Ontario: Energy has never been cheaper...

[firemachine69]

Originally Posted By: sciphi
Corruption is corruption no matter who's in power.

What percent of Ontario's power is coming from solar and wind? And are those power sources powering communities that would otherwise be running on more expensive diesel, or supplanting energy from nuclear/hydro?

I can appreciate the sentiment for wanting renewable energy. It sounds like the residential utility customers are really getting fleeced. Time to tell the cronies the gravy train's over.



I have a dirt-simple solution.

Cancel any new contracts. Get rid of first-to-grid access. Outlaw subsidies to the "green" industry, punishable by execution for even mere association.

And the biggest one:

Make the pensions of the politicians (who voted for this green non-sense), 100% invested in "green" energy. If it fails, they have no pension. If it's subsidized, they get executed by association. Win-win all-around!

 

[HTSS_TR]

Originally Posted By: HTSS_TR
Originally Posted By: 51Plymouth
Maybe I am mistaken but I thought we have been producing a surplus of electricity for years, and selling it to our US neighbours for less than it costs us to produce. We as consumers have to pay for this loss.

Why would you do that ? You may not sell extra power to US utility companies at retail price that you charge residential customers in Canada, but anything less than cost +100% is ridiculous.

Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Because we have to get rid of it. When the wind starts blowing and we are already meeting the grid needs, where does that power go? We sell it to the US; we essentially PAY them to take it, sometimes at rates as low as 1/2 a cent a KWh whilst we are paying that generator obscene subsidized rates for their power.

As per a previous thread, we actually started dumping steam at Bruce (bypassing the turbines) to drop generation below the governor threshold because it was cheaper to dump that generation potential than it was to sell the excess wind and solar power to somebody else. That is, it is cheaper to use the subsidized wind/solar generation at whatever obscene rate they are being paid and dump the 6.5 cent power to the wind than it is to sell that power when it happens and nobody wants it.

Historically, Ontario sold power at a profit to the US. Excess generation from the nukes, hydro and old coalers, all of which were baseload providers and could be depending on would be leveraged for this purpose. With the coalers going off-line and the nukes and hydro providing the base, the base is smaller now and the intermittents dump in whenever they feel like it. If the demand is there, great! If it isn't, what do you do with the power?

This is the problem with creating these types of agreements to force a particular technology/technologies based on agenda into a market. There is no planning, no foresight and subsequently no perception of the potential consequences. These are the consequences.

It was and is too much politic in the electricity business, from renewable to exchange.

The rate that Toronto utility company export to US in 2008 was low at 6.5 cent/KWh but it wasn't a loss. But they lost $200k along with 75 GWh.

No wonder you were so upset.

California is a high cost state, everything here costs more than almost anywhere else. Our gas and electricity are one of the highest, probably only state with higher cost is Hawaii. The reason is the land is expensive, building permit is expensive, environmental cost is high, labor cost is high, tax is high ... so we pay about 20 cent KWh(for the first 200-250KWh, then 30 cent for the next 200-250 KWH and higher still for above that), about double national average. Our utility company is SCE(Southern California Edison) doesn't own any power plant(State laws prohibits it owning power plant), they just buy electricity on open market, some with contracts some on the last day when it is needed, then they charged us whatever the cost plus transmission/delivery.

We paid similar rate (after adjusted for inflation) for about 30 years so far.

 

[HTSS_TR]

Originally Posted By: HTSS_TR
We paid similar rate (after adjusted for inflation) for about 30 years so far.

Latest rate increase for SCE customers on Residential Rate Plan (Schedule D) was June 01, 2016.

Quote:
Our Standard Residential Rate Plan (Schedule D) is the basic plan serving most residential customers.

This rate plan features three pricing tiers. During each billing period, your household’s energy consumption starts in Tier 1, where the price per kilowatt hour (kWh) is lowest. Each tier has a certain amount of energy allocated to it – if you use more energy than is allocated to that tier, you move to the next, higher-priced tier.

Tier 1 15¢ 16¢ Baseline kWh (+6%)
Tier 2 21¢ 23¢ 101% to 200% over Baseline (+10%)
Tier 3 24¢ 29¢ More than 200% over Baseline (+20%)

An increase of %6 to 20% depends how much a customer use.

https://www.sce.com/wps/portal/home/residential/rates/Standard-Residential-Rate-Plan/!ut/p/b1/pVRdl5owFPwrvvAYczEgoW9p17JQXVdxd5UXTwJB6cHAQrq2_fWNHnu6brt-nPKUSybDnblDcILnOFH8pVhxXVSKl7s66S-j8IbZgdMLx19uGLCH6f2QPsY2nToGsDAAeOdhsD9v04DdhjGEwb3rQBh5M_A8c_6zh59wgpNU6Vqv8aJN5TKtlJZKL6Wy4LC2oJFtkZlVwUtTcC1bC1rNVcabrPNqs7Pb69QlVzvaOi0yvOC5J51M-Ihmfo4ckkrE-8JBRPok89PczZz0IONEn8c2xHceMDsejILJkAzYbxtOAM7YGJ3zyXyg14w-jVZGFtdrVKi8wvNX0tFe9d7OI6ap1zNMj4Ph-KPdA9o7APwABrfR2ABmEwIhmcBdzBgB6B8Ap0Z6rlmjZlVWYp-fBVOCUNN2I3PZyKb7rTGv11rX7QcLLNhut11RqFU3rTb_gq-rVuP5EWphzPbeN5vg-M_0Xc77VNAccZtI5FBhI-6ZktpZKhzpEiHtM4QTuJowuiAvxdfn54SZ8O9C_t1ovCr9f03-rYY3ETsy5aJf4jShB1cTRhfcJf9nypkrod48bCj5UaBE9KeDfKRd4dYvP2f55glxQYG45eoXceGiKQ!!/dl4/d5/L2dBISEvZ0FBIS9nQSEh/