Pinging - Mopar Combustion cleaner or Regane

[Art_Vandelay]

1996 Lincoln Town Car 65,000 miles. The car runs beautiful. Yet was pinging going up hills, when flooring it and even 3/4 throttle downshifts on the highway sometimes caused it. Completely goes away on Premium Shell or BP.

So I took off the MAF sensor and cleaned it with electrical cleaning fluid. Of course never touching the element. Let it dry, reinstalled it and added a full bottle of Gumout Regane to about 15 gallons of BP regular. It's only been about 50 miles and the pinging has reduced quite a bit. However, under full throttle acceleration the pinging is still really heavy. I want to eliminate it completely.

Should I consider adding Regane to less fuel, maybe just 10 gallons or even less, to concentrate the cleaning effects? Can that damage anything? Can a few tanks in a row be run that way safely?

I read somewhere that Mopar Combustion Chamber Cleaner can be used to remove carbon that is difficult to combat with additives. Anyone ever do a deep cleaning with a product like this?

 

[chevrofreak]

Your car does not have a knock sensor. The best way to stop the pinging is to use premium.

I've used alllll kind of cleaners in my 96 Crown Vic, from Sea Foam to B12 Chemtool to Amsoil Powerfoam, and even hot water, all through a vacuum hose. I've used several types of cleaners in the fuel, including several doses of Gumout Regane.

The only thing that stops the pinging is premium fuel.

 

[dwendt44]

What does the owner's manual suggest using fuel wise?

The throttle plate could be dirty, but that would show up at idle more than part throttle acceleration.
Might check EGR valve, PCV valve, and see if any codes are stored.
An 'iffy' exhaust sniffer might cause a lean mixture at part throttle as well.

 

[BuickGN]

Just run premium. Maybe I'm too scared with a cracked cylinder, broken forged piston, and 6 blown headgaskets but pinging is very bad. If you can hear it with your ears it's bad enough to hurt things.

Ford didn't use a knock sensor on these cars?

 

[Jimmy9190]

I am no Ford expert but what might help much better than Regane could be a forced induction fuel and combustion cleaning service. You can get it done at the dealer or any reputable tire store or garage. There is one that consists of a cleaner added to the fuel tank, a spray cleaner for the throttle body and a combustion chamber/intake cleaner is run through the engine with shop air. There are different brands of the service, the ones you can get here are BG and Ever Wear. They both work very well, cost between about 90 to 120 bucks. Ever Wear has a cheaper 2 step cleaning available too. I had it done at Tires plus for $69.95 on a coupon from their website.

Whichever one you get done, it will really clean the carbon out of the system and off the pistons. The car will blow a big cloud of white smoke for about half a mile. That will let you know it worked and it should reduce and help eliminate the pinging. After the treatment, Regane every 5000 miles will keep things clean. Use a good quality name brand gas, but there should be no need for premium unless Ford says so. I have been getting really good results with the Shell nitrogen treated gas.

 

[Art_Vandelay]

Thanks guys. Ford has the car spec'd for Regular 87 octane. This car does not have a knock sensor.

Apparently the 4.6 is very prone to pinging. However it is not supposed to be a fact of life with it. Cleaning the MAF really reduced the pinging. Makes me think I can eventually get it ping free.

It has to be carbon build up right?

 

[StevieC]

Try retarding the timing a few degrees, this will help on a car that doesn't have an EGR or Knock Sensor.

 

[dwendt44]

One trick I've tried that helped was going two steps colder on spark plugs.

 

[demarpaint]

I'd check the timing, it could also be off slightly causing the ping. Make sure you follow the shop manual for the proper way to check timing. My older Ford has a spout connector that must be unplugged first. I'm not sure on the procedure for checking yours.

 

[mechtech2]

Is your coolant temp a bit too high?
Make sure your radiator is clean inside and out, and your thermostat is not too hot.
Also, electrical cleaner can leave a residue. It says it leaves no residue, but also says it leaves a protective coating!
Use dedicated MAF cleaner.
If you ignition timing is OK, use higher octane fuel if you need it.

To try and clean the CCs, try trickling distilled water into the intake [vacuum line like the PCV or brake hose] and keep the engine running at mid RPMs. This really does help clean it out
This will take more than a minute, so keep doing it.

