50 OC's a day and you'd be looking for a wrench too, trust me. Not an excuse for an over-tight filter though.
Oil change rant...
- Thread starter travlnman
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maybe if i did 50 a day maybe but i doubt it it seems to take more time for me. i usually just grab squeeze and twist and they spin off. and if you are doing 50 a day you should know when putting it back on to use your hand or not to crank it tight with a wrench lol. some people though just tighten the snot out of stuff. i will never understand
Over the course of a day a mechanics hands get beat and exhausted at large shops with high volume. So they use something easier on the body. A shady tree backyard mechanic doing one oil change is entirely different. Thats all I was saying.
I keep one of these... I call it a "[censored] Wrench"... because some rotten [censored] put the filter on too tight.
Originally Posted By: AlienBug
How the heck did he break an oil cap?
Best I could come up with, that oil cap had two little prongs that went into a slot in the valve cover. He got one prong in and the other prong out. When he turned it back to lock it on, it got stuck. Then he broke it trying to get it back off.
How the heck did he break an oil cap?
Best I could come up with, that oil cap had two little prongs that went into a slot in the valve cover. He got one prong in and the other prong out. When he turned it back to lock it on, it got stuck. Then he broke it trying to get it back off.
WMSmotorhead...that is hilarious ! I used an old belt, ran the end thru opposite what you would normally do, and let her bite in and pull !! I understand the mechanics get roughed up, I am one, just not for cars professionally. I am a field service tech on CNC machine tools, and I take a beating every day. My wife begs me to use lotion on my hands to soften em up, but no way ! Those are my built in gloves ! I have to work on folks greasy , grungy, machines in hot miserable shops. I don't get to take shortcuts, if the machine repair calls for a certain procedure or spec it has to be that way. chevyboy, I would call , but it would be a waste of time. I do all my own stuff, at least as long as it does not require large, specialized equipment. It was just one of those times that it got away from me. The lesson here, just do it myself..always, no exceptions, and then I will only have myself to blame
This is one application where I like the manufacturer's recommendations. Most OTC filters have directions on the box that explain 3/4 of a turn past the gasket making contact is the appropriate torque. Anymore, many vehicles don't have enough clearance to use most filter wrenches.
Some days, even filters I put on will have gaskets that really swelled up... so if I'm feeling lazy, I just grab it. It's teeth will bite in and give you enough power to remove most any filter.
Gotta love the Baztardz Wrench.
Gotta love the Baztardz Wrench.
Originally Posted By: travlnman
...at age 43 and millions of miles..I have never needed a wrench to remove a filter that I installed and never had any issues with leaks, so why would any rational human being just keep tightening it ? It is not necessary, it is not better, and it upsets me that common sense is so rare these days it practically a superpower. Filters do not tighten themselves...
Agreed. I don't know what some of these people do. Occasionally, I do have to use an oil filter wrench to get one off, but that's as much a function of the filter's location and orientation as the tightness. But, that's a far cry from having to get out the Channel Locks or a big screwdriver to use as a javelin.
...at age 43 and millions of miles..I have never needed a wrench to remove a filter that I installed and never had any issues with leaks, so why would any rational human being just keep tightening it ? It is not necessary, it is not better, and it upsets me that common sense is so rare these days it practically a superpower. Filters do not tighten themselves...
Agreed. I don't know what some of these people do. Occasionally, I do have to use an oil filter wrench to get one off, but that's as much a function of the filter's location and orientation as the tightness. But, that's a far cry from having to get out the Channel Locks or a big screwdriver to use as a javelin.
I tighten my filters as tight as I can possibly go by hand and then do an extra 1/8th of a turn by wrench. Yes it's probably unnecessary but I don't care, it gives me a sense of assurance that it wont leak.
So yeah, you'd be unlikely to get one of mine off without a filter wrench, but personally I don't consider them overtightened. I coat the o-ring/gasket of the new filter with fresh oil, I double check there is no stuck gasket left behind. And though I do need the wrench to remove them I've never had an issue with this.
So yeah, you'd be unlikely to get one of mine off without a filter wrench, but personally I don't consider them overtightened. I coat the o-ring/gasket of the new filter with fresh oil, I double check there is no stuck gasket left behind. And though I do need the wrench to remove them I've never had an issue with this.
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Originally Posted By: travlnman
Critic, You missed reading that part I guess....at age 43 and millions of miles..I have never needed a wrench to remove a filter that I installed and never had any issues with leaks, so why would any rational human being just keep tightening it ? It is not necessary, it is not better, and it upsets me that common sense is so rare these days it practically a superpower. Filters do not tighten themselves...there is an established procedure for installing a filter, basically what you described in your post, and using that, it will not require any tools to remove. Spin on oil filters should never need any tools to install or remove.That being said....it plainly says "rant" in the title...what did you expect ?
I guess the logic here was better too tight than too loose, right? Of course I fully agree with you that properly tightened is the key. However, as you have seen in the responses, the interpretation of "properly tightened" is subjective.
Originally Posted By: uart
I tighten my filters as tight as I can possibly go by hand and then do an extra 1/8th of a turn by wrench. Yes it's probably unnecessary but I don't care, it gives me a sense of assurance that it wont leak.
So yeah, you'd be unlikely to get one of mine off without a filter wrench, but personally I don't consider them overtightened. I coat the o-ring/gasket of the new filter with fresh oil, I double check there is no stuck gasket left behind. And though I do need the wrench to remove them I've never had an issue with this.
