New Z4

[wings&wheels]

Originally Posted by MCompact
Not for me.
Ever.

me neither...of course now i'm off to swap an airplane battery...I need new hobbies...wonder how sensible people have fun...maybe golf

 

[wag123]

Originally Posted by MCompact
Originally Posted by SEBZX79
Its funny how people who have not owned one or driven one make these crazy comments. Because you read something on the internet it does not make it true.

Just admit it; deep down what you REALLY lust for is a vanilla sedan that you can drive for 300,000 bleak and joyless miles without doing anything other than changing the oil.

Unfortunately, given the horrific traffic and awful roads where I live, the term "fun-to-drive" does not exist in my vocabulary any longer. I'll gladly take the comfortable and reliable long-life appliance for my daily local driving and chores, thank you. I don't drive long distances any longer either, I fly. Vehicles that break down frequently and/or need constant attention just create more stress in my world.
Since I retired, I have to be very careful with my budget. Frankly, I can't afford a vehicle that depreciates astronomically and costs a fortune to keep on the road. $1200 brake jobs and $1400 sets of tires every 30k miles? No thank you. I NEED a vehicle that has a reasonable purchase price, doesn't break, is inexpensive to operate, and lasts a long time. I appreciate vehicles that can actually make it to 300k miles. None of the European auto manufacturer's vehicles meet my needs. Would I like to have one if I could afford it? Of course! Also, at my age and being married for 39 years, I no longer feel the need to make a fashion statement or try to impress anyone. It comes down to priorities, and money (or lack thereof) changes ones priorities. Some day all of you will understand where I'm coming from (unless you are independently wealthy).

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted by wag123
Originally Posted by MCompact
Originally Posted by SEBZX79
Its funny how people who have not owned one or driven one make these crazy comments. Because you read something on the internet it does not make it true.

Just admit it; deep down what you REALLY lust for is a vanilla sedan that you can drive for 300,000 bleak and joyless miles without doing anything other than changing the oil.

Unfortunately, given the horrific traffic and awful roads where I live, the term "fun-to-drive" does not exist in my vocabulary any longer. I'll gladly take the comfortable and reliable long-life appliance for my daily local driving and chores, thank you. I don't drive long distances any longer either, I fly. Vehicles that break down frequently and/or need constant attention just create more stress in my world.
Since I retired, I have to be very careful with my budget. Frankly, I can't afford a vehicle that depreciates astronomically and costs a fortune to keep on the road. $1200 brake jobs and $1400 sets of tires every 30k miles? No thank you. I NEED a vehicle that has a reasonable purchase price, doesn't break, is inexpensive to operate, and lasts a long time. I appreciate vehicles that can actually make it to 300k miles. None of the European auto manufacturer's vehicles meet my needs. Would I like to have one if I could afford it? Of course! Also, at my age I no longer feel the need to make a fashion statement or try to impress anyone. It comes down to priorities, and money (or lack thereof) changes ones priorities. Some day all of you will understand where I'm coming from (unless you are independently wealthy).

2013 BMW X5 35d sport package:
Brembo front rotors-pair (on sale): $120
ATE brake pads (regular price, OE supplier): $86
Pagid rear rotors (regular price): 2x64
ATE rear pads: $57

2015 Toyota Sienna:
EBC Ultimax rotors-Pair (on sale): $134
EBC Greenstuff pads (on sale): $114
Toyota OE pads-rear (In dealership): $64
Do not know rear rotors how much, still good.

So, what else friend of your second cousin told you about brakes on BMW?

 

[MCompact]

Originally Posted by wings&wheels

me neither...of course now i'm off to swap an airplane battery...I need new hobbies...wonder how sensible people have fun...maybe golf

I almost went the private pilot route- had a chance to buy a nice Ercoupe(weird aircraft fascinate me). As it is, a friend is tempting me with a Europa that has a newly rebuilt engine- then again I've always liked Jensen Interceptors. And then there's the fact that I live 90 minutes away from Excelsior Motors, which opens the door to a nice SM.
Yes, it's a sickness...

 

[wag123]

Originally Posted by edyvw
Originally Posted by wag123
Originally Posted by MCompact
Originally Posted by SEBZX79
Its funny how people who have not owned one or driven one make these crazy comments. Because you read something on the internet it does not make it true.

Just admit it; deep down what you REALLY lust for is a vanilla sedan that you can drive for 300,000 bleak and joyless miles without doing anything other than changing the oil.

