Is using Dino a NO NO in a Turbo?

[RamAir5]

I have posted before that I have a new Optima Turbo. I am trying to wrap my head around the need for Synthetic Oil in this car.

The manual recommends any SM or higher rated oil in 5w-30 or 5w-40 flavors.
I plan on 3000 mile OCIs due to it being Turbo. Is using a good Dino, like QS, Pennzoil or GTX a NO NO in a new turbo with a 3000 mile OCI? I know turbos are tough on oil, but are tough on the "newer" dino oils? Back in the day I had a '87 turbo dodge shelby charger and ran straight 30 weight dino and never had any issues. Have turbos changed that much in the last 25 years?

 

[dparm]

For the record, Acura's RDX motor has its own oil spec called HTO-06. All of those oils meeting/beating it are synthetics.

The Ford EcoBoost doesn't require full syn, but they do want a syn-blend.

Hyundai's 2.0T does not require synthetic either, AFAIK.

 

[Hoosier_Daddy]

look through the UOA's. i've seen excellent results in turbocharged cars on both GTX as well as PYB.

 

[roadrunner1]

I don't know your specific manufacturers requirements for this engine, but in the HD diesel world HDEO "dino" is the norm in turbo applications.

 

[Kestas]

In the past, I've never been a huge fan of synthetics because of economics.

But, I personally always insist on using synthetic oil for turbo engines. This stems from what I've seen when working in the automotive industry, where I've cut open turbos that had oil passages coked shut during use. Granted, that was during the product development phases, and it was a long time ago. I'm sure oils (and turbos) have gotten better since then. But the idea that turbos are that tough on oil has stayed with me.

I use 6K OCI with synthetic on my 2002 Volve S40 turbo. The oil comes out looking good at each oil change.

The car was bought used and had a lot of deposits under the oil filler cap. This was likely from the 7.5K OCI with dino, as recommended ny the manufacturer, which I think is too hard on the oil and engine.

 

[HTSS_TR]

If you like to use conventional in a turbo engine then you should follow the 3-4k miles OCI, if you use synthetic then OCI can be extended to 6-7k miles.

 

[A_Harman]

If you really, really want to use dino oil in a turbo gasoline engine, get something that has a low viscosity spread, or even a monograde. 10w30 is about the only dino multigrade I would be comfortable with. Dino oils with high viscosity spreads achieve the multigrade rating by adding VI polymer, which coke up in the turbo bearings after shutdown and hot soak.

Also, don't get a diesel oil with the expectation that since most diesels are turbocharged, it's the same sort of application. Gasoline engines have maximum exhaust temperatures in the range of 1750F, while diesels max out at about 1250F. It is very important to let the engine sit and idle for 3-5 minutes after driving at high speeds to let the turbo cool before shutting it down.

If your turbo has a water-cooled bearing housing, it will be more tolerant of dino oils and hot shutdowns, but I would still recommend synthetics because turbo's tend to shear oils quickly.

 

[J_Sap]

Originally Posted By: A_Harman
If your turbo has a water-cooled bearing housing, it will be more tolerant of dino oils and hot shutdowns, but I would still recommend synthetics because turbo's tend to shear oils quickly.


I am 95% certain that these engines have a water-cooled bearing (dad has a Sonata Turbo); but I would still use synthetic. Turbo's get hot and it is a new engine design. What if in a couple years they find out that everyone who used dino has to purchase a new turbo after the warranty runs out or if the engine starts loosing power because of sludge because of dino. Synthetic oil is cheap compared to replacing an engine or turbo. My point is you just don't know, so go with synthetic and keep with the 5K OCI like the manufacturer recommended. That's what the Sonata turbo I take care of gets, plus you paid extra for the turbo so pay extra for synthetic.

 

[mva]

If this car is new, and still under waranty, I would follow the Kia requirements for oil and servicing - to the letter. Why go cheap on the oil when a very good synth like 5W30 Penzoil Platinum meets the requirements and doesn't cost much more?

This thread outlines some requirements but I would double check the manual to be sure:

http://www.kia-forums.com/4g-2011-optima/66572-2-0-turbo-sx-oil-change-2.html

"Thanks for the info. I called KIA directly and got this information as it's stated in the owners manual....Engine oil (2.0 T GDI): At first, replace at 3,000 miles (5,000 km) or 6 months, after that, every 5,000 miles (8,000 km) or 6 months.
Same info came from this site Kia Global Information System (KGIS)
It would be consistent with that has been stated by robbtemp.