+1
Critic, You missed reading that part I guess....at age 43 and millions of miles..I have never needed a wrench to remove a filter that I installed and never had any issues with leaks, so why would any rational human being just keep tightening it ? It is not necessary, it is not better, and it upsets me that common sense is so rare these days it practically a superpower. Filters do not tighten themselves...there is an established procedure for installing a filter, basically what you described in your post, and using that, it will not require any tools to remove. Spin on oil filters should never need any tools to install or remove.That being said....it plainly says "rant" in the title...what did you expect ?
I guess the logic here was better too tight than too loose, right? Of course I fully agree with you that properly tightened is the key. However, as you have seen in the responses, the interpretation of "properly tightened" is subjective.
Originally Posted By: uart
I tighten my filters as tight as I can possibly go by hand and then do an extra 1/8th of a turn by wrench. Yes it's probably unnecessary but I don't care, it gives me a sense of assurance that it wont leak.
So yeah, you'd be unlikely to get one of mine off without a filter wrench, but personally I don't consider them overtightened. I coat the o-ring/gasket of the new filter with fresh oil, I double check there is no stuck gasket left behind. And though I do need the wrench to remove them I've never had an issue with this.
+1
I twist mine on as far as they go with one hand, then give them a little extra with both hands, and always use some sort of wrench to remove them. No problems so far.
Much ado about nothing. The filter came off. The plug wasn't stripped. The only issue is of high expectations. A body can't expect the entire world to work to their own very particular specifications. I suspect, however, that we may be a more exacting bunch here on BITOG.
That being said, the drain plug being tightened to within an inch of its life is problematic. It may weaken the threads and die the next time stressed.
I did the tranny fluid and oil/filter this weekend on the Prius. Used a torque wrench on the plugs, and tightened the oil filter past what the OP would have. My spec is as hand tight as I can get it and then a little more. Naturally, I expect to use a wrench of some sort to remove it later. I love the swivelling filter wrench(es) I have, but use the cap for the Prius filter.
That being said, the drain plug being tightened to within an inch of its life is problematic. It may weaken the threads and die the next time stressed.
I did the tranny fluid and oil/filter this weekend on the Prius. Used a torque wrench on the plugs, and tightened the oil filter past what the OP would have. My spec is as hand tight as I can get it and then a little more. Naturally, I expect to use a wrench of some sort to remove it later. I love the swivelling filter wrench(es) I have, but use the cap for the Prius filter.
I have had to deal with a stripped drain plug before, thankfully i was doing my own oil on a military base, in the do it yourself auto skills center, so i just paid 4 bucks and got a 16mm bolt instead of the 12mm factory one, to replace the OE one that was stripped on the focus from a fleet owner.
Originally Posted By: travlnman
The lesson here, just do it myself..always, no exceptions, and then I will only have myself to blame
That is my theory as well.
The only filters I've had trouble with were put on by someone else, with the exception of 1 Baldwin but I suspect someone cranked that one down looking for an oil leak. I try to follow the guidelines on the side of the can and have never had a leaker so far. I only bought a wrench recently to do a spin-on transmission filter that I thought might be a bear to get off...it would have been with out it.
The lesson here, just do it myself..always, no exceptions, and then I will only have myself to blame
That is my theory as well.
The only filters I've had trouble with were put on by someone else, with the exception of 1 Baldwin but I suspect someone cranked that one down looking for an oil leak. I try to follow the guidelines on the side of the can and have never had a leaker so far. I only bought a wrench recently to do a spin-on transmission filter that I thought might be a bear to get off...it would have been with out it.
A few years back when I had my SRT Neon, I did the first oil change on it... it was, and still is the worst oil change I've ever done. The drain plug was overly tight (which is common to see), but the filter was a whole other story. First of all, it was very accessible and easy to grab, so you'd think that'd make it easier. So I try to remove it by hand, no luck. Filter strap wrench, you say? No luck there either. Punch a screwdriver through it? Nope. Ultimately, it took a massive screwdriver to get it to budge, and eventually get it off. All in all it took several hours
Having once worked at an express lube, every few months a customer would bring their car back claiming we caused oil stains in their driveway. They would usually say we didn't tighten the filter because their neighbor/uncle/husband/son/cousin/etc. was able to tighten it more than what we had. So it appears the general public also believes in the "smoke it down as tight as it will go" philosophy.
Despite showing them their old work order where the mechanic documented an oil leak, they were convinced the oil was coming from the "loose" filter.
So this may explain the tight filter syndrome. Another reason may be to discourage tampering to CAUSE an oil leak when someone decides they need a new engine. Yes, I saw this too, once.
Despite showing them their old work order where the mechanic documented an oil leak, they were convinced the oil was coming from the "loose" filter.
So this may explain the tight filter syndrome. Another reason may be to discourage tampering to CAUSE an oil leak when someone decides they need a new engine. Yes, I saw this too, once.
Hand tight and a quarter to half a turn are the instructions on many oil filters, after oiling the gasket. Eh...what do THEY know? I have seen overtight filters cause gasket distortion to the point they don't seal correctly.
Those oil filter plyers DO NOT always work! Case in point, I had to change the spin on filter for the transmission on a 96 Saturn SC2. The filter begin to give way and the plyers slipped off.
Had to use huge channel lock plumber type wrench, not sure what it's called exactly. Anyways, it got a good grip and pulled it off.
Had to use huge channel lock plumber type wrench, not sure what it's called exactly. Anyways, it got a good grip and pulled it off.
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