New from Raybestos, Now made in China

[alanu]

Originally Posted By: CrAlt
Originally Posted By: alanu

I'm suprised your "made in Canada" rotors were so cheap. Typically the North American made rotors costs alot more. I am not a consumer, I am a shop operator/tech.

These arnt just rotors.. they are the rotor with the hub built in ..for a RWD car.

Quote:

Another way to look at it is "IF" the factories stayed in North American your $39.99 rotor would be significantly more than $45.99.

Why? They have been in this price range forever. Why would they jump up to $100? Did the people in Canada demand a 100% raise in 2 years time? The only thing Raybestos did was increase their profit margin. They will now use their brand name to continue to charge more. Thats their right..but they arnt getting my money.

Quote:

If you own a domestic you sadly own a car that will have majority of the parts made in china, taiwan, brazil, mexico etc.


Ya i dont think so. My coronet and dart are probably near 100% detroit made. The D150 has alot of Canada made parts in it but ive never seen anything more import then that in it.


I'm talking after market parts available at the local parts stores.

Go to your local parts store try to locate a master cylinder, wheel cylinder and any electronic sensor for your D150. If they have old stock kicking around your fortunate. If they get new stock you'll see many "non" North American parts.

As for your Old school cars you'll probably have good NOS kicking around since theres less of them on the city streets.

 

[PandaBear]

Originally Posted By: T-Keith
I've bought many of the canadian made white box rotors for less then $20 and they seemed to hold up great. They were almost the same price as getting the old ones turned. When my wife's 98 Lesabre needed rotors I tried to buy the same ones, but they said made in China instead. They lasted about 2 weeks before warping. Maybe it was the car, or maybe my wife's drive, but even after having them turned they lasted only a couple weeks before warping again. I broke down and ordered the more expensive Raybestos rotors that are made in the USA and they lasted about 2 months before warping.


It is not just Chinese made or not, it is the initial quality of the plant and its production. I've had OEM Ford Taurus rotor that was made in US and can never be machined to have no vibration. The plant's quality control is the most important, not where it is from.

 

[The Critic]

Originally Posted By: T-Keith
I've bought many of the canadian made white box rotors for less then $20 and they seemed to hold up great. They were almost the same price as getting the old ones turned. When my wife's 98 Lesabre needed rotors I tried to buy the same ones, but they said made in China instead. They lasted about 2 weeks before warping. Maybe it was the car, or maybe my wife's drive, but even after having them turned they lasted only a couple weeks before warping again. I broke down and ordered the more expensive Raybestos rotors that are made in the USA and they lasted about 2 months before warping.

I've had the Raybestos Advanced Technology rotors (Made in China) with the black hats on a Corolla for over 18,000 miles without any warp problems. I think it's a hit/miss.

 

[Drew2000]

The reality is that China is getting their act together and is capable of making quality products. Sure, there still is plenty of junky stuff, but it's improving rapidly.

In the 1950-60's "Made in Japan" ment cheap dime-store toys and poor-quality products. By the '70's they were well on their way with high-quality electronics and optics, and by the '80's, with cars.

China is where Japan was 30 years ago and advancing rapidly. We need to wake up real soon before we're a country of only fast-food flippers,insurance salemen and lawyers.

 

[sciphi]

98 Buick LeSabre, that's why the rotors warped quickly. They eat rotors for lunch. Under-sized for the amount of car they stop.

I've had okay luck with ceramic pads and Chinese-made, US-finished drilled/slotted rotors on my 99 LeSabre. They are zinc-dipped and show no signs of rusting or wearing after 25k miles and 10 months of being on the car.

 

[bluestream]

It's funny that I have never seem a cheap Canadian "white box" rotor for sale in Canada. The Canadian made rotors are expensive here, and the cheap ones are from China

 

[yeti]

The reality is that China is getting their act together and is capable of making quality products. Sure, there still is plenty of junky stuff, but it's improving rapidly.

In the 1950-60's "Made in Japan" ment cheap dime-store toys and poor-quality products. By the '70's they were well on their way with high-quality electronics and optics, and by the '80's, with cars.

