Looking for some input on a small Inverter - generator

Another vote for a non-inverter generator.

The fridge and wifi will take "dirty" power. Fridge is a motor, wifi will have a 100-240v switching power supply that can handle "anything." A non-inverter generator by default makes a perfect sine wave, only dirtied by "brush noise". An inverter by definition makes a "pixelated" sine wave; the question is just how small are the "pixels"? They output a digital drawing of a natural mathematical phenomenon. Even if an inverter at steady state makes a pretty waveform, hit its output hard with a motor starting up and you'll get a bad voltage sag that hits everything else that's already running.

Running a standard generator at 50-60% of load will use the same fuel as an inverter generator. Only significant savings is at very very light loads.

I have a little baby inverter generator, the carb on it is so finicky and so small, it gums up if you look at it wrong. Ever seen a jet engine with the cowl off? That's what it looks like under the plastic beauty covers of my generator with little tubes going everywhere. IDK if you're going to find parts for this brand you speak of either. (Champion is a good brand, however.)

I would get a conventional generator, 30 amp battery charger, 12V inverter, and a 100 amp-hour Lifepo4 storage battery. You can run your wifi all night off the battery, and, honestly, the fridge as well if it's already cold. Run the generator during the day for the AC and charge the battery. LifePO4 are way better than lead acid-- they deep cycle without drama, last ten years in storage, and charge quickly too. Very popular with the solar crowd.
This is why I stepped up to the 212CC Wen (Chonda clone) instead of the suitcase type. The suitcase looked pretty crammed in / complicated. The 212cc ones I can get to everything on and its wide open. WEN support was pretty good. I bought a spare coil, igniter coil, rewind starter, a full carb with the servo motor and some other odds and ends - just to have around. All those parts were like $100. Murphy's law dictates I will now never need them, which is fine with me.

I would have been happier to go with a standard generator vs inverter but they don't seem to make them in smaller sizes.

Everything I read said to buy a Champion / Wen / predator if your not going Honda / Yamaha. The other off brands don't have any support.
 
Costco has this 'dual fuel' unit. From what I hear, they are quite good. The RV guys love them. The engine is known to last.

YGIvb2m.jpg
 
My Dad has a Champion 2000W inverter for the RV and it started their AC unit for the first season, but after that it would trip out.
Its a 26' RV so not a huge AC unit.
We have a Yamaha 3000iSE for over 20 years now and they made a 3000iSEB with the B (boost) signifying a capacitor to start large RV AC units. These are semi portable at near 200lbs, and quiet and have wheels.
We might have 500hrs on it now? No real problems but I let the carb get gummed up with ethanol fuel a few years ago, and its a bit of job to get at.
We were without power for 5 days this spring and ran it for ~14-16hrs a day on 3 gallons, running the fridge and 2 freezers continuously, plus the TV and internet. No big continuous loads so an inverter works well for that.
 
I had a Wen that sat for 4 years until I stupidly sold it. Didn't even clean the carb and it fired up for the buyer. Since then the past few years I bought a 9000w Predator for my house, and 9000w Champion and a small 2500 Champion inverter for the ranch property. The 2500 ran an 8amp Bauer angle grinder this past week without issues, it was hilarious to hear it rev up and down like a go kart.

Here is an 8000w at Walmart at $543, that is an excellent price. Inverter welders are interesting but not an absolute must have.

https://www.walmart.com/ip/WEN-8000...sor/5480579427?classType=REGULAR&from=/search
Wow, yeah good price. You seem to have a lot of experience with generators. Sounds like the WEN that you did have was reliable?
Inverters are way more costly but this is my issue with just a generator. I want to use propane because I dont even know if we will ahve a power loss for many years as I posted. It will be for those one off major storms every 5 or 10 years if even then.
My reason for not wanting to store gasoline.

