Does this guy got the right idea? Wife's f150 starting leaking pretty bad I so want to get on top of this but it would be REALLY nice to avoid the crush sleeve r&r
Pinion seal tricks
- Thread starter buck91
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Yes, I did the same method on 2017 F150 that had a leaky pinion seal. I didnt use a chisel, just a paint marker and counted the threads too. Went about 1/8 of turn past going back on.
Also people will shout you down if you say this isn't the "right" way to do it....but it's not really the right way to do it.
But again, for flat rate and all-around practicality, it's usually ok.
The whole idea behind a crush sleeve is that it's one time use in ONE direction. Once you back off, any precise orientation is lost.
And there was just a video I watched on torque wrenches....who was it?? Maybe TTC? Geez I hope it wasn't PF -- but maybe it was. Once you hit a given torque, the amount of clamping force after that multiplies exponentially with every degree. Point being, it might seem to the human brain "I only went a tiny bit tighter" but that "tiny bit" of additional rotation can put you WAY out of spec.
BUT AGAIN, do it the cheater way as discussed here and just know there's a small chance your pinion bearings won't live as long. It's primarily a low risk (of failure)/high reward (time saved) scenario
But again, for flat rate and all-around practicality, it's usually ok.
The whole idea behind a crush sleeve is that it's one time use in ONE direction. Once you back off, any precise orientation is lost.
And there was just a video I watched on torque wrenches....who was it?? Maybe TTC? Geez I hope it wasn't PF -- but maybe it was. Once you hit a given torque, the amount of clamping force after that multiplies exponentially with every degree. Point being, it might seem to the human brain "I only went a tiny bit tighter" but that "tiny bit" of additional rotation can put you WAY out of spec.
BUT AGAIN, do it the cheater way as discussed here and just know there's a small chance your pinion bearings won't live as long. It's primarily a low risk (of failure)/high reward (time saved) scenario
I agree with everything D60 stated, I just want to add.....If the pinion is loose....It will need bearings & a crush sleeve.
I wouldn't recommend it but have done it on a Toyota. It never seemed right afterwards but didn't leak and didn't explode for the next 30k miles or so before I sold it. It seemed to have a slight noise/vibration. If you have the desire to have it done correctly, go to a Driveline shop.
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I think I have 75k miles on my repair with this method.
The other thing to weigh is the doing the full tear down, replacing all the parts, what is risk of messing it up just the same?
You have to take a whole bunch of important stuff apart to do it the "right way" with a new crush sleeve.
If you fix it with the short cut way and have bad luck, worse case your pinion bearing wear out a little earlier and you are doing the complete tear down sometime in the future.
The other thing to weigh is the doing the full tear down, replacing all the parts, what is risk of messing it up just the same?
You have to take a whole bunch of important stuff apart to do it the "right way" with a new crush sleeve.
If you fix it with the short cut way and have bad luck, worse case your pinion bearing wear out a little earlier and you are doing the complete tear down sometime in the future.
I really don't understand crush sleeves in differentials. I get what they do but I just don't like it.
Depends on the vehicle. I've had to change the yoke on the rear axle of my Cherokee once or twice. I just count threads and run it back on reasonably tight. I did the rear pinion yoke somewhere around 50,000 miles before regearing. And at 215000 when I regeared, everything in the differential was in great shape. So I didn't mess anything up.
Some of the aftermarket driveshafts for Jeeps come with a different yoke and have instructions on how tight to torque the pinion nut before it starts to crush the sleeve.
If you get to that point, you're really in trouble.
I guess when the differential gets old and worn out and the pinion bearings start getting tired, you can crank down the pinion nut and tighten them up to trade the vehicle in
Depends on the vehicle. I've had to change the yoke on the rear axle of my Cherokee once or twice. I just count threads and run it back on reasonably tight. I did the rear pinion yoke somewhere around 50,000 miles before regearing. And at 215000 when I regeared, everything in the differential was in great shape. So I didn't mess anything up.
Some of the aftermarket driveshafts for Jeeps come with a different yoke and have instructions on how tight to torque the pinion nut before it starts to crush the sleeve.
If you get to that point, you're really in trouble.
I guess when the differential gets old and worn out and the pinion bearings start getting tired, you can crank down the pinion nut and tighten them up to trade the vehicle in
I didn't have time to watch the vid but I've done several over the years by drilling a pilot hole, inserting a screw in 4 spots and using a hammer puller to pull on the screws. The key...for me...has been 4 screws and work the pull in either a CW or CCW direction.