China is where Japan was 30 years ago and advancing rapidly. We need to wake up real soon before we're a country of only fast-food flippers,insurance salemen and lawyers. drew 2000.

good post, drew. your last sentence sums up a couple of my posts of a few weeks back. as the north american manufacturing industries and middle class are in decline, the chinese manufacturing industries and middle class grow. it is what it is.

 

[bluestream]

This is very true, and in no way did I mean to say that the china rotors are junk. In fact I am using them now and very happy with them. The sad part is that some of the China goods are so inexpensive that we can't help buying them even, though we would like to be patriotic and buy domestic goods. It's like offering drugs to an addict. (they know it's not good for them, but they take it anyway) I have found made in China goods to range from very poor quality, to very high quality and everything in between. At any rate, the quality of their goods is rising very fast. They make a very good Honda knock-off 4 stroke motor that can be bought for $99

 

[T-Keith]

Originally Posted By: sciphi
98 Buick LeSabre, that's why the rotors warped quickly. They eat rotors for lunch. Under-sized for the amount of car they stop.

I've had okay luck with ceramic pads and Chinese-made, US-finished drilled/slotted rotors on my 99 LeSabre. They are zinc-dipped and show no signs of rusting or wearing after 25k miles and 10 months of being on the car.


I think it may have had something to do with the car, but I wouldn't say the rotors are undersized. They are 1" bigger in diameter then my older lesabre and PA and they have always been easy on rotors. Perhaps the calipers are oversized.

 

[PF52]

Originally Posted By: CrAlt
Why? They have been in this price range forever. Why would they jump up to $100? Did the people in Canada demand a 100% raise in 2 years time? The only thing Raybestos did was increase their profit margin.


I was looking at some Raybestos rotors five years ago that were $95 apiece.... Hasn't that been their going rate for quite awhile? I've used their hoses but haven't tried their rotors.

Originally Posted By: Bluestream
The sad part is that some of the China goods are so inexpensive that we can't help buying them even, though we would like to be patriotic and buy domestic goods. It's like offering drugs to an addict.


I think many people see the low price and buy it anyway. My dad just bought a toaster-oven which cost barely half what the old one cost, and the old one was purchased in 1985! The difference of course was that the new one was made in China. Dad never checks the boxes to see where things are made, and he'd be livid if I pointed out the "Made in China" printing on the box. He'd never have bought it if he knew but in the meantime he's thrilled with what he sees as a bargain.

 

[yeti]

I think many people see the low price and buy it anyway. My dad just bought a toaster-oven which cost barely half what the old one cost, and the old one was purchased in 1985! The difference of course was that the new one was made in China. Dad never checks the boxes to see where things are made, and he'd be livid if I pointed out the "Made in China" printing on the box. He'd never have bought it if he knew but in the meantime he's thrilled with what he sees as a bargain.
css -- it's hard to find products made in n. america. i went with my brother recently (he is more knowledgeable) to get an lcd tv. try to find a n. american built one with the features that you want.
for example, a toshiba 40" is assembled either in mexico, or china. the circuit boards and chip innards are from china or korea. the sales guy mentioned this. most large manufacturing companies farm out assembly or parts production to cheap labor countries -- auto parts are no exception. that's just the way it is.

t-keith brings up a good point about calipers. if the rotor is not too small,and of high quality -- there has to be a reason why some cars tend to "eat" rotors.

 

[PandaBear]

Originally Posted By: yeti

css -- it's hard to find products made in n. america. i went with my brother recently (he is more knowledgeable) to get an lcd tv. try to find a n. american built one with the features that you want.
for example, a toshiba 40" is assembled either in mexico, or china. the circuit boards and chip innards are from china or korea. the sales guy mentioned this. most large manufacturing companies farm out assembly or parts production to cheap labor countries -- auto parts are no exception. that's just the way it is.

t-keith brings up a good point about calipers. if the rotor is not too small,and of high quality -- there has to be a reason why some cars tend to "eat" rotors.


As far as I know there is no LCD plant in the US. US companies have been out of the consumer electronics businesses for so long that it is no longer making any investment (locally in NA or outsource to Mexico/Asia), that we do not have the interest in doing so.