Sooooo ... if I use propane I do not have to worry about fuel but if I dont get an inverter from my understanding a regular generator is going to suck down propane much faster then an inverter. I would love to rely on our 120 gallon propane tank and spare BBQ grill 20 lb is need be. But yeah, that price is something to think about I think.
 
I have ran all of that on a champion 1600/2000 watt inverter generator for a week straight in Florida. A 5000/6000 BTU AC can be easily powered with a small generator. Most modern fridges run at 60-75 watts most of the time. A modem and tv barely draw anything.

A small 2500 watt inverter generator, dual fuel, will sip propane and run for a week or more on your propane tank. Plus you can get a couple BBQ size propane tanks for $20 (trade in rusty free garbage at the propane exchange) and have a bunch of extra propane.

In my experience, people buy way too much generator when a smaller one would do. Big generators use big amounts of fuel.
Yes, this in my thinking, though I am ok with the larger inverter I saw at Costco. Im jsut looking for the basics, like you for that one off storm that might knock out power on the Carolina coast. We have a 120 gallon tank and 2 - 4.5 gallon (20lb) bbq grill tanks.
Our county sewer system relies on each dwelling to have a tank and a macerator. As the tank fills the pump turns on and pumps it into the street sewer system. The system runs on 220/240 and then there is even a breaker or two for 110/120 in the panel.
Long term outage you want the system working *LOL* trust me!
 
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I feel I should point out something about generator ownership. Most owners exercise it a few times a year.
Your buying it keeping it in storage until it’s needed: do you really want that pray it works drama?
It’s like gun ownership.
Most owners do NOT exercise their generators a few times a year then go to test them maybe3 days before a hurricane comes when they try to get gasoline at the last moment. They find out their unit does not run and scramble to try to find a repair shop that will fix it immediately, but the shop is booked solid and cannot get them in. Then they find out the gas stations are often sold out for the last minute buyers.


Another vote for a non-inverter generator.

The fridge and wifi will take "dirty" power. Fridge is a motor, wifi will have a 100-240v switching power supply that can handle "anything." A non-inverter generator by default makes a perfect sine wave, only dirtied by "brush noise". An inverter by definition makes a "pixelated" sine wave; the question is just how small are the "pixels"? They output a digital drawing of a natural mathematical phenomenon. Even if an inverter at steady state makes a pretty waveform, hit its output hard with a motor starting up and you'll get a bad voltage sag that hits everything else that's already running.

Running a standard generator at 50-60% of load will use the same fuel as an inverter generator. Only significant savings is at very very light loads.

I have a little baby inverter generator, the carb on it is so finicky and so small, it gums up if you look at it wrong. Ever seen a jet engine with the cowl off? That's what it looks like under the plastic beauty covers of my generator with little tubes going everywhere. IDK if you're going to find parts for this brand you speak of either. (Champion is a good brand, however.)

I would get a conventional generator, 30 amp battery charger, 12V inverter, and a 100 amp-hour Lifepo4 storage battery. You can run your wifi all night off the battery, and, honestly, the fridge as well if it's already cold. Run the generator during the day for the AC and charge the battery. LifePO4 are way better than lead acid-- they deep cycle without drama, last ten years in storage, and charge quickly too. Very popular with the solar crowd.

The biggest issue for a non-inverter is noise and fuel consumption as well as dirty power. I agree a switching power supply can take pretty much anything. The problem is running a standard generator at 50% load is it still takes a large portion of the fuel it uses at full load because it has to maintain close to 3,600 RPM. You are correct that when you load inverter generators up they suddenly as much power as traditional generators. To be completely honest there is a slight extra inefficiency in the inverter unit, too. My inverters at high load typically run at a HIGHER RPM than a a traditional genset! ALWAYS run faster when Eco Mode is off!

