We have an aging demographic. As people age they tend, for the most part, to decrease their spending.
If this is not true, we are in great shape.
If this is not true, we are in great shape.
More proof that the ACTUAL recession never ended.
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Originally Posted By: antiqueshell
Originally Posted By: Donald
Try reading the NY Times to get accurate news.
LOL. The New York Times? Bhahaha.
That has got to be one of the biggest propagenda rags in the country.
Of course the media is going to make more excuses.
That won't change reality. A major recession is coming next year.
It's better than Infowhores.
Originally Posted By: Donald
Try reading the NY Times to get accurate news.
LOL. The New York Times? Bhahaha.
That has got to be one of the biggest propagenda rags in the country.
Of course the media is going to make more excuses.
That won't change reality. A major recession is coming next year.
It's better than Infowhores.
Originally Posted By: spasm3
Another factor will be if the debt ceiling is raised in feb. ( I hope its not).
It has to be raised. It's a meaningless metric currently and the best evidence of that is interest rates. If it was really a problem, would rates continue to stay so low???
Another factor will be if the debt ceiling is raised in feb. ( I hope its not).
It has to be raised. It's a meaningless metric currently and the best evidence of that is interest rates. If it was really a problem, would rates continue to stay so low???
If you read the headlines day in and day out (no matter where you get your news) - then yes, it will lead to depression.
Originally Posted By: rshaw125
This is the new normal. High unemployment, high taxes,huge public debt. And like Europe headed towards a triple dip recession.
This country needs across the board real cuts. Instead of doing it gradually now we will have to cut at a time when we're much weaker economically.
In European countries where austerity has been practiced, the debt has increased, unemployment has risen more, and GDP has decreased etc.
This is the new normal. High unemployment, high taxes,huge public debt. And like Europe headed towards a triple dip recession.
This country needs across the board real cuts. Instead of doing it gradually now we will have to cut at a time when we're much weaker economically.
In European countries where austerity has been practiced, the debt has increased, unemployment has risen more, and GDP has decreased etc.
I just have to say; after reading this thread, no wonder things are so screwed up in the US. We're polarized over false news in so many instances! Some people believe the the NWO is using chemtrails to skew economic data; some people believe the left right paradigm. Some people don't care at all anymore (I honestly don't blame them). Some people think any information provided from one particular news outfit is the holy grail; others think it's propaganda. It's becoming maddening honestly.
The best anyone can ever do is become their own journalist and seek out nothing but empirically correct information and observable facts. And if you get to that point and you start getting mad (because you biases have been incorrect all along and you have to start reshaping your worldview paradigm), you're on the right track.
The best anyone can ever do is become their own journalist and seek out nothing but empirically correct information and observable facts. And if you get to that point and you start getting mad (because you biases have been incorrect all along and you have to start reshaping your worldview paradigm), you're on the right track.
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I keep hearing how our national debt ceiling HAS to be raised. Okay, raised how high? And since we don't have a balanced budget, when will it stop?
I compare our national debt to a financially-struggling family that was suddenly issued a $25K platinum credit card. This family starts using it for everything and the charges add up. While the purchases with the credit card are being used (and the debt adds up), life is good and everybody is happy. For a long time (and in the case of our country, many years) the standard of living is good. The family (I.E., our country) barely pays the minimum interest on the card. Suddenly, the $25K limit to the credit card is hit. In the case of the family with limited income, what do we do? Do we actually increase the credit card limit? That's what a lot of you are saying. When you do that, you are just kicking the can down the road and hoping the problem is paid off by somebody else, meaning your kids or grandkids. When is it going to stop?
I compare our national debt to a financially-struggling family that was suddenly issued a $25K platinum credit card. This family starts using it for everything and the charges add up. While the purchases with the credit card are being used (and the debt adds up), life is good and everybody is happy. For a long time (and in the case of our country, many years) the standard of living is good. The family (I.E., our country) barely pays the minimum interest on the card. Suddenly, the $25K limit to the credit card is hit. In the case of the family with limited income, what do we do? Do we actually increase the credit card limit? That's what a lot of you are saying. When you do that, you are just kicking the can down the road and hoping the problem is paid off by somebody else, meaning your kids or grandkids. When is it going to stop?