On the other hand, Sony, Canon, and Toshiba have started development center in the Silicon Valley that does that R&D for the technologies and absorbed some of the people used to work for RCA and Zenith. Applied Material made a majority of the manufacturing equipments, that account for 60%+ of the factory's cost, in the US and sell to the factories in Asia for the LCD panel. So in the end, some of the jobs related are still in the US.

American companies in general discovered that building low priced consumer devices in the US is a money losing strategy, but selling the equipments and licensing the technologies to do so to the low cost nations is a money making strategy. This is what we see in the end.

You don't want to lower your wage to $1/hr to compete with the low cost Chinese labor. Nor are you willing to pay for an $14/hr American labor on your $14/hr American wages.

 

[yeti]

panda -- as i said in an earlier post -- it is what it is.

 

[artificialist]

There are a variety of rotors from China, some good, some worthless.

One day I had to do rear pads and rotors to a Crown Vic. NAPA only had 1 ultra cheap rotor, so the service writer decided to buy one expensive rotor to get the car done. The cheap one looked like a sand castle. The expensive one looked like an OE rotor on a high quality car. I installed both and torqued the wheels to 100 ft/lb. 1 week later, the customer complained of pedal pulsation. I was told to machine the rotors and put the car back together. I had to deeply cut that cheap rotor to stop the pulsation, but when I cut the expensive one, I discovered that it was perfectly straight.

In other words, I'm saying that Chinese rotors can be good or bad.

Now here will be an interesting experiment for the future: My mom's 2005 Jeep Grand Cherokee had warped rotors since 20,000 miles. The OE rotors were built in Canada. I will buy premium Chinese rotors and see if they don't warp.

Wagner also make rotors in China, but there was one time I had to buy a clutch master cylinder from them for a Mazda Miata. The "Wagner" part was built in Japan by the same company that built the OE one. It makes me wonder.

For German and Sweedish cars, I don't see any reason to buy OE rotors. The OE ones are below spec when the pads are worn out. Fortunately, they don't warp. I have installed plenty of Chinese rotors that live the same life, and they don't warp either.

 

[The_Jeff]

For those keeping apples to apples track, the cheapo chinese rotor for my car has gone from $14-16 to $25-32 over the last couple years.

There are def fewer foundries than brands. I get my cheapies with a 1 yr warranty and often turn them in warped at 51 weeks. (keep track on the computer.) Parts store guy says he doesn't get many back but it's a logistical nightmare for many to take the car apart and run in the bad parts with a 2nd car.

 

[PandaBear]

eljefino,

Chinese labor and currency exchange is rising too. Their labor in the engineering field used to be 1/4 of US, but is now 1/3 and quickly approaching 1/2 of US. That combines with the booming auto manufacturing inside China for the domestic market, makes even the Chinese in a shortage for their own low cost parts, thus the price increase.

Different brands sharing the same producer for the same parts all the time. I've ordered a Gate hose and a no-name Kragen hose and they ends up having the same part number on the plastic bag inside the box. The AC Delco and OEM Honda water pump looks identical and are made in Japan, so are the belts from Gate and AC Delco, and the thermostats from Gate and Stant.

The hard part is to find out what parts are identical and pick the bargain among the re-brands.

 

[nthach]

I bought a Chinese-made Raybestos Red Label from Kragen for the family beater, seems to work fine. I stay away from Raybestos brake pads though. I was at AutoZone yesterday and I've noticed the Duralast Gold friction line is made in India now.

PandaBear - Kragen sells Goodyear belts and hoses, it used to be Dayco. But now they can get Gates since O'Rielly's owns them. The Gates to me feels like a better product than the Goodyear is which is sadly Mexican made. Gates and Stant are both owned by a British company.

Honda's now using Chinese-made wiring harnesses if that makes people feel better.

 

[Ross]

I have been using raybestos raymond china rotors. I have installed on 4 different cars and have been very happy with the results. Much beter than north amercan raybestos made rotors that warped quickly on me. I buy the raymond ones from rock auto

 

[tonycarguy]

You guys are praising "Made in America" as if it necessarily implies superior quality, which it doesn't. There's [censored] stuff made here too.

 

[benjamming]

Good point. However, companies that move mfg to China are typically looking for shortcuts that will rear its ugly head somewhere.