Oil consumption M1 ESP FM 5w40 vs. T6

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BobFout

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One of my Canadian friends had this experience about oil...
08.gif


Red text is my additional information.

Quote:
2004 BEW [VW Engine code for a 1.9L 8v Unit Injector turbo diesel], now up to 173k (110k miles)

After I had the 1749VC [upgraded Garrett VNT] turbo installed on my car (custom install), it was time for an oil change. I had been using Amsoil/Total/Castrol 505.01 oils up to that point, but I have a contact who got my some Mobil 5w40 ESP at a very good price, so I decided to give it a go. Afterall, the specs are very similar to 507.00!

It didn't take long until I started needing to top her up. Keep in mind that over 4 different tdi's (98, 2000, 2002 and now the 2004), I had never, not once needed to top up the oil between oil changes. Over the 16k (10k miles) that I keept that oil, I had to do multiple top ups (like 4 or 5). I was ticked - I was sure that the guy who sold me the turbo had screwed me. There were no external leaks, no excess oil in the intercooler - it was being burnt off!

Upon Bob's [That's me] suggestion, I swapped over to Rotella T6 and presto, oil consumption stopped. It's now been 2 or 3 oil changes since and she hasn't taken a drop of oil.

No one can really explain to me why the car started taking 1 liter per 1500-2000 kms - I've spoken to multiple mechanics and they have no idea why.



Any thoughts on why M1 ESP FM 5w40 would be consumed so much, while T6 doesn't at all?
 
Very strange, as one of the ESP's listed benefits is lower oil consumption.

Edit: Only the 5w-30 ESP lists "Lower oil consumption" as a benefit. Odd.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: JRed
Very strange, as one of the ESP's listed benefits is lower oil consumption.

Edit: Only the 5w-30 ESP lists "Lower oil consumption" as a benefit. Odd.


So this might as easy as a difference in NOACK?
 
Different chemistry may change consumption. We've seen this with MB diesels changing to Mobil 1. Consumption occurs but stabilizes or stops at 10-20k miles...
 
Originally Posted By: BobFout
Originally Posted By: JRed
Very strange, as one of the ESP's listed benefits is lower oil consumption.

Edit: Only the 5w-30 ESP lists "Lower oil consumption" as a benefit. Odd.


So this might as easy as a difference in NOACK?


That's what I'm wondering. See? Can't beat Rotella T6.

Rotella T6 for everything everywhere forever.
 
FWIW he says the same thing happened in his '91 MB 350SDL. It stopped some small oil leaks too.
 
Originally Posted By: BobFout
FWIW he says the same thing happened in his '91 MB 350SDL. It stopped some small oil leaks too.


On the other hand, I tried T6 in a longitudinal 1.8T (AWM, 115K miles) after a steady diet of GC and Mobil 1 (TDT and 0W-40), and within 3K miles, the valve cover gasket was dumping oil into every spark plug well to the point that I got misfires, and down the outside of the head (among other problems that developed that I can't blame on the T6 as easily). Fuel mileage took a 3mpg hit as well.

More and more I think that motor oil for your car is like food for your dog. There are differences, some are better in general than others, some breeds/individuals have preferences - but one thing that happens quite often across the board is that when you abruptly switch the diet, the car/dog is likely to get upset in one way or another.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: dbrowne1
Originally Posted By: BobFout
FWIW he says the same thing happened in his '91 MB 350SDL. It stopped some small oil leaks too.


On the other hand, I tried T6 in a longitudinal 1.8T (AWM, 115K miles) after a steady diet of GC and Mobil 1 (TDT and 0W-40), and within 3K miles, the valve cover gasket was dumping oil into every spark plug well to the point that I got misfires, and down the outside of the head (among other problems that developed that I can't blame on the T6 as easily). Fuel mileage took a 3mpg hit as well.

More and more I think that motor oil for your car is like food for your dog. There are differences, some are better in general than others, some breeds/individuals have preferences - but one thing that happens quite often across the board is that when you abruptly switch the diet, the car/dog is likely to get upset in one way or another.



So T6 had some super-duper cleaning going on?

I can see some MPG change (3 MPG is a lot! 10% highway, 15% city) compared to GC and M1 0w40, but TDT is thicker than T6 at all temps. Doesn't make sense. Unless after a few OCIs things return to normal?
 
