck.

 

[4WD]

If a valve winds up with seat or seal pocket debris over time … and that happened in full open positions … I have found that opening and closing them slowly can create velocity around the seats and clean them out. Always worth a try.

 

[Mazomopar]

I'm with y p w. Sure doesn't look like 3/8 compression supply. Not sure why new home construction plumber would have used such a non standard fitting in what's probably the most standard fitting in the house.

 

[philipp10]

Find the leak, most likely on the valve shaft. If so, tighten it a bit, like 1/8-1/4 turn. Problem solved. Don't listen to the "part replacers" or you might end up with a weekend project when things go wrong. And while your at it, you can remove the teflon tape on the outlet, not needed and could be why it is leaking.

 

[JMJNet]

If it is only 2 years old, it may still have warranty from the builder?

 

[y_p_w]

I'm with y p w. Sure doesn't look like 3/8 compression supply. Not sure why new home construction plumber would have used such a non standard fitting in what's probably the most standard fitting in the house.

When I was looking around for supply lines, I saw some 3/8" compression, some 1/2" FIP, a few 7/`16" compression. But Fluidmaster had two common types of kits. They were at their heart 1/2" FIP. The "West Coast" version had a 3/8" compression adapter and claimed to be compatible with maybe 97% of the supply valves on the West Coast. The "Universal" had the 3/8" compression and 7/16" compression adapters.

Also - Fluidmaster used stainless steel braids. For some reason Brasscraft was all nylon braids.

 

[nthach]

Get a DAHL brand quarter turn shutoff valve - you most likely won't find it locally and you absolutely won't find it at a box store. Figure out what
you need and get it here-

SupplyHouse.com - Plumbing, Heating & HVAC Supplies - SupplyHouse.com

SupplyHouse.com offers HVAC, PEX, radiant heat, hydronic heating and plumbing supplies. Shop now for great prices on PEX Tubing, thermostats, fittings & more.

www.supplyhouse.com

2nded. I installed one for the parents. The quality is definitely there.

I like BrassCraft’s all brass 1/4turn balls as well - also from a plumbing house. The Chinese ones seem OK - Ace and one of the plumbing houses sells them. Certainly better than the Home Depot exclusive BrassCraft line(Masco seems to love Home Depot - it’s cheap distribution for them, especially with Delta faucets and Behr paint).

 

[nthach]

Shoot, I installed one of those Keeney valves - like I said, Keeney is an Ace supplier and local plumbing houses carry them as a house brand like Lasco. They seem decent - brass ball and stem, unlike the plastic stem of the Home Depot ones.

I’m not going to go out on a limb and replace it with a Dahl or BrassCraft until they leak.

 

[Lubener]

Except for the compression fitting, these things do not need tightening much past hand tight. By tightening an additional 3/4 turn, I bet it was overtightened. Over tighten these, they will or will continue to leak.

 

[Donald]

If you are going to replace the shutoff get a 1/4 turn one. But the packing nut is probably the issue.

 

[Ihatetochangeoil]

My two cents worth is to buy some spray white talc powder and use it to specifically FIND OUT the exact source of the leak. Go from there. NO guesswork.

 

[DwightFrye]

Process of elimination has told me that it isn't the braided line or its connections to either the tank or the valve that is leaking. Wiping everything dry and then feeling for wetness along the entire path of the water after a minute or so I get water on the bottom of the shut off valve when the valve is on, and no drips when off.
The suggestion that a packing nut may not be tight enough is a good one, I will check that. It is not leaking at the nut where the valve connects to the pipe that comes out of the wall, or it would leak in the off position. I'll watch a few YouTube videos.
A new valve is probably only $12-$15 so no big deal, especially if I can do it myself. I'm sure a plumber would charge $100 just to walk in the door.

The builder used cheap labor, likely illegals from what my neighbors have told me who watched the house being built. I have found many signs of substandard labor including a leaking roof because no flashing was installed around the chimney on one side, a leaking tank on the toilet in the guest bathroom because the bolts connecting the tank to the bowl were barely tight, and a leaking toilet in the main bathroom that was traced to the fact that they builder only used two 1" screws to fasten the mounting flange to the floor. When I pulled the toilet from the guest bathroom to see if they installed it properly I found ZERO screws attaching the flange to the floor.

So I am learning to inspect everything carefully and often just in case more signs of poor worksmanship or materials show up.

 

[DwightFrye]

Follow up. It appears that the shut off valve is cracked and leaking on one side. I can't imagine how this happened unless it is because it is a cheap make in China cast component that failed at a seam. I double checked and the water droplets are not emanating from the feed line connection. Also on this model from Keeney there is no packing nut assembly.
So it is off to the hardware store and hopefully they will stock a quality brass valve with chrome plating. This Keeney valve may even be made of plastic. Here's a pic. You can see a drip heading down the left side of the valve.

 

[javacontour]

Usually ends up being more of a pain than it's worth.

Taking a day off work and burning vacation time for something you can fix with $20 (or less) and an hour of your time is penny wise and pound foolish.

If it is only 2 years old, it may still have warranty from the builder?