New Presidential Permit for Keystone XL Pipeline

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And that's a typical green methodology rather than engaging in the debate..."look over there a bunny strawman"
 
Originally Posted by P10crew
It's not only going to be tar sands oil in this one. There is a spur into the Baaken as well. Pretty sure this XL is 18" pipe. I have been on several upgrade jobs where we build what we call "take off bays" in our substations that will feed 1 pumpstation along the route.115 kv 2000 amp. Crazy amounts of megawatts moving crazy amounts of oil coming from plays that are expected to last many many years. On the XL they need 1 pump station every 50 or 52 pipe miles.


Actually, the XL pipeline will be 36 " pipe.
smile.gif
 
Originally Posted by Shannow
Cool, now that you are online...please enlighten us about your stated knowledge of coal plants and bird life...you missed responding to that.




Good luck with that.
 
10-4 snaggle the first one is 1/2 size of XL. I'll be cruzing past a lay down yard on my way home from this job I'm on now. That's always a pretty good indication if they are moving forward or still on hold.
 
Originally Posted by P10crew
10-4 snaggle the first one is 1/2 size of XL. I'll be cruzing past a lay down yard on my way home from this job I'm on now. That's always a pretty good indication if they are moving forward or still on hold.


I would appreciate hearing any news. Sometimes the press white washes everything.
smile.gif
 
No change at the one lay down yard that I go past about monthly.

My state passed a law that will allow governments to recoup cost's associated with protests like the DAPL madness.

There will be a river bore that will be just upstream from a reservation. Both sides I'm sure are prepping for that one.
 
Originally Posted by Shannow
Cool, now that you are online...please enlighten us about your stated knowledge of coal plants and bird life...you missed responding to that.

Sulfur levels around local power plant. And I live in pretty conservative city, city that was ranked few years back as most conservative metro area in the US. But you ain't gonna find supporters for keeping coal plant open.
 
Eddy
Not too awfully far north of you still lies a 100 year supply of coal in the ground. Burn it now it's cheap and cleaner than ever. A lot of coal steamers were forced by obummer to convert to natural gas or shut down. I would like to see the natural gas companies charge me at the rate the converted steamers are paying. Lol
There is so much natural gas in the bakken being flaired off if you search for night pics of the area it looks like a giant city. Now they have the huge play going in Texas. Coal will for the time being be passed over for the cheaper NG.
 
Originally Posted by edyvw
Originally Posted by Shannow
Cool, now that you are online...please enlighten us about your stated knowledge of coal plants and bird life...you missed responding to that.

Sulfur levels around local power plant. And I live in pretty conservative city, city that was ranked few years back as most conservative metro area in the US. But you ain't gonna find supporters for keeping coal plant open.


linkys ???

I've been working on coal plants for three decades....bird poop everywhere, safety alerts for swooping magpies and plovers, watching eagles ride the thermals...Ducks in the ash ponds and coal ponds, owls in thequieter areas.

(Oh and not to mention frogs out the wazoo).

So got any links ?
 
I checked this evening as I let work...could hear the birdsong over the hum of the turbines.

Bird faeces on guard rails and handrails...pee-wee (magpie lark) sitting on a 330KV transformer bushing, singing it's heart out.

30 kangaroos watched me make these observations
 
Originally Posted by Shannow
I checked this evening as I let work...could hear the birdsong over the hum of the turbines.

Bird faeces on guard rails and handrails...pee-wee (magpie lark) sitting on a 330KV transformer bushing, singing it's heart out.

30 kangaroos watched me make these observations

So, your point seams that coal is contributing to biodiversity?
https://coloradosun.com/2019/03/19/colorado-coal-ash-water-contamination/
No one gives a s... about birds. Problem is when you trying to sell area as training site for Olympians (US Olympic committee is in Colorado Springs) and power plant is part of scenic view, and everything else that comes from it.
 
Originally Posted by P10crew
Eddy
Not too awfully far north of you still lies a 100 year supply of coal in the ground. Burn it now it's cheap and cleaner than ever. A lot of coal steamers were forced by obummer to convert to natural gas or shut down. I would like to see the natural gas companies charge me at the rate the converted steamers are paying. Lol
There is so much natural gas in the bakken being flaired off if you search for night pics of the area it looks like a giant city. Now they have the huge play going in Texas. Coal will for the time being be passed over for the cheaper NG.

