No OPEs here ... thanks for the info on the meaning.Didn't know you were in CA, mower mayber?
Yes I have been on a few forums in regards to the 3800 and I know they over fill them. Five qts is common but 6, that wold be over an inch above the full mark
OPE - outdoor power equipment
Overfilling Engine Oil
- Thread starter Shel_B
- Start date
There is a video from the crazy.. err.. genius russians from "Garage 54" at Youtube. These guys fabricated a valve cover and a oil pan out of Acryl plastic for a Lada engine.
Interesting was that the Oil level in the pan drops about 75% when the enigne is running, because all the oil is send to a journey through the engine: Gets sucked into the pump, splashed around in the engine and is then dripping back down to the oil pan.
The oil level in the pan was so low, it was just barely enough to keep the oil pump strainer coverd.
I think a little bit of overfill therefore is really no problem. And maybe a benefit if you drive the car hard.
Interesting was that the Oil level in the pan drops about 75% when the enigne is running, because all the oil is send to a journey through the engine: Gets sucked into the pump, splashed around in the engine and is then dripping back down to the oil pan.
The oil level in the pan was so low, it was just barely enough to keep the oil pump strainer coverd.
I think a little bit of overfill therefore is really no problem. And maybe a benefit if you drive the car hard.
So to sum up, it depends on the engine.
A long banned GM engineer said that the Northstar was negatively impacted by constant overfilling of engine oil. It would end up in the PCV system and in the valleys of the intake manifold. It would sometimes cause stuck rings from excessive oil consumption, back in the days of poorly manufactured Viscosity Index Improvers. Unfortunately, most service departments would routinely overfill the N* engine, and a viscious circle would begin.
After that conversation with him, I have routinely kept my oil level slightly below the full mark. None of my Mercedes engines have ever used any oil between changes, and they will let you know IMMEDIATELY if the oil level drops below an acceptable range. I learned this by underfilling a little too much once, I needed to put in another 6 ounces of oil.
A long banned GM engineer said that the Northstar was negatively impacted by constant overfilling of engine oil. It would end up in the PCV system and in the valleys of the intake manifold. It would sometimes cause stuck rings from excessive oil consumption, back in the days of poorly manufactured Viscosity Index Improvers. Unfortunately, most service departments would routinely overfill the N* engine, and a viscious circle would begin.
After that conversation with him, I have routinely kept my oil level slightly below the full mark. None of my Mercedes engines have ever used any oil between changes, and they will let you know IMMEDIATELY if the oil level drops below an acceptable range. I learned this by underfilling a little too much once, I needed to put in another 6 ounces of oil.
Always right at or just above the full line for me. Engine only holds 3.8 quarts, needs every bit it can get and I routinely see 7000 RPM, too little oil could result in bottom end starvation at those speeds.
I'd say 99.99% of engines can tolerate an extra quart no problems, as all modern engines have windage trays to keep the oil from getting whipped up by the crank, the oil level in the pan also falls quite significantly once the engine is started.
I'd say 99.99% of engines can tolerate an extra quart no problems, as all modern engines have windage trays to keep the oil from getting whipped up by the crank, the oil level in the pan also falls quite significantly once the engine is started.
I could see that, but did he say how much it was overfilled by?
What's the "fill line" ? Do you mean "full" line ?
It's much simpler to put in 5 quarts than to find storage for numerous 1/2 quarts of residual oil. I just don't have the storage space for it. Further, having become familiar with my engine and driving style, I know the extra 1/2 quart of oil is doing no harm, and arguably is doing some good by allowing the engine to work with a little more oil.
'Numerous'? Honestly Shel, how big's your fleet?
That half quart is an ideal spare for a top up later.
Even if that's no argument there's still no reason to
overfill an engine. What's so difficult to just do what
an engine is designed for? Using the appropriate oil
and the appropriate quantity provided in the manual?
Because some people know better than the engineers
who designed that engine? You said you know that
engine. How comprehensively?
