Magnuson-Moss question - Dealership practices

[bdcardinal]

Here is the dealer's position where I bought my Silverado a month and a half ago-Non-GM parts and accessories are not covered under the GM New Vehicle Limited Warranty. They also may damage the vehicle, compromise it's compliance with safety standards or void the GM warranty on the vehicle itself. GM is not responsible for the consequences of installing any non-GM equipment, parts or accessories on the vehicle. A list of non-GM parts is available to you upon request.
I could either sign this or not buy the vehicle.

If you are reading the above-and you are surmising the main culprit is after market lifts and large tires-you would be correct because I asked them.

I can't tell you how many problems come up on the truck boards because of lift kits and large wheels and spacers.

That I can understand, because they do have issues. One new thing we are seeing on Fords are issues with the front cameras on lifted trucks. Part of the camera calibration is ride height, and when a truck is lifted above the upper limit on the programming, the camera will not work properly.

 

[eljefino]

If you read around the boards it seems like Kia/ Hyundai are particularly bad shysters about covering engine problems under warranty. Maybe their junk engines caused their Board of Directors to put the thumb down on warranty work.

What this effectively means is they're going to deny some claims that should be covered. What do you need to do to make sure they cover you? Be more clever than the average customer. You can lawyer up behind Magnuson Moss but a lawyer is as expensive as a new engine. Knowing your rights is a better return on investment than buying the dealer's oil change package. But you might want to get "some" changes done on paper. Wait until you own the car for a little bit and the dealer will send you coupons for $29 oil changes. A few of those (along with thorough documentation of all other service elsewhere) will keep you in good graces and be a lot cheaper than "Kia Care."

 

[KCJeep]

Those are all scare tactics, hoping that their bureaucratic practices will discourage you from DIY, hoping you will bring car to them.
Here is another one: VW dealership tried to convince one customer (read it on forum) that if they don;t use BG additives in an engine, warranty will be voided. Trying to convince them that the only thing that matters is approved oil really did not go far. Fear always sells.

My VW dealership tried to sell me BG engine oil additive as well. At the time my manual said engine warranty could be voided if an additive was used in the oil, which I politely mentioned of course. They were trying to scare people with the 10k recommendation that the oil needed help.

Apparently people are not supposed to question why VW oil is not good enough for a factory VW specified interval?

This is actually an otherwise really good dealer unlike the pit of vipers I bought one of my VWs from.

 

[WylieCoyote]

If you read around the boards it seems like Kia/ Hyundai are particularly bad shysters about covering engine problems under warranty. Maybe their junk engines caused their Board of Directors to put the thumb down on warranty work.

What this effectively means is they're going to deny some claims that should be covered. What do you need to do to make sure they cover you? Be more clever than the average customer. You can lawyer up behind Magnuson Moss but a lawyer is as expensive as a new engine. Knowing your rights is a better return on investment than buying the dealer's oil change package. But you might want to get "some" changes done on paper. Wait until you own the car for a little bit and the dealer will send you coupons for $29 oil changes. A few of those (along with thorough documentation of all other service elsewhere) will keep you in good graces and be a lot cheaper than "Kia Care."

Seems as though it's been a while since my sales person or anybody in that dealership has encountered somebody that does his own maintenance. He was practically clutching his pearls as I was telling him that I do my own maintenance on the Mustang I'm trading in. Until I'm physically unable to do it, I much rather spend time under my car, in the garage, than spend time sitting in their waiting room, waiting for one of their technicians to mess up my drain plug.

We're a dying breed, guys.

 

[CKN]

If you read around the boards it seems like Kia/ Hyundai are particularly bad shysters about covering engine problems under warranty. Maybe their junk engines caused their Board of Directors to put the thumb down on warranty work.

What this effectively means is they're going to deny some claims that should be covered. What do you need to do to make sure they cover you? Be more clever than the average customer. You can lawyer up behind Magnuson Moss but a lawyer is as expensive as a new engine. Knowing your rights is a better return on investment than buying the dealer's oil change package. But you might want to get "some" changes done on paper. Wait until you own the car for a little bit and the dealer will send you coupons for $29 oil changes. A few of those (along with thorough documentation of all other service elsewhere) will keep you in good graces and be a lot cheaper than "Kia Care."

There have been thousands of motors covered by Hyundai. Yes-maybe they were forced to-by the courts but they did cover them. As always-those who have issues complain online-and again-as always we hear one side of the story. They covered my Son's Sonata Motor-though technically out of warranty and put him in a Malibu rental at zero cost for two weeks.

You are I apparently are reading different boards. Have you read about them replacing motors as well?

 

[JohnnyJohnson]

Toyota's customer service is the reason I now have a Mazda in my driveway after two Toyota's !

 

[Merek]

Yes it's just scare tactics, keep the receipts and records of the oil changes and maybe even take pictures that are dated to help reinforce your records. You can use aftermarket parts but the only way they could deny a claim is if that part failed... ie: using XYZ oil filter that failed and that's what caused the engine to fail. They cannot just drop your warranty due to the use of aftermarket parts either, same with using a different oil they have to prove that's what caused the failure.

