The oil went too far, but the filter held up fine. I think this validates that filter is great for 2X oil changes at regular intervals. It would serve 10K miles with ease.
NAPA PLATINUM 41516, 17.2k CUT OPEN
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Originally Posted By: gfh77665
The oil went too far, but the filter held up fine. I think this validates that filter is great for 2X oil changes at regular intervals. It would serve 10K miles with ease.
I dont think so. I believe SubyRubieRoo is orobably right on guessing there may be some Ceratec the filter caught
The oil went too far, but the filter held up fine. I think this validates that filter is great for 2X oil changes at regular intervals. It would serve 10K miles with ease.
I dont think so. I believe SubyRubieRoo is orobably right on guessing there may be some Ceratec the filter caught
Originally Posted By: BlueOvalFitter
Without car51's dedicated time and effort to C&P all of these filters, no one would ever know how their inner anatomy is structured and performs.
Something about this just touched something off in my head, and brought Tommy Boy to mind immediately:
You can get a good look at a T-bone by sticking your head up a bull's business end, but I'd rather take the butcher's word for it.
Without car51's dedicated time and effort to C&P all of these filters, no one would ever know how their inner anatomy is structured and performs.
Something about this just touched something off in my head, and brought Tommy Boy to mind immediately:
You can get a good look at a T-bone by sticking your head up a bull's business end, but I'd rather take the butcher's word for it.
Expensive filter did its job well. Thanks for the C&P.
Dishdude, part of the reason I refuse to do 3k changes is because I buy good oil and filters and know it can go much farther, but the main reason is I have no garage or lift to work on and I am lazy and don’t like laying on cold concrete
Plus, I like getting value for everything I paid for, plus putting on a good show with a story to tell about it!
Plus, I like getting value for everything I paid for, plus putting on a good show with a story to tell about it!
SubieRubyRoo you solve the cold concrete with putting a thick blanket on top of it first. That's my answer
And that keeps me from freezing on the cold asphalt. Even when temps are doing in the teens. Though the wind chill was near 0°F that evening. Rough for me. I do like it cold. But that was a bit much. Though much better 100°F because of my illness. Heat is not my friend.
And that keeps me from freezing on the cold asphalt. Even when temps are doing in the teens. Though the wind chill was near 0°F that evening. Rough for me. I do like it cold. But that was a bit much. Though much better 100°F because of my illness. Heat is not my friend.
Wow. Those filter pics made me hold my breath but the UOA made me feel much better. Will be great to see your next filter c&p.
Originally Posted By: Sayjac
As for any standard used oil analysis correlation, Blackstone said long ago and it posted on this sub forum that they find no significant difference in any filter used in their testing.
I think the standard used oil analysis that only measures 'insolubles' is not sensitive enough to determine the effect of filter efficiency on oil cleanliness. The test that needs to be done is the IOS 4406 Cleanliness Code.
http://www.precisionfiltration.com/products/PDF/Understanding ISO Codes.pdf
Also, there are way too many variables associated with tons of random oil samples coming if for a used oil analysis. Reading up on filter efficiency vs oil cleanliness tests under controlled conditions, there certainly is a correlation between filter efficiency and the level of particulate in the oil.
As for any standard used oil analysis correlation, Blackstone said long ago and it posted on this sub forum that they find no significant difference in any filter used in their testing.
I think the standard used oil analysis that only measures 'insolubles' is not sensitive enough to determine the effect of filter efficiency on oil cleanliness. The test that needs to be done is the IOS 4406 Cleanliness Code.
http://www.precisionfiltration.com/products/PDF/Understanding ISO Codes.pdf
Also, there are way too many variables associated with tons of random oil samples coming if for a used oil analysis. Reading up on filter efficiency vs oil cleanliness tests under controlled conditions, there certainly is a correlation between filter efficiency and the level of particulate in the oil.
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: Sayjac
......As for any standard used oil analysis correlation, Blackstone said long ago and it posted on this sub forum that they find no significant difference in any filter used in their testing.
I think the standard used oil analysis that only measures 'insolubles' .........
Correct. As far as insolubles go and a standard used oil analysis, which often posted with oil filters here and topic, that was the point. Never was it intended to be anything beyond that with the Blackstone reference. So when I see a standard used oil analysis posted with an oil filter dissection, as far as the oil filter used, I take no correlation to the used oil analysis results.
Other testing under controlled conditions is another topic, and not the Blackstone reference. Some do put faith in added cost BlackStone 'particle counts', me not so much as those too have many "uncontrolled variables" in the results from one used oil analysis to the next. Not long ago one member posted what looked to be better particle count results using iirc an inexpensive off shored no efficiency rating filter, than an FU used previously. Based on comments, apparently that left some scratching their head.
Originally Posted By: Sayjac
......As for any standard used oil analysis correlation, Blackstone said long ago and it posted on this sub forum that they find no significant difference in any filter used in their testing.
I think the standard used oil analysis that only measures 'insolubles' .........
Correct. As far as insolubles go and a standard used oil analysis, which often posted with oil filters here and topic, that was the point. Never was it intended to be anything beyond that with the Blackstone reference. So when I see a standard used oil analysis posted with an oil filter dissection, as far as the oil filter used, I take no correlation to the used oil analysis results.