Here is what I measured on my Hardline Hour Meter:

Yamaha EF2200IS (MZ-80 Engine 79 CC displacement)

- 3520 RPM (ECON Sw ON)
- 4930 RPM (Econ Sw OFF)
- 5520 RPM (Boost Mode button Pressed)

Honda EU2000i (GX100 Engine 98.5 CC displacement)
- 3010 RPM (Eco Mode ON)
- 4210 RPM (Eco Mode OFF)

Honda EU2200i (GX120 Engine 121 CC displacement)
- 2820 RPM (Eco Mode ON)
- 4000 RPM (Eco Mode OFF)
 
I saw this mid-size Champion dual-fuel unit at Sam's Club yesterday for $450. Other than inverter technology, I think this is enough generator for the OP's needs. 4550 surge/3650 continuous watts seems like a sweet spot for most short term (e.g., 1-4 days) power outages while not being overly thirsty.

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YEah, there certainly is a price premium for the inverter. AS another noted, I need something that would "sip" propane fuel. But this is a thought.
 
Wow, yeah good price. You seem to have a lot of experience with generators. Sounds like the WEN that you did have was reliable?
Inverters are way more costly but this is my issue with just a generator. I want to use propane because I dont even know if we will ahve a power loss for many years as I posted. It will be for those one off major storms every 5 or 10 years if even then.
My reason for not wanting to store gasoline.

Sooooo ... if I use propane I do not have to worry about fuel but if I dont get an inverter from my understanding a regular generator is going to suck down propane much faster then an inverter. I would love to rely on our 120 gallon propane tank and spare BBQ grill 20 lb is need be. But yeah, that price is something to think about I think.
depends on your needs. my little suitcase at 1500w load is likely saving very little gas over a 2500w conventional generator.

now if you buy a 7000w conventional generator vs a 3000w inverter and your load varies from 500-2500w yes you will save a ton of fuel.

240v inverter gens are available but pricey.

YEah, there certainly is a price premium for the inverter. AS another noted, I need something that would "sip" propane fuel. But this is a thought.

That depends on your load.. now of course overbuying a 7000 or 9500w conventional will use a ton of fuel at all times because it has to maintain 3600rpm (60hz*60sec)

Inverter may NOT save much if you are running 50%+ rated capacity.

but power = fuel. I think sipping propane isnt an issue.

you have an outage.. you start up on propane.. if its going to be extended(days+).. switch to gasoline.

you have 2 different requirements that are polar opposites.. so you need to pick something and stick with it..

-fuel economy,

You also need realistic data on what loads you will be runnin, duration of loads, and how overlapping they are

TLDR: Inverter is only a major advantage at low loads... ie less than 40% 25% even better or intermittent loads.
 
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Costco has this 'dual fuel' unit. From what I hear, they are quite good. The RV guys love them. The engine is known to last.

YGIvb2m.jpg
Costco is rough this way. Many times these are warehouse only items and other times it region specific on what they offer. This one isnt offered in the Myrtle Beach to Willmington area on their website and I know the Myrtle Beach Warehouse does not have this one.

With that said. I need a 240 hook up if I want our sewer pump system to work. *LOL* NOTHING I do ever turns out simple and then I end up doing nothing. If I do an inverter it's to make the wife happy for a storm we may never get. Lived here two years and it is true back in 2018 there was a significant power loss for a while after a hurricane.
 
Most owners do NOT exercise their generators a few times a year then go to test them maybe3 days before a hurricane comes when they try to get gasoline at the last moment. They find out their unit does not run and scramble to try to find a repair shop that will fix it immediately, but the shop is booked solid and cannot get them in. Then they find out the gas stations are often sold out for the last minute buyers.




The biggest issue for a non-inverter is noise and fuel consumption as well as dirty power. I agree a switching power supply can take pretty much anything. The problem is running a standard generator at 50% load is it still takes a large portion of the fuel it uses at full load because it has to maintain close to 3,600 RPM. You are correct that when you load inverter generators up they suddenly as much power as traditional generators. To be completely honest there is a slight extra inefficiency in the inverter unit, too. My inverters at high load typically run at a HIGHER RPM than a a traditional genset! ALWAYS run faster when Eco Mode is off!