Originally Posted By: Drew99GT
The best anyone can ever do is become their own journalist and seek out nothing but empirically correct information and observable facts. And if you get to that point and you start getting mad (because you biases have been incorrect all along and you have to start reshaping your worldview paradigm), you're on the right track.
Except a lot of people can't do that, and a lot of people on here are good examples.
The best anyone can ever do is become their own journalist and seek out nothing but empirically correct information and observable facts. And if you get to that point and you start getting mad (because you biases have been incorrect all along and you have to start reshaping your worldview paradigm), you're on the right track.
Except a lot of people can't do that, and a lot of people on here are good examples.
Originally Posted By: DBMaster
It may meet the technical definition of a recovery, but as many of you state, where the rubber hits the road is what is important.
I have heard some older terms resurfacing over the past few years:
Jobless Recovery
Stagflation
Recession merely refers to decrease in the GDP over a specified time period. For most of us that is meaningless, but if the news you hear causes you to change your spending habits it can be self-fulfilling prophecy. I believe we have seen a lot of that lately, including in the hiring market.
Actually its slightly more complex than just a decrease in GDP.
In the United States, the Business Cycle Dating Committee of the National Bureau of Economic Research (NBER) is generally seen as the authority for dating US recessions. The NBER defines an economic recession as: "a significant decline in economic activity spread across the economy, lasting more than a few months, normally visible in real GDP, real income, employment, industrial production, and wholesale-retail sales."[5] Almost universally, academics, economists, policy makers, and businesses defer to the determination by the NBER for the precise dating of a recession's onset and end.
It may meet the technical definition of a recovery, but as many of you state, where the rubber hits the road is what is important.
I have heard some older terms resurfacing over the past few years:
Jobless Recovery
Stagflation
Recession merely refers to decrease in the GDP over a specified time period. For most of us that is meaningless, but if the news you hear causes you to change your spending habits it can be self-fulfilling prophecy. I believe we have seen a lot of that lately, including in the hiring market.
Actually its slightly more complex than just a decrease in GDP.
In the United States, the Business Cycle Dating Committee of the National Bureau of Economic Research (NBER) is generally seen as the authority for dating US recessions. The NBER defines an economic recession as: "a significant decline in economic activity spread across the economy, lasting more than a few months, normally visible in real GDP, real income, employment, industrial production, and wholesale-retail sales."[5] Almost universally, academics, economists, policy makers, and businesses defer to the determination by the NBER for the precise dating of a recession's onset and end.
The central bank is buying at least $40B a month in the financial sector, buying at least 70% of issued US debt, and has stated that it will keep interest rates near 0 until at least 2015.
Anyone that thinks there is a recovery going on has their head buried deep in the sand.
Anyone that thinks there is a recovery going on has their head buried deep in the sand.
Originally Posted By: simple_gifts
Originally Posted By: spasm3
Originally Posted By: dparm
The vast majority of the "large" newspapers (and media companies in general) carry heavy biases. A person needs to read from multiple sources to make sure they are seeing all the sides to a story.
+1
There are few organizations doing real news in the US. BBC, NPR, Al Jezeera.
NYT's David Brooks is a great level headed guy doing commentary.
Look up Walter Duranty and see how credible the NY Times is.
And Thomas L. Friedman thinks China has a better government system than we do.
They are one of the worst.
Originally Posted By: spasm3
Originally Posted By: dparm
The vast majority of the "large" newspapers (and media companies in general) carry heavy biases. A person needs to read from multiple sources to make sure they are seeing all the sides to a story.
+1
There are few organizations doing real news in the US. BBC, NPR, Al Jezeera.
NYT's David Brooks is a great level headed guy doing commentary.
Look up Walter Duranty and see how credible the NY Times is.
And Thomas L. Friedman thinks China has a better government system than we do.
They are one of the worst.