Other testing under controlled conditions is another topic, and not the Blackstone reference. Some do put faith in added cost BlackStone 'particle counts', me not so much as those too have many "uncontrolled variables" in the results from one used oil analysis to the next. Not long ago one member posted what looked to be better particle count results using iirc an inexpensive off shored no efficiency rating filter, than an FU used previously. Based on comments, apparently that left some scratching their head.
Filter looks good, oil not so good-you would be a good candidate for my xB's regimen of 2 10K OCIs per FU, or even XP/Platinum-the condition of your filter has sold me on them, along with the low insolubles you have on oil that is pretty obviously pushed too far (due to thickening & visible condition).
Yeah, I agree with the sentiments that the filter did a good job, and that the particulate in the oil leaves some unanswered questions. This was the first C&P done on the Fusion, so I don't know if this is something new or maybe "fallout" from the Ceratec that was in the sump for the prior OCI. I did confirm today, I am at 7,800 miles on this OCI and will grab a sample at 10k when I change the MicroGreen that's on the car now, and will get that C&P up to compare.
One thing that hasn't been answered or commented on by the tribologists that still has me wondering... since the filter sat uncovered in the garage for 5+ months before being C&P, can any of this be Ceratec or additive fallout or oxidation/something else that occurred just because it was sitting around so long while not in use and having some liquid in it? I honestly don't know, but like I said peering into the VC area there are no visible concerns for sludge or anything that looks like the stuff in the filter.
One thing that hasn't been answered or commented on by the tribologists that still has me wondering... since the filter sat uncovered in the garage for 5+ months before being C&P, can any of this be Ceratec or additive fallout or oxidation/something else that occurred just because it was sitting around so long while not in use and having some liquid in it? I honestly don't know, but like I said peering into the VC area there are no visible concerns for sludge or anything that looks like the stuff in the filter.
Id say the Ceratec fell out and got in the filter. If jo sludge you can see thats my story and I'm stickin to it
Well.. that filter definitely worked hard during that OCI.. and I must admit to having at least some concern over the condition of the engine when I saw the gunk that had collected, as well as the overall condition of the oil. Was going to ask if you got a used oil analysis, when I scrolled down and saw the used oil analysis you posted.
I have to admit, it looked better than I expected. Will it convince me to run my oil and filter out to 17k miles? I'm pretty sure I will never run an OCI out that long. I think my limit is about 10k miles.. might go 15k with a FU and the right oil in the car, but it would have to be the right confluence of circumstances and conditions.
Having said that, I certainly agree with you regarding getting value out of the parts and fluids that go into the car. I'm the same way, but in my case, since I have a huge stash of filters that are not of the 'premium' type (Motorcraft, Hastings, Federated, and Bosch 'jobber' types) and a lot of conventional and syn-blend oils, I tend to stick to 7,500-8,000 mile OCIs.
I think you're probably on to something in regards to the Ceratec fallout.. might be other stuff in there too, but I can definitely see the Ceratec falling out of suspension and/or getting picked up by the PUP and getting left in the filter. If it sat for a while, then any of it that was suspended in the oil left in the filter would likely have settled out over the 4 months it sat.
I have to admit, it looked better than I expected. Will it convince me to run my oil and filter out to 17k miles? I'm pretty sure I will never run an OCI out that long. I think my limit is about 10k miles.. might go 15k with a FU and the right oil in the car, but it would have to be the right confluence of circumstances and conditions.
Having said that, I certainly agree with you regarding getting value out of the parts and fluids that go into the car. I'm the same way, but in my case, since I have a huge stash of filters that are not of the 'premium' type (Motorcraft, Hastings, Federated, and Bosch 'jobber' types) and a lot of conventional and syn-blend oils, I tend to stick to 7,500-8,000 mile OCIs.
I think you're probably on to something in regards to the Ceratec fallout.. might be other stuff in there too, but I can definitely see the Ceratec falling out of suspension and/or getting picked up by the PUP and getting left in the filter. If it sat for a while, then any of it that was suspended in the oil left in the filter would likely have settled out over the 4 months it sat.
I was surprised at the amount of stuff in the filter... but the fact that the element itself looked pristine, and coupled with the UOA allayed some of my concerns from car51's great pics. I've decided (before this C&P
) to not use Ceratec or other additives since they can fall out of suspension, and I have a handful of the MG301-1 filter to change at 10k intervals. I may even just make it an oil/filter change at 10k for the next couple OCIs depending on the C&P and fully-bared VC pics to make sure any of this stuff is flushed out of the engine, but I'm not really worried about it. There are no signs of distress- used oil analysis are as good as any 2.5 MZR I've seen, fuel mileage in summer months routinely knock down 35+ over a full tank, etc. After the MG verification phase, if I do get back into the NAPA Platinum I will likely cut it back to a 15K and recheck like done here.
Overall I'm pretty impressed with the filter itself but don't know if I can justify the $12.99 price.
Overall I'm pretty impressed with the filter itself but don't know if I can justify the $12.99 price.
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