Unfortunately, given the horrific traffic and awful roads where I live, the term "fun-to-drive" does not exist in my vocabulary any longer. I'll gladly take the comfortable and reliable long-life appliance for my daily local driving and chores, thank you. I don't drive long distances any longer either, I fly. Vehicles that break down frequently and/or need constant attention just create more stress in my world.
Since I retired, I have to be very careful with my budget. Frankly, I can't afford a vehicle that depreciates astronomically and costs a fortune to keep on the road. $1200 brake jobs and $1400 sets of tires every 30k miles? No thank you. I NEED a vehicle that has a reasonable purchase price, doesn't break, is inexpensive to operate, and lasts a long time. I appreciate vehicles that can actually make it to 300k miles. None of the European auto manufacturer's vehicles meet my needs. Would I like to have one if I could afford it? Of course! Also, at my age I no longer feel the need to make a fashion statement or try to impress anyone. It comes down to priorities, and money (or lack thereof) changes ones priorities. Some day all of you will understand where I'm coming from (unless you are independently wealthy).

2013 BMW X5 35d sport package:
Brembo front rotors-pair (on sale): $120
ATE brake pads (regular price, OE supplier): $86
Pagid rear rotors (regular price): 2x64
ATE rear pads: $57

2015 Toyota Sienna:
EBC Ultimax rotors-Pair (on sale): $134
EBC Greenstuff pads (on sale): $114
Toyota OE pads-rear (In dealership): $64
Do not know rear rotors how much, still good.

So, what else friend of your second cousin told you about brakes on BMW?

I told you that I was involved in the car business for the better part of 45 years so I have SOME experience in these things. Not EVERYONE is capable of doing their own repairs and maintenance (I am). $1200 is about the going price of BMW brake jobs at both of the BMW dealers here (more on some high performance models). $900-$1000 is what most of the BMW specialists charge. Sienna brake jobs are a fraction of this because THE ROTORS CAN BE RESURFACED. I notice that you didn't argue about $1400 sets of tires. You must be independently wealthy edyvw.

 

[RooflessVW]

Originally Posted by MCompact
Not for me.
Ever.

 

[MCompact]

Originally Posted by wag123

Unfortunately, given the horrific traffic and awful roads where I live, the term "fun-to-drive" does not exist in my vocabulary any longer. I'll gladly take the comfortable and reliable long-life appliance for my daily local driving and chores, thank you. I don't drive long distances any longer either, I fly. Vehicles that break down frequently and/or need constant attention just create more stress in my world.
Since I retired, I have to be very careful with my budget. Frankly, I can't afford a vehicle that depreciates astronomically and costs a fortune to keep on the road. $1200 brake jobs and $1400 sets of tires every 30k miles? No thank you. I NEED a vehicle that has a reasonable purchase price, doesn't break, is inexpensive to operate, and lasts a long time. I appreciate vehicles that can actually make it to 300k miles. None of the European auto manufacturer's vehicles meet my needs. Would I like to have one if I could afford it? Of course! Also, at my age and being married for 39 years, I no longer feel the need to make a fashion statement or try to impress anyone. It comes down to priorities, and money (or lack thereof) changes ones priorities. Some day all of you will understand where I'm coming from (unless you are independently wealthy).


Well, a Cooper Clubman handles my DD duties; glacially slow(0-60 in just under 10 seconds) but still engaging, it returns 38 mpg or more. Brakes? Even my HPDE BMWs usually manage to eke 50k miles or better from the front pads- and up to 100k from the rear pads. As for tires? I refuse to compromise- sometimes you DO have to pay to play. Me, I'm 62 and married for 33 years. Fortunately my wife hates boring cars as well; we had just one kid in order to avoid Minivan Purgatory. I retired in 2014 and then in 2016 went back to work- this time just for fun. For me, a car-even my DD-simply must be fun to drive. There's not a thing wrong with most any of the cars built by the Big 3, Honda, Toyota, or Hyundai/Kia- but there are at most only two or three cars from each brand I could realistically see myself owning. Ditto for Audi, Infiniti, Lexus, Mercedes, and VW. As for BMW and Porsche, up that to four or five cars. The bottom line is that I simply cannot imagine leaving my office at the end of a crazy day only to be faced with the prospect of having to drive home in a soul-slaughtering anodyne transportation pod. The additional expense required to maintain cars that I find to be involving and entertaining is more than worth it.

 

[SEBZX79]

Bmw roters can be resurfaced as well plus they softer pads ao i never had to buy new ones or resurface them.

 

[MCompact]

Originally Posted by SEBZX79
Bmw roters can be resurfaced as well plus they softer pads ao i never had to buy new ones or resurface them.


My BMW dealer doesn't automatically replace rotors with every pad chains; in my case several times they have just replaced the pads only.