Here is what I measured on my Hardline Hour Meter:

Yamaha EF2200IS (MZ-80 Engine 79 CC displacement)

- 3520 RPM (ECON Sw ON)
- 4930 RPM (Econ Sw OFF)
- 5520 RPM (Boost Mode button Pressed)

Honda EU2000i (GX100 Engine 98.5 CC displacement)
- 3010 RPM (Eco Mode ON)
- 4210 RPM (Eco Mode OFF)

Honda EU2200i (GX120 Engine 121 CC displacement)
- 2820 RPM (Eco Mode ON)
- 4000 RPM (Eco Mode OFF)
Wow you certainly have experience!

I assume those costly inverters you mention are top of the line. Just by names alone.
So in my OP #1 there is a Firman inverter for $850 4000 watts which I jsut learned is only 120 thanks to @SC Maintenance for pointing that out. Wen and Champion are two others that offer something similar.

If you had to choose what would be your inclination between those three brands?
Keeping in mind, low cost, MUST be propane and MUST have a 240 30 AMP connection in case I want to get our sewer pump running because of a longer term outage.

What is your thought on this? and why is this marketed for anything but the home?
  • Bonded-neutral 240V configuration provides low-power Level 2 charging for battery and hybrid electric vehicles??????
https://www.amazon.com/WEN-6800-Watt-RV-Ready-Generator-DF680iX/dp/B0DVF1RPCJ/ref=sr_1_3?th=1
 
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Costco is rough this way. Many times these are warehouse only items and other times it region specific on what they offer. This one isnt offered in the Myrtle Beach to Willmington area on their website and I know the Myrtle Beach Warehouse does not have this one.

With that said. I need a 240 hook up if I want our sewer pump system to work. *LOL* NOTHING I do ever turns out simple and then I end up doing nothing. If I do an inverter it's to make the wife happy for a storm we may never get. Lived here two years and it is true back in 2018 there was a significant power loss for a while after a hurricane.
If your stepping up to 240V output thats a big jump from where you started. What is the smallest inverter generator you have found that will do 240V? I would have to think your now looking at real power and real money - 8000W?
 
If your stepping up to 240V output thats a big jump from where you started. What is the smallest inverter generator you have found that will do 240V? I would have to think your now looking at real power and real money - 8000W?
Thanks for pointing that out. I was fooled in my OP by that inverter. I thought the plug was a 240 but it is only a 120 for camping trailers.
The inverter/generator below is 240. Which I explained in post #29 with the link to the one below ... at some point I realized my mistake. Im only learning.

I found this WEN and it is looking like a steal for an inverter with 240. If the brand is any good. 240 is a must.
https://www.amazon.com/WEN-6800-Watt-RV-Ready-Generator-DF680iX/dp/B0DVF1RPCJ/ref=sr_1_3?th=1

HOWEVER why is this marketed for anything but the home?
 
Thanks for pointing that out. I was fooled in my OP by that inverter. I thought the plug was a 240 but it is only a 120 for camping trailers.
The inverter/generator below is 240. Which I explained in post #29 with the link to the one below ... at some point I realized my mistake. Im only learning.

I found this WEN and it is looking like a steal for an inverter with 240. If the brand is any good. 240 is a must.
https://www.amazon.com/WEN-6800-Watt-RV-Ready-Generator-DF680iX/dp/B0DVF1RPCJ/ref=sr_1_3?th=1
Thats about what I would have expected. I have a WEN (3500W) and am happy with it, but have only used it once as a real need. I do start it every few months. Has always started no problem. I run only E0 and drain it each time.
 
