New 54.5 MPG Fuel Economy Standards, Rd. 2

[simple_gifts]

Originally Posted By: crw
I hate to say it, but most people under the age of 25 or 30 have never driven a manual. They don't know how.


Not many people under 50 know how to use a slide rule.

 

[Slacker]

If you will look at some of the more fuel efficient new cars you will see that the automatics are getting better MPG than the manuals.

 

[Slacker]

Originally Posted By: crw
I hate to say it, but most people under the age of 25 or 30 have never driven a manual. They don't know how.


It is too hard to steer, shift gears, and text.

 

[tommygunn]

When there are people out there who have their floor mats catch the accelerator, fly out of control, refuse to hit the brakes or shut off the engine out of fear of "flipping the car", calling 911 to pray to Jesus while screaming for their lives...

...this is why nobody drives a manual. It doesn't have a "forward" and "backward". Thankfully it has park, most people don't even know what a parking brake is for.

But as for autos getting more MPG then manuals, well. Ish. New automatics (dual clutch systems and stuff) are really manual transmissions run by computers. So they definitely fix the slushbox issue. Course it has all its own problems. They're annoying to drive because its neither an automatic or a manual transmission so you're always at the whim of a system thats trying to guess how you want to shift.

I wouldn't doubt highway MPG with a DPG style gearbox is the same as a manual. I'm sure in the city its better then an automatic too. But I guarantee someone who knows how to drive a standard can still whoop anything.

New dual clutch automatics beat manuals because the fuel economy profile for manuals accounts for people who can't drive it properly.

 

[sciphi]

Originally Posted By: crw
I hate to say it, but most people under the age of 25 or 30 have never driven a manual. They don't know how.


I'm in between those two ages, and bought a manual car on purpose. In no particular order: cost, best fuel mileage by far, and preference. My wife knows how to drive a manual, although she prefers not to.

My brother, also between those ages, also recently purchased a manual transmission Mazda3. He had to travel quite a ways to find one. He's not a car guy, just prefers rowing his own in his commuter.

Among our circle of friends and family, manual transmissions are gaining popularity. Something smaller than a Town Car is more fun, and typically more fuel efficient in the real world, with a manual.

 

[JTK]

Yeah this is wonderful news. Econoboxes are $20K now. Can you imagine the cost if this becomes a mandate?

Joel

 

[M1Accord]

Originally Posted By: JTK
Yeah this is wonderful news. Econoboxes are $20K now. Can you imagine the cost if this becomes a mandate?

Joel


The sad part is that as our cars get better fuel economy, we still get high gas mileage due to other factors driven purely by profit greed. As some of you may recall, gas did go for way below 2 dollars in late 2008 after being in 3 dollars range for quite sometime. And it did go under 3 dollars around here a few months ago. If you don't already know it, they are conditioning us.

 

[M1Accord]

Originally Posted By: tommygunn
When there are people out there who have their floor mats catch the accelerator, fly out of control, refuse to hit the brakes or shut off the engine out of fear of "flipping the car", calling 911 to pray to Jesus while screaming for their lives...

...this is why nobody drives a manual. It doesn't have a "forward" and "backward". Thankfully it has park, most people don't even know what a parking brake is for.

But as for autos getting more MPG then manuals, well. Ish. New automatics (dual clutch systems and stuff) are really manual transmissions run by computers. So they definitely fix the slushbox issue. Course it has all its own problems. They're annoying to drive because its neither an automatic or a manual transmission so you're always at the whim of a system thats trying to guess how you want to shift.

I wouldn't doubt highway MPG with a DPG style gearbox is the same as a manual. I'm sure in the city its better then an automatic too. But I guarantee someone who knows how to drive a standard can still whoop anything.

New dual clutch automatics beat manuals because the fuel economy profile for manuals accounts for people who can't drive it properly.


You are describing my Fit which is very annoying in stop and go traffic. It constantly wants to be in 1st or 2nd from stop even though I prefer 3rd or 4th. It also engine braking for me, which is bad for fuel economy as I want to coast to a red light from 500 yards away instead of being bump to 4th to 2nd and have to give extra gas.