 

[wag123]

Originally Posted by MCompact
Originally Posted by wag123

Unfortunately, given the horrific traffic and awful roads where I live, the term "fun-to-drive" does not exist in my vocabulary any longer. I'll gladly take the comfortable and reliable long-life appliance for my daily local driving and chores, thank you. I don't drive long distances any longer either, I fly. Vehicles that break down frequently and/or need constant attention just create more stress in my world.
Since I retired, I have to be very careful with my budget. Frankly, I can't afford a vehicle that depreciates astronomically and costs a fortune to keep on the road. $1200 brake jobs and $1400 sets of tires every 30k miles? No thank you. I NEED a vehicle that has a reasonable purchase price, doesn't break, is inexpensive to operate, and lasts a long time. I appreciate vehicles that can actually make it to 300k miles. None of the European auto manufacturer's vehicles meet my needs. Would I like to have one if I could afford it? Of course! Also, at my age and being married for 39 years, I no longer feel the need to make a fashion statement or try to impress anyone. It comes down to priorities, and money (or lack thereof) changes ones priorities. Some day all of you will understand where I'm coming from (unless you are independently wealthy).


Well, a Cooper Clubman handles my DD duties; glacially slow(0-60 in just under 10 seconds) but still engaging, it returns 38 mpg or more. Brakes? Even my HPDE BMWs usually manage to eke 50k miles or better from the front pads- and up to 100k from the rear pads. As for tires? I refuse to compromise- sometimes you DO have to pay to play. Me, I'm 62 and married for 33 years. Fortunately my wife hates boring cars as well; we had just one kid in order to avoid Minivan Purgatory. I retired in 2014 and then in 2016 went back to work- this time just for fun. For me, a car-even my DD-simply must be fun to drive. There's not a thing wrong with most any of the cars built by the Big 3, Honda, Toyota, or Hyundai/Kia- but there are at most only two or three cars from each brand I could realistically see myself owning. Ditto for Audi, Infiniti, Lexus, Mercedes, and VW. As for BMW and Porsche, up that to four or five cars. The bottom line is that I simply cannot imagine leaving my office at the end of a crazy day only to be faced with the prospect of having to drive home in a soul-slaughtering anodyne transportation pod. The additional expense required to maintain cars that I find to be involving and entertaining is more than worth it.

If I lived where you live, since I can do my own repairs/maintenance, I would be tempted to buy/drive something entertaining (used, new BMWs are too pricey for my budget and depreciate too much too quickly). Where I live it can take 40 minutes to go 5 miles and over an hour during the rush hours. There isn't any fun in that! Even in the rural areas close to where I live, it isn't any fun to drive with all of the moron drivers, traffic signals, and deer.

 

[wag123]

Originally Posted by SEBZX79
Bmw roters can be resurfaced as well plus they softer pads ao i never had to buy new ones or resurface them.

On rotors it is replace ONLY according to BMW.

Originally Posted by MCompact
My BMW dealer doesn't automatically replace rotors with every pad chains; in my case several times they have just replaced the pads only.

The BMW dealers around here will not do a brake job without replacing the rotors.

 

[PimTac]

Braggadocio is more like it. Bragging about going 130 on the freeway says it all.

I'm with you Wag. Not all of us work on our cars. I don't want to make regular trips to the shop for overpriced work. I also don't drive like a maniac as some. In fact our local traffic doesn't allow it unless your doped up on something.

 

[MCompact]

Originally Posted by PimTac
Braggadocio is more like it. Bragging about going 130 on the freeway says it all.

I'm with you Wag. Not all of us work on our cars. I don't want to make regular trips to the shop for overpriced work. I also don't drive like a maniac as some. In fact our local traffic doesn't allow it unless your doped up on something.



Hmm... my newer cars average one trip to the shop per year- for scheduled maintenance. It's not exactly a hardship, what with complementary loaners. I perform some minor maintenance on the older cars; it's fun and relaxing.
As for fast driving- ever heard of HPDEs?

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

Originally Posted by wag123



I told you that I was involved in the car business for the better part of 45 years so I have SOME experience in these things. Not EVERYONE is capable of doing their own repairs and maintenance (I am). $1200 is about the going price of BMW brake jobs at both of the BMW dealers here (more on some high performance models). $900-$1000 is what most of the BMW specialists charge. Sienna brake jobs are a fraction of this because THE ROTORS CAN BE RESURFACED. I notice that you didn't argue about $1400 sets of tires. You must be independently wealthy edyvw.



BMW is turning rotors now, but ya. $1200 for full set of brakes by an Indy sounds about right.

 

[wag123]

Originally Posted by PimTac
Braggadocio is more like it. Bragging about going 130 on the freeway says it all.

I'm with you Wag. Not all of us work on our cars. I don't want to make regular trips to the shop for overpriced work. I also don't drive like a maniac as some. In fact our local traffic doesn't allow it unless your doped up on something.

Between the heavy traffic and the morons that hog the left lane (and don't look before changing lanes), we can't go 130 on the freeways around here, more like 30 if you are lucky and it isn't during the rush hours.