Thats about what I would have expected. I have a WEN (3500W) and am happy with it, but have only used it once as a real need. I do start it every few months. Has always started no problem. I run only E0 and drain it each time.
I added to my last reply, why in that link on the WEN does it mention for almost anything but home use?
What is
  • Bonded-neutral 240V configuration provides low-power Level 2 charging for battery and hybrid electric vehicles
 
I added to my last reply, why in that link on the WEN does it mention for almost anything but home use?
What is
  • Bonded-neutral 240V configuration provides low-power Level 2 charging for battery and hybrid electric vehicles
No idea. I would just go to WEN's website and get the manual. If it has spec to power what you want it to power then I don't see how its any different.

You used to be able to call WEN and they answered - I did. Not sure if they do anymore.
 
My reason for not wanting to store gasoline.
I dont have any experience with propane, but storing gas hasnt really been an issue, 4 cans at the ranch gets used up every 3-4 months from UTVs and mowing, 4 cans at the house gets rotated into vehicles every 6-8 months. I figure 20 gallons would last at least 2-3 days or so.
 
I dont have any experience with propane, but storing gas hasnt really been an issue, 4 cans at the ranch gets used up every 3-4 months from UTVs and mowing, 4 cans at the house gets rotated into vehicles every 6-8 months. I figure 20 gallons would last at least 2-3 days or so.
Yeah, I can see in your situation how that isnt a problem. We are in a community, no place to store it and we dont use gas for anything but the cars. Meaning we dont live on a ranch. 🙂
I got rid of my gas mower when we moved here in favor of an electric for what you would call our small lot. Just so I didnt need to bother with a 2 gallon gas can.
 
I came here to recommend an open frame inverter gen. Wen and Champion sell the same ones in different colors that have 240V outlets.

Most will come bonded. You break the bond when you hook it to your homes electrical panel. If you are going to just use extension cords, then you keep it bonded. All you have to do is read the manual on how to break the bond. Champion or Wen even have that info on the website usually. Basically, you take out the electrical outlet, and disconnect the white and green wire and tape over the white wire and don't use it.

https://wenproducts.com/collections/dual-fuel-generators

I have the 8750 watt open frame 240V inverter generator from Champion for my hurricane generator and its excellent. Dual fuel wasn't available when I bought mine, so its just gas. I drain the carb and fuel tank after every time I use it and it starts right up no issue. I keep 40-50 gallons of gas in a storage shed in metal jerry cans. If a hurricane is approaching, I fill up the rest of my cans and will have about 100 gallons on hand. (gas is REALLY hard to get after a storm. There are lines hours long and people wait in them. Every gas station in my town sells out and there is no gas. I have done that and I wont do that again. I will have an abundant supply of gas on hand before a storm arrives. My father in law couldn't find gas for days and was on his gas light. I dumped 15 gallons into his truck, free of charge.)

If you are on a budget, the standard 4750 watt Wen dual fuel generator will power what you need.

https://www.amazon.com/WEN-DF475T-4750-Watt-Portable-Generator/dp/B07M8FFS51/ref=sr_1_5?crid=2JW63LPMQ7Q1Z&dib=eyJ2IjoiMSJ9.zZnDTjDjcUisZJiud3M3iSk5Qp6xoH6qbqOLekNFtRVNzZbVeF06Ibz7SNcrUNjSwas-9tX7sW6ivT9-WpfOmvsdTgl8V4VbROLh5q0QQt-EVV7K9k39dF8CeWZJaE94KSlR43WN17GbR6Qg1V7IzeAhxWhmBoa4-MPY0c2J4MehVMOmhT-khUBGjCBpi-poyazS5yWhp5NvxwAXcFsQFMxqmemSBEfQ5PXIygrQQRc.Y8UN6guOYHv2gDXwTG99y5sTY4IHsgcpKKU-0ENlfcs&dib_tag=se&keywords=wen+4000+duel+fuel+generator&qid=1753889052&sprefix=wen+4000+duel+fuel+generator,aps,199&sr=8-5&th=1
 
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