Anyone care to guess what the majority of mainstream oil blenders are using to meet new GF-5 standards? Perhaps someone like Molakule would chime in? Does anyone think they could posssibly be using chlorinated parrafins in small percentages or have some already been using this? Schooling by those who really know such things would be greatly appreciated.
Mystery additive in new SM-GF5 oils?
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Most likely more stable ZDDP that won't evaporate away.
esters?
Originally Posted By: Mokanic
Anyone care to guess what the majority of mainstream oil blenders are using to meet new GF-5 standards? Perhaps someone like Molakule would chime in? Does anyone think they could posssibly be using chlorinated parrafins in small percentages or have some already been using this? Schooling by those who really know such things would be greatly appreciated.
Nothing magic. A tic better base oils. No more Groupo Uno.
Anyone care to guess what the majority of mainstream oil blenders are using to meet new GF-5 standards? Perhaps someone like Molakule would chime in? Does anyone think they could posssibly be using chlorinated parrafins in small percentages or have some already been using this? Schooling by those who really know such things would be greatly appreciated.
Nothing magic. A tic better base oils. No more Groupo Uno.
MolaKule
Staff member
I'll let you do some reading. Think about the improvements to existing additives and base oil groups that need to meet GF-5:
http://www.gf-5.com/the_story/performance/
In https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/additives-xii-multifunctional-additives.41173/
In post # 530330 you'll find the common additive chemistry that is used.
Think more ashless (purely synthesized organic) additives for deposit control, better anti-oxidants, better ZDDP retention, improved detergents and dispersants, better varnish and sludge control, a wider range of seal compatibilities, and foremost, the use of bio-based superlubricity (FM) additives for mileage gains.
http://www.gf-5.com/the_story/performance/
In https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/additives-xii-multifunctional-additives.41173/
In post # 530330 you'll find the common additive chemistry that is used.
Think more ashless (purely synthesized organic) additives for deposit control, better anti-oxidants, better ZDDP retention, improved detergents and dispersants, better varnish and sludge control, a wider range of seal compatibilities, and foremost, the use of bio-based superlubricity (FM) additives for mileage gains.
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MolaKule
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I don't think MORE additives are needed, just NEWER, more efficient additive chemistries to replace the older ones.
Thank you for the helpful info. Do you think there is any major player that uses Chlorinated parrafins even in small amounts and what is the scoop on this stuff? I hear good and bad about it. After doing a search tons of it are coming from China,Russia,Iran.
Originally Posted By: buster
Excellent, thanks Molekule. Pablo, take note.
Nothing mystical or magical. Better base oils. No more Group 1 base oils.
Excellent, thanks Molekule. Pablo, take note.
Nothing mystical or magical. Better base oils. No more Group 1 base oils.
I wonder if we will notice a price increase for a finished quart of GF-5 classified motor oil? I wasn't paying attention to motor oil prices when GF-4 first hit the market. Does anyone recall if there was a spike in cost with the new specification?
I expect a significant increase with GF-5. Probably will be priced about half way between current dino and current blends, perhaps even closer to the blends.
GF-4 brought a small to moderate increase. Except for Havoline which introduced "Deposit Shield" along with the new GF-4 requirements. If I recall correctly it's price spiked almost 50%, which sent many users at BITOG on a quest for a less costly alternative. At the time, Havoline's previous GF-3/SL oils were good performers and offered great value.
GF-4 brought a small to moderate increase. Except for Havoline which introduced "Deposit Shield" along with the new GF-4 requirements. If I recall correctly it's price spiked almost 50%, which sent many users at BITOG on a quest for a less costly alternative. At the time, Havoline's previous GF-3/SL oils were good performers and offered great value.
I don't know about conventionals or SN but Pennzoil Ultra exceeds ILSAC-G5.
MolaKule
Staff member
Quote:
Do you think there is any major player that uses Chlorinated parrafins even in small amounts and what is the scoop on this stuff?
What is your source on these supplies?
I think the CP's are being sold to various countries for metal working and machining, countries that don't have EPA regulations against chlorinated esters.
In the US and the EU, they are being phased out or eliminated in favor of bio-esters.
There are much better, less corrosive chemistries available than CP's, so why use them?
Do you think there is any major player that uses Chlorinated parrafins even in small amounts and what is the scoop on this stuff?
What is your source on these supplies?
I think the CP's are being sold to various countries for metal working and machining, countries that don't have EPA regulations against chlorinated esters.
In the US and the EU, they are being phased out or eliminated in favor of bio-esters.
There are much better, less corrosive chemistries available than CP's, so why use them?
MolaKule
Staff member
Quote:
Nothing mystical or magical. Better base oils. No more Group 1 base oils.
What Pablo said is true as well.
The shift to more oxidatively stable, higher Group number base oils will be the norm with GF-5.
And yes the cost will be higher, about another 30-60% higher than current ILSAC GF-4 formulations.
Nothing mystical or magical. Better base oils. No more Group 1 base oils.
What Pablo said is true as well.
The shift to more oxidatively stable, higher Group number base oils will be the norm with GF-5.
And yes the cost will be higher, about another 30-60% higher than current ILSAC GF-4 formulations.
Originally Posted By: zddp77
New GF-5 oils will increase prices about .60 too.80 cents a gallon. I know of two conv. engine lubes that are already GF-5 anyone care too guess....
Are you serious?
Well my guess would be Pennzoil YB. It's $1 more expensive at Walmart since a few months ago. The 1 qt bottles also had a price bump.
Based on your posting history, Valvoline would be the other.
New GF-5 oils will increase prices about .60 too.80 cents a gallon. I know of two conv. engine lubes that are already GF-5 anyone care too guess....
Are you serious?
Well my guess would be Pennzoil YB. It's $1 more expensive at Walmart since a few months ago. The 1 qt bottles also had a price bump.
Based on your posting history, Valvoline would be the other.
I just did a search on CP and one site that offers this stuff(apparently on the world market) listed several different types(long-chain,medium-chain,and short-chain)and it listed the country of origin. All were either China,Russia,Iran. I know of several oil additives that still admit to using it here in the USA and they claim it is harmless in small percentages.
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