Pardon me if I sound a bit rude. I know you're a kind
and honest guy but I just don't get that and it reminds
me on the countless other threads where people think
they know better than those who made the car.
.
That half quart is an ideal spare for a top up later.
Even if that's no argument there's still no reason to
overfill an engine. What's so difficult to just do what
an engine is designed for? Using the appropriate oil
and the appropriate quantity provided in the manual?
Because some people know better than the engineers
who designed that engine? You said you know that
engine. How comprehensively?
Pardon me if I sound a bit rude. I know you're a kind
and honest guy but I just don't get that and it reminds
me on the countless other threads where people think
they know better than those who made the car.
.
I inadvertently destroyed a brand new New Holland tractor engine when it was over full. The hydraulic pump seal failed, filling the bell housing with hydraulic fluid. It pushed past the rear main seal and filled the crankcase. It ended up cracking a piston.
had I checked the oil when I was supposed to I would have probably noticed it was too high. It was a warranty fight withNew Holland, but they ultimately paid for a new engine.
This unit was used in the winter. My guess is that sub zero use with oil that was way too thick caused the failure. These tractors were not happy below zero.
had I checked the oil when I was supposed to I would have probably noticed it was too high. It was a warranty fight withNew Holland, but they ultimately paid for a new engine.
This unit was used in the winter. My guess is that sub zero use with oil that was way too thick caused the failure. These tractors were not happy below zero.
I appreciate your comments.
I've been running around with 2 half-quart containers in my trunk for more than a year because I wanted to use them for topping off. Unfortunately, the car won't cooperate ... in over 7,000 miles it's used but 12 ounces of oil, and that was only during the first change. after purchasing the vehicle used. Since the second complete change, going about 4,000 miles, nothing.
The thing is that the oil I reserved for topping off is not the oil I use now (one was left over 10W-40 from the Buick that was totaled and the other is 5W-30 Castrol EP), although at some point I may just dump it all into the engine as a Frankenbrew for a short while.
Another consideration is that I really have no place to store partially-filled oil containers - even one - other than in the trunk of the car. While that's not been a big issue for a while, it's gotten to be cumbersome because, as I noted in another post here, I am now responsible for carrying a wheelchair and a walker for an older woman who I take shopping and for walks in the local parks and byways. I'm starting to need the space in the trunk.
No, I don't think I know better than the engineers, but I do believe that the extra 1/2 quart is not going to be harmful. Actually, the "overfill" is somewhat less than 1/2 quart at a scosh more than 12-oz. The engine seems like a good place to "store" the reserved oil.
I've had the engine checked for excessive oil in the intake system (which can be a problem in some Toyotas), the PCV valve is like new, as is the EGR system ... there's no indication that the extra 12 ounces of oil are causing any issues. If I've overlooked something, let me know.
It's been said here that by filling only to the topmost fill line makes it easier to see when the engine needs oil. That's a good argument for some people, but I check the oil level at least once a week, and I know within a mm or two where the high point on the dipstick was, so I'll know when the oil is disappearing.
So, while there are those that feel I'm not doing the right thing by my car, I feel otherwise. Even though it's an older car, I don't skimp on care and maintenance, and because it's an older vehicle, I check everything I can frequently. If anything moves from normal, it's looked after. If one were to embody the Camry with a personality, I'd say it was one happy and healthy machine.
I appreciate that you've taken the time to express your concerns and that you seem to want to better understand my reason for doing what I do. BTW, I don't consider you rude.
Your average automobile engine is designed to accept extra oil because the designers know that maintenance is sloppy. That's all there is to it.
I do, 1/2 qt will barely show on the stick.
I shoot for the full mark on the dipstick when the oil is cold (mainly as an oil use tracking baseline), which makes is very slightly "over full" when hot. Been doing that on dozens of vehicles for 35+ years and zero issues.
Some cars, like Hondas, say crankcase “capacity 4.5 quarts”. Often that is to get you to halfway between “low” and “Full” on the dipstick, and that is just fine. There is room for the full 5 quarts with no harm.