Yeah, they are converting to Natural Gas, I did not say they should not covert to natural gas.
Just because I said that windmills and birds are not an issue (and no one is dying from cancer being "caused" by windmills) that does not mean I do not support natural gas or nuclear (which I believe will have to be seriously discussed again, though I highly doubt we will come up to solution like France did).
But, for CO problem with coal is not only pollution per se, it is tourism which brings MUCH more money than coal industry. This winter US ski resorts sold 59 million beds, of those 59 million, 34 million were sold in CO. Pollution in general is big issue in CO bcs. huge chunk of economy is relying on tourism that is relying on clean environment.
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted by edyvw
No one gives a s... about birds. Problem is when you trying to sell area as training site for Olympians (US Olympic committee is in Colorado Springs) and power plant is part of scenic view, and everything else that comes from it.

I'm curious as to the meaning of this. I take it that the committee is offended by what they see? If so, that really isn't an energy or scientific matter, but something else.
 
Originally Posted by Garak
Originally Posted by edyvw
No one gives a s... about birds. Problem is when you trying to sell area as training site for Olympians (US Olympic committee is in Colorado Springs) and power plant is part of scenic view, and everything else that comes from it.

I'm curious as to the meaning of this. I take it that the committee is offended by what they see? If so, that really isn't an energy or scientific matter, but something else.

Nah, it is easy to find that air does not meet latest EPA standards, by large margin.
US Olympic center is big thing here, and any kind of issue around it prompts bipartisan action. No one, even die hard supporters of coal are arguing not to close down plants here.
Committee wants certain conditions. It is not only American athletes that train here, but all around the world. That has much higher economic impact than any coal plant or whatever. However, Drake power plant is literally few blocks away from training center, and it became issue.
 
Originally Posted by edyvw
Originally Posted by Shannow
I checked this evening as I let work...could hear the birdsong over the hum of the turbines.

Bird faeces on guard rails and handrails...pee-wee (magpie lark) sitting on a 330KV transformer bushing, singing it's heart out.

30 kangaroos watched me make these observations

So, your point seams that coal is contributing to biodiversity?
https://coloradosun.com/2019/03/19/colorado-coal-ash-water-contamination/
No one gives a s... about birds. Problem is when you trying to sell area as training site for Olympians (US Olympic committee is in Colorado Springs) and power plant is part of scenic view, and everything else that comes from it.


No...
YOU made a specific statement (actually a strawman argument regarding wind turbines killing things), by pointing out that youdon't see birds around coal plants.

I asked you to defend that statement, as they are everywhere around all the one's that I've been around for 30+ years.

YOU brought up sulfur emissions, to which I asked for supporting evidence (none), I googled about the lack of birds in Colorado Springs, and there's pages of "look at our birds"...while you still haven't provided evidence of no birds around coal plants, and specifically for sulfur emissions, I mentioned that yet again, there's birds all over the place...

So now it's coal water ash contamination....look over there a bunny...and placing words in my mouth.

Please back your own statements, not diversionary tactics...

So...back to no birds in COlorado Springs because there's sulfur emissions...your claim...your evidence....

As to the scenic view...and the conservatism of your locale...this is Conservative NIMBYism at it's best.

Buy low...close down the reason for buying low and improve property prices overnight, while citing nonsense that you won't even attempt to back....


So...no birds, coal plant sulfur...back to your claim.
 
Originally Posted by edyvw
[and power plant is part of scenic view, and everything else that comes from it.


was it there when you bought property there ?
 
Originally Posted by edyvw

But, for CO problem with coal is not only pollution per se, it is tourism which brings MUCH more money than coal industry. This winter US ski resorts sold 59 million beds, of those 59 million, 34 million were sold in CO. Pollution in general is big issue in CO bcs. huge chunk of economy is relying on tourism that is relying on clean environment.



So where do you propose to get the energy to support this tourism ?

Or are you proposing 1800's farmstead tourism ?

Or are you proposing Someone Else's back yard ?

Or are tourists going to flock to see the visual amenity of thousands of acres of wind farms ?

Originally Posted by edyvw

No one gives a s... about birds.



Originally Posted by edyvw

Just because I said that windmills and birds are not an issue


LOL apparently so...
 
Originally Posted by edyvw
Nah, it is easy to find that air does not meet latest EPA standards, by large margin.


That's an interesting argument, and I work in an industry where the EPA (under pressure from lobbyists) is mandating retrospectivity of standards and millions of dollars in upgrades...that's the business.

But would you as a property and vehicle owner accept being forced to upgrade your property, house, vehicle etc. upgrade at every change of legislation ?

Would you be happy paying to get your house to the new building standards, and have inspections every year or too to check that you've done it ?

Mandate that your older vehicle be upgraded to meet current CAFE and emissions standards ?

If not, why not ?
 
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