Agreed. Competition is good for the consumer.
Mach E high voltage battery contactor recall...
- Thread starter UncleDave
- Start date
That’s why I mentioned NHTSA shows more (41). The cars.com list was just faster to read through the corrective actions.
Of course Ford will be successful, its just a recall. All companies have them.
It might be just a recall. I might be something more.
If the customers cars dont have a performance, charging, range or any other penalty - it's just a recall.
IF the customers cars are fundamentally changed by this - Ford will have a hard time recovering and likely face a class action suit like they did with the power shift transmission in the focus.
Good point
Recalls are expensive for the manufacturers even if it is for a $0.99 part. They don't have a 25%+ profit margin like Tesla to cover such costs and the erosion of confidence in customers in those brands is immeasurable. Except for some brands like Jeep that have such loyalty that their customers put up with all the problems.
When such recalls are for major drivetrain components, brakes, or safety concerns like fires and they seem to happen fairly regularly I can't be the only consumer that shakes their head and makes a mental note to never buy an XYZ brand vehicle.
Competition is certainly good for the consumer but successfully entering the EV market is a whole different ballgame. It's not like 1964 when Ford stunned the marketplace with the first Pony Car and it didn't take long and was fairly easy for GM to counter with the Camaro and Firebird. It's not like using parts bin engineering and throwing a new body on a frame and then spending all the money on advertising.
So I remain skeptical of how well the legacy automakers will compete with Tesla unless they suddenly get an influx of capital and brain talent and have the space or can build new state of the art factories to build EV's while continuing to make their ICE vehicles, at least in a downsized model offering while they transition to electric. Tesla has already spent the cash and made the mistakes. Let's see if others can survive.
Regarding the latest NHTSA release regarding self driving vehicle crashes: I will be careful not to get political but the report doesn't put Tesla's numbers in much context, like if you have hundreds of thousands of vehicles using SD technology vs. your competitors who have but a handful, you are likely to have more vehicles involved in crashes.
Elon's recent political statements and prediction that he would likely be demonized are something to keep in mind.
When such recalls are for major drivetrain components, brakes, or safety concerns like fires and they seem to happen fairly regularly I can't be the only consumer that shakes their head and makes a mental note to never buy an XYZ brand vehicle.
Competition is certainly good for the consumer but successfully entering the EV market is a whole different ballgame. It's not like 1964 when Ford stunned the marketplace with the first Pony Car and it didn't take long and was fairly easy for GM to counter with the Camaro and Firebird. It's not like using parts bin engineering and throwing a new body on a frame and then spending all the money on advertising.
So I remain skeptical of how well the legacy automakers will compete with Tesla unless they suddenly get an influx of capital and brain talent and have the space or can build new state of the art factories to build EV's while continuing to make their ICE vehicles, at least in a downsized model offering while they transition to electric. Tesla has already spent the cash and made the mistakes. Let's see if others can survive.
Regarding the latest NHTSA release regarding self driving vehicle crashes: I will be careful not to get political but the report doesn't put Tesla's numbers in much context, like if you have hundreds of thousands of vehicles using SD technology vs. your competitors who have but a handful, you are likely to have more vehicles involved in crashes.
Elon's recent political statements and prediction that he would likely be demonized are something to keep in mind.
Musk has mentioned he has Asperger's Syndrome and my stepson has a bit of that along with ADD. I don't read much into what Musk is shooting for, but based on what I have seen mentioned he has the type of mentality of trying to do THIS, THAT and EVERYTHING without being able to focus 100% on any given thing. Some might see that as genius, but not me. Scatterbrained sums it up... of course in life we all differ, but a guy with that sort of overdrive thought process would be hard to totally trust long term.
I can only hope Ford's Mach-E problems do not continue over with the F-150 Lightning. I guess we'll see.
Quit pretending it can keep up with a Tesla Plaid edition and you shouldn't have a problem, since Ford blames "high performance driving" causing the system to overheat. Maybe the software update will prevent high performance driving and make it drive like an appliance vehicle.
And don't forget that Elon Musk has made a few enemies in the biased media with his political opinions lately.
Or a model 3 performance, or a model y performance, or an Audi or Porsche.
Guys that bought the GT had no idea there were being clipped at 5 seconds of WOT.
No other EV imposes a limitation like this Im aware of.
Calling it a "Mustang" then blaming high performance driving seems like they blew it all the way around.
Ford didn't get this one right.
I think Ford has the right idea by having an SUV and light/medium duty pickup truck in their EV lineup. However they just aren't ready for prime time yet. It is going to take a while and a whole lot of cash before they are. Meanwhile Tesla will still be 5 years ahead.