 

[WylieCoyote]

Yes it's just scare tactics, keep the receipts and records of the oil changes and maybe even take pictures that are dated to help reinforce your records. You can use aftermarket parts but the only way they could deny a claim is if that part failed... ie: using XYZ oil filter that failed and that's what caused the engine to fail. They cannot just drop your warranty due to the use of aftermarket parts either, same with using a different oil they have to prove that's what caused the failure.

I have no problem keeping receipts and records if it means I don't have to drive all the way to the nearest dealership and sit there. The car will be getting Mobil1/Penz Platinum/Castrol and Kia filters, two of which I picked up at the dealership before I left today.

 

[SC Maintenance]

The dealers play fast and loose with Magnusson Moss because no one enforces it. The OEM's aren't much better, and in the warranty agreement you implicitly agree to arbitration. So even if you win in arbitration the OEM doesn't get spanked with punitive damages like they would in civil court.

Even when I buy new I consider it 100% buyer beware and the warranty isn't much worth the digital PDF paper its no longer even written on.

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

Hey guys, talking to the folks at my local Kia dealership about a new Forte, and they're, of course, trying to shove a maintenance package down my throat. I refused, and they actually had the nerve to say that if I don't keep the maintenance records up on the Carfax, Kia will not honor the warranty.

Anybody heard of this as being enforceable? What if I get my oil changed at an ASE certified shop that doesn't report to Carfax?

Lies..all lies.

 

[Pew]

It might be easier for your own efforts if you kept records and receipts and had to use the CPO warranty. However, I didn't have half my personal oil change receipts for my cx5 and the CPO warranty company still gave me a new engine. Can't say if it'll be that easy of a win for you but dumb for then to scare you into the carfax thing.

 

[KrisZ]

It’s hard for me to accept that people believe this kind of nonsense and need to take to the internet to verify simple stuff like this.

Here is a very simple and effective litmus test for such nonsense:

Ask them “show me where this policy is written and give me a copy of it”.
Then watch them with amusement trying to tell you they don’t need it in writing and come up with more lies.

 

[SC Maintenance]

It’s hard for me to accept that people believe this kind of nonsense and need to take to the internet to verify simple stuff like this.

Here is a very simple and effective litmus test for such nonsense:

Ask them “show me where this policy is written and give me a copy of it”.
Then watch them with amusement trying to tell you they don’t need it in writing and come up with more lies.

That is what forums are for - to educate people. They don't do it in school. Car dealers and OEM's play fast and loose with Magnusson Moss anyway. Consumer protections keep getting chipped away.

What percentage of the country even knows what Magnusson Moss is? The OP was ahead of most to start I would say. Most would believe the dealer and buy their garbage.

 

[KrisZ]

That is what forums are for - to educate people. They don't do it in school. Car dealers and OEM's play fast and loose with Magnusson Moss anyway. Consumer protections keep getting chipped away.

What percentage of the country even knows what Magnusson Moss is? The OP was ahead of most to start I would say. Most would believe the dealer and buy their garbage.

This isn’t a question of the MM act though, it’s a question of record keeping. Nobody can force a way you keep records, not even the IRS. You just need to keep your maintenance records, how you do it it’s up to you, not them. Common sense stuff.

 

[TiGeo]

Hey guys, talking to the folks at my local Kia dealership about a new Forte, and they're, of course, trying to shove a maintenance package down my throat. I refused, and they actually had the nerve to say that if I don't keep the maintenance records up on the Carfax, Kia will not honor the warranty.

Anybody heard of this as being enforceable? What if I get my oil changed at an ASE certified shop that doesn't report to Carfax?

Just sales scare tactics to sell things with huge profit margins. No requirements beyond keeping records/using OE-equivalent parts.

 

[SC Maintenance]

This isn’t a question of the MM act though, it’s a question of record keeping. Nobody can force a way you keep records, not even the IRS. You just need to keep your maintenance records, how you do it it’s up to you, not them. Common sense stuff.

True, but dealers will say and do anything to get you to buy something you don't need.

 

[TiGeo]

True, but dealers will say and do anything to get you to buy something you don't need.

I had a guy recently tell me he got the warranty on his used VW because they wouldn't give him a loan without it...hahahaha

 

[WylieCoyote]

True, but dealers will say and do anything to get you to buy something you don't need.

This package contained oil changes, tire and wheel protection, key fob protection, and all sorts of other stuff. I equate this to the telecom slamming and cramming issue from years ago.

 

[PWMDMD]

FWIW...I use both Autosist and the manufacturer's owner's website to document maintenance. All receipts are documented in Autosist and all information is entered on the day of service. The Kia owner's site service intervals are off because they recommend 8K mile OCIs and I'm doing 5K mile OCIs but you can document the actual mileage too. If they ever felt the need to look inside the engine, it will look like a well-maintained engine using high-quality oil at 5k mile OCIs. Autosist will print out a nice report including all receipts. While anything is possible for a dealership to claim, I think it would be hard to argue that not only was the maintenance done on my vehicles, it was done in excess of what was minimally required.

 

[KrisZ]

This package contained oil changes, tire and wheel protection, key fob protection, and all sorts of other stuff. I equate this to the telecom slamming and cramming issue from years ago.

Nice, you got a truly sleazy one for sure.