Originally Posted By: BobFout
Originally Posted By: dbrowne1
Originally Posted By: BobFout
FWIW he says the same thing happened in his '91 MB 350SDL. It stopped some small oil leaks too.


On the other hand, I tried T6 in a longitudinal 1.8T (AWM, 115K miles) after a steady diet of GC and Mobil 1 (TDT and 0W-40), and within 3K miles, the valve cover gasket was dumping oil into every spark plug well to the point that I got misfires, and down the outside of the head (among other problems that developed that I can't blame on the T6 as easily). Fuel mileage took a 3mpg hit as well.

More and more I think that motor oil for your car is like food for your dog. There are differences, some are better in general than others, some breeds/individuals have preferences - but one thing that happens quite often across the board is that when you abruptly switch the diet, the car/dog is likely to get upset in one way or another.



So T6 had some super-duper cleaning going on?

I can see some MPG change (3 MPG is a lot! 10% highway, 15% city) compared to GC and M1 0w40, but TDT is thicker than T6 at all temps. Doesn't make sense. Unless after a few OCIs things return to normal?


The fuel mileage drop was as compared to GC (which I had used for the last 30K miles, so 6 5K mile OCIs). I only used TDT once, much earlier in the car's life.

The valve cover gaskets could have simply [censored] out and it had nothing to do with the T6, though I tend to think that it's too much of a coincidence. Something in the other oils was keeping those seals conditioned/swollen and something in the T6 changed that.

I'm going to go back to M1 0W-40 and see how that does. T6 is a very good oil (on paper and in the real world) but it does not play well with everyone, apparently.
 
Originally Posted By: artificialist
Valve cover gaskets that fail at the sprak plug tube are universally so common, I have a hard time blaming one type of oil.


They don't normally fail so completely and suddenly throughout the entire gasket from what I have seen. This engine actually has two of them - an outer one and then an inner one with 4 separate rings that independently seal each spark plug well.

All four spark plug well "rings" and several portions of the outer gasket failed at virtually the same time shortly after the switch to T6. I'm having some trouble here calling that a coincidence, and I think it far more likely that something in, or lacking in, T6 caused this to happen.

As I already said and have said before, T6 is a very good oil. It just appears, at least in my case, to not react well with some gaskets on my 1.8T that had a steady diet of GC before.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: dbrowne1
Originally Posted By: BobFout
Originally Posted By: dbrowne1
Originally Posted By: BobFout
FWIW he says the same thing happened in his '91 MB 350SDL. It stopped some small oil leaks too.


On the other hand, I tried T6 in a longitudinal 1.8T (AWM, 115K miles) after a steady diet of GC and Mobil 1 (TDT and 0W-40), and within 3K miles, the valve cover gasket was dumping oil into every spark plug well to the point that I got misfires, and down the outside of the head (among other problems that developed that I can't blame on the T6 as easily). Fuel mileage took a 3mpg hit as well.

More and more I think that motor oil for your car is like food for your dog. There are differences, some are better in general than others, some breeds/individuals have preferences - but one thing that happens quite often across the board is that when you abruptly switch the diet, the car/dog is likely to get upset in one way or another.



So T6 had some super-duper cleaning going on?

I can see some MPG change (3 MPG is a lot! 10% highway, 15% city) compared to GC and M1 0w40, but TDT is thicker than T6 at all temps. Doesn't make sense. Unless after a few OCIs things return to normal?


The fuel mileage drop was as compared to GC (which I had used for the last 30K miles, so 6 5K mile OCIs). I only used TDT once, much earlier in the car's life.

The valve cover gaskets could have simply [censored] out and it had nothing to do with the T6, though I tend to think that it's too much of a coincidence. Something in the other oils was keeping those seals conditioned/swollen and something in the T6 changed that.

I'm going to go back to M1 0W-40 and see how that does. T6 is a very good oil (on paper and in the real world) but it does not play well with everyone, apparently.


Given that GC is 12.2 cSt at 100C and ~3.6 HTHS, T6 is 14.2 cSt at 100C and a 4.0 HTHS, I could see *some* MPG change.
 
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