Originally Posted By: Tempest
The central bank is buying at least $40B a month in the financial sector, buying at least 70% of issued US debt, and has stated that it will keep interest rates near 0 until at least 2015.
Anyone that thinks there is a recovery going on has their head buried deep in the sand.
Garbage information. The Fed is in no way funding government deficits. There's a 3 to 1 bid to cover ratio at most primary auctions and QEx adds no new net financial assets to the economy. Plus, BY LAW, primary dealers have to make a market for treasuries. Perhaps, Tempest, you should read your signature and take it to heart.
"The truth is that permanent open market operations merely change the composition of outstanding private sector assets and serve no role in helping to fund the US government. It’s true that the government could use the Fed to fund the US Treasury’s spending, but that would involve a full blown rejection of bonds by the Primary Dealers. In other words, the only time the Fed would be required to purchase bonds in a funding short-fall is in the case where the Primary Dealers reject their mandate to purchase bonds and the Fed must fill the void. Clearly, given record high bond prices, tanking yields and very strong demand at all auctions, the evidence that this is occurring is weak to say the least."
http://pragcap.com/understanding-quantitative-easing
The central bank is buying at least $40B a month in the financial sector, buying at least 70% of issued US debt, and has stated that it will keep interest rates near 0 until at least 2015.
Anyone that thinks there is a recovery going on has their head buried deep in the sand.
Garbage information. The Fed is in no way funding government deficits. There's a 3 to 1 bid to cover ratio at most primary auctions and QEx adds no new net financial assets to the economy. Plus, BY LAW, primary dealers have to make a market for treasuries. Perhaps, Tempest, you should read your signature and take it to heart.
"The truth is that permanent open market operations merely change the composition of outstanding private sector assets and serve no role in helping to fund the US government. It’s true that the government could use the Fed to fund the US Treasury’s spending, but that would involve a full blown rejection of bonds by the Primary Dealers. In other words, the only time the Fed would be required to purchase bonds in a funding short-fall is in the case where the Primary Dealers reject their mandate to purchase bonds and the Fed must fill the void. Clearly, given record high bond prices, tanking yields and very strong demand at all auctions, the evidence that this is occurring is weak to say the least."
http://pragcap.com/understanding-quantitative-easing
Originally Posted By: Kruse
I compare our national debt to a financially-struggling family that was suddenly issued a $25K platinum credit card. This family starts using it for everything and the charges add up. While the purchases with the credit card are being used (and the debt adds up), life is good and everybody is happy. For a long time (and in the case of our country, many years) the standard of living is good. The family (I.E., our country) barely pays the minimum interest on the card. Suddenly, the $25K limit to the credit card is hit. In the case of the family with limited income, what do we do? Do we actually increase the credit card limit? That's what a lot of you are saying. When you do that, you are just kicking the can down the road and hoping the problem is paid off by somebody else, meaning your kids or grandkids. When is it going to stop?
If you use this analogy, that family has a legal money printing press at home and hence can pay the minimum payment on the credit cards with no problems.
This is how USA government financial system works since 1970's. It's actually amazing how long this scam has been working with only some minor bumps on the way.
The destination is poverty, no question about it, but it may take a couple of more decades if not longer. USA is a big country after all and used to be rich. It took centuries to impoverish Rome. We are following that process closely.
I compare our national debt to a financially-struggling family that was suddenly issued a $25K platinum credit card. This family starts using it for everything and the charges add up. While the purchases with the credit card are being used (and the debt adds up), life is good and everybody is happy. For a long time (and in the case of our country, many years) the standard of living is good. The family (I.E., our country) barely pays the minimum interest on the card. Suddenly, the $25K limit to the credit card is hit. In the case of the family with limited income, what do we do? Do we actually increase the credit card limit? That's what a lot of you are saying. When you do that, you are just kicking the can down the road and hoping the problem is paid off by somebody else, meaning your kids or grandkids. When is it going to stop?
If you use this analogy, that family has a legal money printing press at home and hence can pay the minimum payment on the credit cards with no problems.
This is how USA government financial system works since 1970's. It's actually amazing how long this scam has been working with only some minor bumps on the way.