 

[Art_Vandelay]

Originally Posted By: demarpaint
I'd check the timing, it could also be off slightly causing the ping. Make sure you follow the shop manual for the proper way to check timing. My older Ford has a spout connector that must be unplugged first. I'm not sure on the procedure for checking yours.


The timing can be off with only 65,000 miles? I figured that would be fine till at least 100k?

 

[Art_Vandelay]

Originally Posted By: mechtech2
Is your coolant temp a bit too high?
Make sure your radiator is clean inside and out, and your thermostat is not too hot.
Also, electrical cleaner can leave a residue. It says it leaves no residue, but also says it leaves a protective coating!
Use dedicated MAF cleaner.
If you ignition timing is OK, use higher octane fuel if you need it.

To try and clean the CCs, try trickling distilled water into the intake [vacuum line like the PCV or brake hose] and keep the engine running at mid RPMs. This really does help clean it out
This will take more than a minute, so keep doing it.


Thanks for all this info.

My temperature gauges always displays normal. Never indicates a hot running condition. I take it you mean to actually check it with one of those scan tools to get an exact reading?

I should probably just get the coolant flushed and filled. I never thought that could even cause this problem. I don't know how to check my thermostat, should I just replace it?

Thanks for the heads up on the MAF cleaner. It would be great if I simply used the wrong cleaner and I can cure it this way.

 

[sciphi]

CRC QD Electronics Cleaner is MAF cleaner in a different container. Works wonders for cleaning off delicate electronics.

If you replace the thermostat, check the new one opens at roughly the right temperature range before installation. Seems like new ones have worse quality control than the days of yore.

 

[Art_Vandelay]

Originally Posted By: sciphi
CRC QD Electronics Cleaner is MAF cleaner in a different container. Works wonders for cleaning off delicate electronics.

If you replace the thermostat, check the new one opens at roughly the right temperature range before installation. Seems like new ones have worse quality control than the days of yore.


Yes CRC Electronics cleaner is what I used. So you are saying that I'm good...it didn't leave the residue some other cleaners do?

I think I'll be sure to get a Motorcraft thermostat for the added quality.

I don't want to run it while it is pinging at all. So I just threw 10 gallons of Premium BP on top of the 4 remaining gallons of regular that was in there. I also put another bottle of Regane in for the heck of it. After this tank I'll run straight Premium until I correct the problem. Just like I had been doing.

 

[Jason2007]

More than likely it is carbon build up on the top of the pistons that is causing a slight raise in compression which is resulting in your pinging. Your car was designed for 87 octane and if it is pinging excessively then there is a problem and using a higher octane fuel is only masking the problem.

 

[dwendt44]

IF you are gettin plenty of heat in the winter, you could go to a 180º thermostat.

An Italian tune-up might be in order too!

 

[chevrofreak]

Originally Posted By: Jason2007
More than likely it is carbon build up on the top of the pistons that is causing a slight raise in compression which is resulting in your pinging. Your car was designed for 87 octane and if it is pinging excessively then there is a problem and using a higher octane fuel is only masking the problem.


It was designed for the 87 octane of the time. Gasoline isn't what it used to be.

 

[Jason2007]

87 octane is 87 octane, doesnt matter when.

 

[chevrofreak]

The octane number isn't the only thing that affects the way a fuel burns.

 

[Art_Vandelay]

Originally Posted By: chevrofreak

I've used alllll kind of cleaners in my 96 Crown Vic, from Sea Foam to B12 Chemtool to Amsoil Powerfoam, and even hot water, all through a vacuum hose. I've used several types of cleaners in the fuel, including several doses of Gumout Regane.

The only thing that stops the pinging is premium fuel.


Chevrofreak,

I think we can eliminate the pinging in our '96 cars. I've now read several threads on crownvic.net that point to the cooling system being the likely culprit, just as was mentioned previously. Someone even pointed out that the fan might not be functioning properly. Other possibilities include DPFE sensor or even the EGR.

Someone suggested that Carbon Buildup can be the pinging cause if the car is an older, low mileage, Grandma/Grandpa type vehicle that only saw short trips. This builds up in the cylinders which increases the compression ratio enough to cause a pinging problem. Since I bought the car when it was 12 years old with 59,000 miles that fits my PO profile. So if this is the case, for the sake of argument, would something like the Mopar Combustion cleaner be the right tool for the job? Or is there a specific professional service that Lincoln/Ford would do at the dealership? I want the deepest clean possible if this is the case.