 

[jkhawaii]

at the same time vehicles are getting larger and heavier with more economy robing emissions equipment

 

[SteveSRT8]

We must be careful to sort transmission differences by design AND programming. The new BMW's and Audi are both using the exact same 8 speed autobox by ZF and yet the Audi seems much better per C&D.

Just one example. There are many.

I certainly hope manuals don't go away, but it would seem their future is a bit threatened by technology.

 

[NateDN10]

I know this is somewhat off topic, but I, my two younger brothers, and one younger sisters all got our first cars with manual transmissions. I'm 26; my sister, the youngest, is 19. My wife can also drive a stick shift (and is halfway decent at it) but prefers not to.

We may not be the norm, but there are some younger people who prefer stick shifts!

 

[mechtech2]

Many people always prefer to buy portable living rooms, if they can .

 

[Smokescreen]

Manual or auto it makes very little difference these days. Also you can get garbage fuel economy in any vehicle.


Instead of focussing on the negatives, what about incentives for those that are actually meeting EPA ratings for the vehicle, whatever EPA may be? What about bonuses for those that are getting 10, 20, 30, 50+ % above EPA.

 

[tonycarguy]

Are trucks & SUVs included in the 54mpg average? If so, there's not a chance they will meet this. Ford sells 600,000 F-150s per year. How many 75mpg cars would they have to sell to offset this? That 600,000 figure doesn't include their other trucks, SUVs or low-MPG luxury cars. Luxury makes like MBZ and BMW have no chance of meeting this mandate even if you exclude their SUVs.

I suspect what will happen is once we get near the deadline, they'll fight hard to extend it. And failing to extend it, as a last resort they'll just tack on the cost of the fine to the price of each vehicle, like Ferrari and Lambo do.

 

[tommygunn]

Personally I can drive stick, I'm not terribly bad at it, but I'd still rather have an auto, especially in the city. A manual is fun but eventually you reach the point where you just wanna drive and maybe drink a coke, lol.

 

[artificialist]

I bought my car when I did, so I wouldn't be forced to pay an absurd gas guzzler tax, or even be allowed to buy such a fuel thirsty car at all.

 

[sciphi]

Originally Posted By: tonycarguy
Are trucks & SUVs included in the 54mpg average? If so, there's not a chance they will meet this. Ford sells 600,000 F-150s per year. How many 75mpg cars would they have to sell to offset this? That 600,000 figure doesn't include their other trucks, SUVs or low-MPG luxury cars. Luxury makes like MBZ and BMW have no chance of meeting this mandate even if you exclude their SUVs.

I suspect what will happen is once we get near the deadline, they'll fight hard to extend it. And failing to extend it, as a last resort they'll just tack on the cost of the fine to the price of each vehicle, like Ferrari and Lambo do.


It's counted in the CAFE rating for each automaker. So Ford will have to sell enough high mpg cars/vehicles to offset the lower mpg trucks.

Europe already does the high-mpg game with dinky little cars. What we're intending to do is show them how to do high mpg with larger cars that work for our country and far-flung cities.

 

[Artem]

Originally Posted By: tommygunn
Personally I can drive stick, I'm not terribly bad at it, but I'd still rather have an auto, especially in the city. A manual is fun but eventually you reach the point where you just wanna drive and maybe drink a coke, lol.



Of course, heavy traffic sucks with a manual, i agree but that's just what we gotta put up with.

I tend to drive an auto during rush hour times and play with the shifter at other times.

 

[LeakySeals]

Death of V8 Predicted by Fiat-Chrysler CEO

 

[M1Accord]

Originally Posted By: tommygunn
Personally I can drive stick, I'm not terribly bad at it, but I'd still rather have an auto, especially in the city. A manual is fun but eventually you reach the point where you just wanna drive and maybe drink a coke, lol.


That is how I feel and the recent why I went with the Fit Sport to have paddle shifters. Lamborghini uses paddle shifters along with other high performance cars. In addition, the Fit autobox acts more like a manual in its gearing. Since I prefer to sip a coke in the morning and evening drive, I'll stick to the Fit Sport with an automatic transmission.