I really don't understand crush sleeves in differentials. I get what they do but I just don't like it.
Depends on the vehicle. I've had to change the yoke on the rear axle of my Cherokee once or twice. I just count threads and run it back on reasonably tight. I did the rear pinion yoke somewhere around 50,000 miles before regearing. And at 215000 when I regeared, everything in the differential was in great shape. So I didn't mess anything up.
Some of the aftermarket driveshafts for Jeeps come with a different yoke and have instructions on how tight to torque the pinion nut before it starts to crush the sleeve.
If you get to that point, you're really in trouble.
I guess when the differential gets old and worn out and the pinion bearings start getting tired, you can crank down the pinion nut and tighten them up to trade the vehicle in
A lot of Dana diffs are shimmed & don't have a crush sleeve to worry about, There are solid spacer+shim kits available for many "Corporate" differentials
That is not the correct way to do it. Chances are your preload is too tight by going an extra 1/8 turn. When I last did mine the correct way, I was surprised how much each "tweek" (not an 1/8 turn) of the pinion nut increased the preload . The typical spec without a new bearing is about 7-14 inch pounds, so you are really splitting hairs with this. You may have gotten lucky for now but my bet is gear noise could be waiting for you in the future.
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If I ever had to rebuild the differentials on my truck (60 front, sterling 10.5 rear) I'd do the crush sleeve eliminator kit on it.
You can re use a crush sleeve, just add a thin washer ahead of the crush sleeve. Then re crush it and dont back off.
I'm not sure why everyone is afraid of the crush sleeve. It is real easy to do. Online videos very few people do it correctly as per Ford OEM manual but mainly because nearly everyone uses a power tool/air gun to tighten the pinion nut.
You will need special tools to do it correctly. If you're doing it on the ground like I did all you will need as far as special tools is a heavy duty pinion flange holder and a beam torque wrench to check the preload (with the carrier removed). The preload for used bearing is different then new bearings so read the Ford OEM service instructions.
I used the weight of the car on jackstands as a brace and then used the floorjack to move the breaker bar to tighten the pinion nut. YOU DO THIS SLOWLY (with safety glasses on). So much force was used to tighten the pinion nut the breaker bar was bending but sure enough the nut would move just a small amount almost undetectable to the eye. Paint marker will let you know its moving!
My first attempt I tightened the nut too much and the result was the pinion would bind into the carrier. The second attempt (and with a new nut and crush sleeve) I snuck up on it slow and nailed it perfectly at little on the tight side in spec.
If you have a lift you will need the same tools but you need at least a 6ft breaker bar to use to move that nut and a similar long bar to hold the pinion flange as you squeeze them together.
You will need special tools to do it correctly. If you're doing it on the ground like I did all you will need as far as special tools is a heavy duty pinion flange holder and a beam torque wrench to check the preload (with the carrier removed). The preload for used bearing is different then new bearings so read the Ford OEM service instructions.
I used the weight of the car on jackstands as a brace and then used the floorjack to move the breaker bar to tighten the pinion nut. YOU DO THIS SLOWLY (with safety glasses on). So much force was used to tighten the pinion nut the breaker bar was bending but sure enough the nut would move just a small amount almost undetectable to the eye. Paint marker will let you know its moving!
My first attempt I tightened the nut too much and the result was the pinion would bind into the carrier. The second attempt (and with a new nut and crush sleeve) I snuck up on it slow and nailed it perfectly at little on the tight side in spec.
If you have a lift you will need the same tools but you need at least a 6ft breaker bar to use to move that nut and a similar long bar to hold the pinion flange as you squeeze them together.
The problem is you dont know who is going to do it correctly. Most places will just replace the seal then tighten down the nut with a impact gun and call it a day.
Like they say, the only way to know a job is done right is to do it yourself.
To make the job easier I failed to mention using a torque multiplier wrench to tighten the pinion nut. I have a Air Force buddy that used them extensively during his enlistment in the 1980s. I was looking at a 200$ Neico brand that looked good and easy to use.
Here there is a shop or two that specializein diff's only. After a couple of visits to regular mechanic (one a friend) took both trucks to the specialists.....end of problems- had to replace brand new bearings because there is only one chance to get them right.