Here's another oil tidbit (general guidelines)
Selection Of Engine Oil
Recommendation : 5W-30 ACEA A5 (If not available, refer to the recommended API or ILSAC classification)
API classification: SL or SM above
ILSAC classification : GF3, GF4 or above
ACEA Classification : A3 or A5
SAE viscosity grade : Refer to the recommended SAE viscosity number"

PP 5W30 SN meets A5 and GF5

 

[hattaresguy]

Synthetic doesn't really cost that much, you should be able to get an oil change kit special from one of the chain auto parts stores for $30 or less.

Turbo's spin at like 100k rpm and put out a lot of heat, I think its a good idea to run a bit better oil in them. But these days it may not matter as much since regular oils are so good.

 

[whitson01]

i asked the same thing concerning my vehicle (11 mazda cx7 turbo). i use to have a subaru sti. turbos, imo, love synthetic oil. the oil runs through the turbo which lubes and cools it. so you need a good oil which i think you cant beat synthetic. especially considering how many rpm's a turbo spins. with that said ive actually had service advisors and techs tell me NOT to run synthetic which i think is total [censored]. my manual says its not required but i do anyway.

 

[antonmnster]

Depends a lot on how stable the oil temp is.

I had a handful of Saab Turbos back in the day and never ran synthetic. Never had a turbo problem either. I work with a fleet of turbo-diesel equipment and have never seen a turbo or oil-related failure. Granted diesels are different, but none of them is water-cooled.

Turbos seem to create problems only in certain situations when coolant after-run pumps die or owners mod their cars to overboost.

If it were my car, I'd be fine with dino provided it's changed at conservative intervals and the cooling system is kept in tip-top shape.

 

[Cujet]

As a "turbo" guy, I see the dino oil problems. I also see the turbo's run on syn. Big difference. Sure, diesels run dino oil for 900,000 miles without trouble. Trust me, that's different in so many ways.

Audi had nothing but trouble with the small, high RPM turbos. Mostly due to extended oil changes and dino oils. And, those turbo's are modern.

Water cooling does not cool the "hot section" of a turbo. The shaft is directly welded to the turbine. The oil lubricated ring seals run in grooves on the shaft, just a few MM's from the turbine wheel. Water cooling does nothing for this area. Remember, that turbine is literally red hot quite often.

Run a good synthetic if you want the maximum lifespan from that turbo.

 

[dparm]

Diesels typically use higher quality oils, not exactly an apples-to-apples comparison.

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: Kestas
Granted, that was during the product development phases, and it was a long time ago. I'm sure oils (and turbos) have gotten better since then. But the idea that turbos are that tough on oil has stayed with me.


True on both points. Another point of consideration if we are to give advice here is how it's driven. My Audi 200 Turbo spent most of its miles with me at a steady state highway speed with very few really cold starts. It received mostly 15w-40 conventional. Now, if I drove it hard with lots of boost, then I would have stuck with synthetics more often.

 

[Indydriver]

I'm reminded of the comment in one of the M1 Q&A's: There is no circumstance where a synthetic oil will not outperform a conventional.

'Nuff said AFAIC.

 

[45ACP]

Originally Posted By: Indydriver
I'm reminded of the comment in one of the M1 Q&A's: There is no circumstance where a synthetic oil will not outperform a conventional.

'Nuff said AFAIC.


However, not all engines appreciate or respect synthetics. This varies very widely, and some engines do not respond "as they should" to synthetic oil. Again, the opposite is true.

Trial and error is needed sometimes. One glove does not fit all. And the same is true of the praises of synthetic oils.

aquariuscsm uses 20W-50 in his 300ZX turbo, and he uses either conventional or Royal Purple. Sometimes he uses 10W-40. Seeing as how there are no 0W conventionals, and A_Harman seems to have very good advice about how tough turbo is on oil, the 10W may be appropriate there.

My question is why everyone with a turbo would not use a 0W oil, if you were going the synthetic route? Maybe in a summer climate, 10W-30 conventional really IS ok.

 

[tig1]

Here is an interesting video showing a turbo charged engine on a dino. Scroll down to the turbo video.

http://www.mobiloil.com/USA-English/MotorOil/Videos/Videos.aspx

 

[The motor guy]

I think synthetic is beneficial in turbos that aren't water cooled. Most newer engines with turbos are water cooled these days.

 

[river_rat]

Originally Posted By: mva
PP 5W30 SN meets A5 and GF5

+1 If it meets warranty requirements, I'd run this in about anything and feel good. It doesn't cost much more and is engineered for tough applications.