The destination is poverty, no question about it, but it may take a couple of more decades if not longer. USA is a big country after all and used to be rich. It took centuries to impoverish Rome. We are following that process closely.
Originally Posted By: Drew99GT
There's a 3 to 1 bid to cover ratio at most primary auctions and QEx adds no new net financial assets to the economy.
So if demand is so strong, then why does the central bank see fit to purchase so large a share of Treasuries? Current estimates are that it will purchase 90% in the next year.
More to the thread, they wouldn't be going through all of this if there were a strong economy.
Quote:
open market operations merely change the composition of outstanding private sector assets
What is the starting "composition of outstanding private sector assets" and what is the resulting "change"?
There's a 3 to 1 bid to cover ratio at most primary auctions and QEx adds no new net financial assets to the economy.
So if demand is so strong, then why does the central bank see fit to purchase so large a share of Treasuries? Current estimates are that it will purchase 90% in the next year.
More to the thread, they wouldn't be going through all of this if there were a strong economy.
Quote:
open market operations merely change the composition of outstanding private sector assets
What is the starting "composition of outstanding private sector assets" and what is the resulting "change"?
Originally Posted By: Tempest
So if demand is so strong, then why does the central bank see fit to purchase so large a share of Treasuries? Current estimates are that it will purchase 90% in the next year.
I don't know where you're getting that information, but the stated reason they're doing QE is to shorten the maturity of US debt supposedly to lower or keep US rates as low as possible, but many market watchers will point out the blatantly obvious fact that QE transactions in the past have done the complete opposite. It looks like they're trying to create inflation and a rise in rates organically to heed off deflation. They're trying to stop what happened in Japan. Remember Milton Friedmon's golden interest rate rule - low yields, tight money; high yields, easy money.
So if demand is so strong, then why does the central bank see fit to purchase so large a share of Treasuries? Current estimates are that it will purchase 90% in the next year.
I don't know where you're getting that information, but the stated reason they're doing QE is to shorten the maturity of US debt supposedly to lower or keep US rates as low as possible, but many market watchers will point out the blatantly obvious fact that QE transactions in the past have done the complete opposite. It looks like they're trying to create inflation and a rise in rates organically to heed off deflation. They're trying to stop what happened in Japan. Remember Milton Friedmon's golden interest rate rule - low yields, tight money; high yields, easy money.
Sure sounds to me like you ^^^ are equally as polarized as anyone else here.
Just another brand of kool aid...
I just love it when the educated elite arrive to tell us how we're all doing fine and everything is great!
Just another brand of kool aid...
I just love it when the educated elite arrive to tell us how we're all doing fine and everything is great!
Originally Posted By: friendly_jacek
The destination is poverty, no question about it, but it may take a couple of more decades if not longer. USA is a big country after all and used to be rich. It took centuries to impoverish Rome. We are following that processclosely quickly.
There. I fixed it for ya.
The destination is poverty, no question about it, but it may take a couple of more decades if not longer. USA is a big country after all and used to be rich. It took centuries to impoverish Rome. We are following that process
There. I fixed it for ya.
A quick visit to the inner city areas of Michigan or Chicago will show you exactly where we are headed.
We now have folks who grew up in homes where NO ONE has ever gotten up and gone to work! Never.
This is rapidly becoming a third world country.
We now have folks who grew up in homes where NO ONE has ever gotten up and gone to work! Never.
This is rapidly becoming a third world country.
Originally Posted By: Kruse
The destination is poverty, no question about it, but it may take a couple of more decades if not longer. USA is a big country after all and used to be rich. It took centuries to impoverish Rome. We are following that processclosely quickly.
This is the REALITY.
An important read is:
"The Creature From Jekyll Island: A Second Look At The Federal Reserve"
By G. Edward Griffin
The destination is poverty, no question about it, but it may take a couple of more decades if not longer. USA is a big country after all and used to be rich. It took centuries to impoverish Rome. We are following that process
This is the REALITY.
An important read is:
"The Creature From Jekyll Island: A Second Look At The Federal Reserve"
By G. Edward Griffin
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