I still think the future will be many if not most EV automakers are going to be sourcing or licensing batteries and the related software from Tesla once additional battery production from several manufacturers can ramp up and meet the demand. And this means more $$$ for Tesla and less profit for their competitors. Tesla is not only going to be a money making machine fromselling very profitable vehicles but from licensing software, selling insurance, their solar products and soon, from their cell phones.
I still think the future will be many if not most EV automakers are going to be sourcing or licensing batteries and the related software from Tesla once additional battery production from several manufacturers can ramp up and meet the demand. And this means more $$$ for Tesla and less profit for their competitors. Tesla is not only going to be a money making machine fromselling very profitable vehicles but from licensing software, selling insurance, their solar products and soon, from their cell phones.
I agree with everything DwightFrye has posted on this thread. It is substantiated by both owner comments on https://www.macheforum.com/ and my previous ownership of a Mach E GT Performance Edition. After taking delivery after about 18 months after ordering it, I was immensely disappointed. The main reason was the dumb 5-second limit of maximum power. With complete knowledge of the competition, this is a complete performance embarassment for Ford. Most of the owners on the forum are Ford apologists, but not I. The second reason was the numerous software glitches and related problems. I did not wait nearly 18 months and spend over $70k for this embarassment of a consumer product. Before reaching 100 miles on the odometer, I sold the car to a Ford dealer. Read the forum for a clearer and more complete picture of the owner and driver experiences.
Sorry man, you didnt deserve that.
The mach-e forum is a joke.
It allows no critical debate of the product, or thorough comparison to competition.
Their MO is as follows when they dont like your narrative.
1. Accuse you of being a prior banned poster (despite the fact that they can check your IP address to confirm that)
2. Hobble your account so that you cannot reply without moderator approval
3. Fail to approve any reply regardless of the subject matter, even when its pro ford.
This way they get to silence your input while justifying it as spam and at the same time claim you weren't banned.
Im Pro Ford and thorough enjoyed 90% of my Ford products and experience over a lifetime.
I dont let them off the hook where they dont deserve it - poweshift trans, and 6.blow diesel.
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OVERKILL
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Why would they licence batteries from Tesla? The company doesn't have a monopoly on cylindrical cells, other marques just haven't gone that route for reasons I assume makes sense to them. GM's whole platform revolves around pouch cells for example, BMW's around prismatic. Ford is also using pouch, but clearly their thermal management isn't anywhere near to be on par with that of Porsche or Audi, even though they use the same style of cells.
Solar for Tesla as so far been, well, interesting. Shareholders sued Elon over the acquisition of his cousin's company:
https://nypost.com/2021/07/12/elon-musk-defends-teslas-2-6b-solarcity-purchase-in-court/
There was also the Walmart lawsuit due to the numerous fires.
Sales have been nowhere near where they were before the acquisition.
I told my wife my Mach E is going to be recalled. She wanted to know why so I told her some little problem would cause the car to catch on fire and burn the house down. She said, Okay. Then I told her that it appears only to people who think they bought a high performance sport car and always push it to the max. The acceleration is incredible, but it really is not in any way a sports car. Actually, it is very nice to drive and I get to charge it for practically free because I have solar which has already paid for itself. I estimate my charging cost to be 2.5 cents per KwH.
Sadly there it seems that where this is going is that DC fast charging also causes the problem. T
This car is already limited to 150KW which only ever sees for a minute before dropping.
The impending software solution seems likely to pull back acceleration , charging rate and curve, or possibly both.
Question is: Is Ford doing a software fix on affected vehicles so they can still be used without danger of fire or damage, and then replace the under designed main relay switch when the parts are available? That's the right way to handle it without removing any charging or acceleraton performance forever.
Prior to my retirement our engineers were experimenting with both prismatic cell and pouch battery design abd while both had some advantages, neither were the best choice for vehicles.
Why would other makers license batteries from Tesla ? Because they are the best and will most likely continue to be so. Tesla has already done the development and spent the money that GM, Ford and BMW are now doing. The form factor of the cells is irrelevant, and Tesla could very well switch to pouch or prismatic cells in the future if their R&D shows a marked improvement over current designs.
Tesla's solar business has not yet lived up to expectations but give them a few more years. Also, the revenue stream that Tesla will be seeing from their Robotaxi business and licensing their FSD software is going to be incredible. All the while the legacy automakers are going to have the financial millstone from continuing to produce ICE vehicles hanging around their necks for many more years.
And I don't think the taxpayers are going to stomach any more bailouts should Ford/GM/Stellantis (are they even in the market ?) come crying that they are in dire straits again.
My 1992 Toyota truck and my 2006 Toyota Tacoma had more recalls that any Ford I have ever owned