 

[PimTac]

Originally Posted by wag123
Originally Posted by PimTac
Braggadocio is more like it. Bragging about going 130 on the freeway says it all.

I'm with you Wag. Not all of us work on our cars. I don't want to make regular trips to the shop for overpriced work. I also don't drive like a maniac as some. In fact our local traffic doesn't allow it unless your doped up on something.

Between the heavy traffic and the morons that hog the left lane (and don't look before changing lanes), we can't go 130 on the freeways around here, more like 30 if you are lucky and it isn't during the rush hours.




Same here.

 

[MCompact]

I drive 12 miles of rural two lanes to work; if I hit the four traffic lights right it takes me under 20 minutes. If I'm lucky I can see north of 60 mph for a few miles. If I take a conflict assignment I try to make sure that the location is accessible by an entertaining route.

 

[vavavroom]

Originally Posted by ragtoplvr
tell me do they still use biodegradable wiring and plastic that will begin to fail in 10 years or less. This is one reason why I avoid German made cars.


Most car manufacturers use bio-plastics these days. Early bio-degradable plastics could deteriorate under heat and moisture but the newer ones don't do that. The fear that current biodegradable plastics do not hold up sufficiently is pretty groundless. In order for deterioration to occur the conditions must be right. The microbes that decompose bio-plastics live in the landfill. While rodents love snacking on soy-based wiring insulation, they also love the synthetics in some of my older cars and even snacked on my lawnmower tires.

 

[edyvw]

Quote
I told you that I was involved in the car business for the better part of 45 years so I have SOME experience in these things. Not EVERYONE is capable of doing their own repairs and maintenance (I am). $1200 is about the going price of BMW brake jobs at both of the BMW dealers here (more on some high performance models). $900-$1000 is what most of the BMW specialists charge. Sienna brake jobs are a fraction of this because THE ROTORS CAN BE RESURFACED. I notice that you didn't argue about $1400 sets of tires. You must be independently wealthy edyvw.

No wonder you WERE in the business.
So Toyota Quality Control allows resurfacing? LOL.
BMW actually does resurfacing too (in the US only though), but IMO no person should drive a car if they cannot buy set of rotors for vehicle they drive (I would say they live above their means). BMW rarely resurface rotors because they wear out to minimum thickness, rather nicely. Toyota on other hand, does not. I had vibrating rotors on Sienna when I bought it in September (had 42k) and would never resurface rotors. I have 2 1/2 year old and 2 1/2 week old newborn. I am NOT going to play Toyota games with brakes.
Tires COULD BE $1400. Actually tires could be for ANY car $1400 (when my wife and I were dating, before we knew each other that good, she went to Discount tire with her 2006 Nissan Sentra Limited Edition and got two Michelin Primacy tires for $800. I think size was 195/50 R15, but not sure. For Nissan Sentra!!! Also, she paid ball joint for lower control arm $400 in dealership).
But to answer your question about tires for BMW.
2017 Las Vegas, irreparable nail damage on Bridgestone Dualer H/L400 RFT. Put new set of Michelin Premier LTX tires, 255/50 R19 109 V, out the door price: $1087.
2017 November: Set of Michelin Latitude X-Ice Xi2, 255/55 R18 109 T, price out the door: $694
2015 November: Set of Bridgestone Blizzak DM-V2, 255/55 R18 109T, price out the door: $741
Toyota Sienna:
2018 November: Set of Michelin latitude X-Ice Xi2 235/60 R17 102 T(I think it is 102T), price out of the door: $611.
Labor costs per hour:
- Winslow BMW Colorado Springs: $95 (they were changing SCR cat, so now how much it is).
- Larry H. Miller Toyota Colorado Springs: $107. they put block heater (2GR-FE needs eternity to warm up, to the point when its too cold wife and I just take VW.) and wanted warranty on that product, so I know how much they charge per hour.

I changed rotors and pads on numerous vehicles, and all European vehicles I ever had take less time than Toyota.
If $1200 is price for brake job on let's say BMW X5, Sienna is not far from it in Toyota dealership (now, Toyota does offer "economy line" brakes. I seriously would not like to know what that POS is considering regular line). However, difference in performance and QUALITY makes investment in BMW brakes WELL worth it. I would pay twice just to have brakes from X5 on Sienna.
But to talk about quality, and then resurfacing is really something special.

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted by MCompact
Originally Posted by SEBZX79
Bmw roters can be resurfaced as well plus they softer pads ao i never had to buy new ones or resurface them.


My BMW dealer doesn't automatically replace rotors with every pad chains; in my case several times they have just replaced the pads only.

BMW rotors can do at least two set of pads. We are talking here about BMW quality, no need for resurfacing like on Toyota