Is Uber The New McJob?

[Vikas]

Did he make $14 and then paid for the gas from that money? 40 minutes of driving will use up at least a gallon of gas if you have efficient car. So subtract $2.50 from that.

Assuming we take IRS per mile as true cost of operating the vehicle, assuming 20 miles round trip, that is $11 cost just for operating the vehicle!

Uber works because most of the drivers are math challenged.

 

[Wolf359]

Originally Posted By: Vikas
Did he make $14 and then paid for the gas from that money? 40 minutes of driving will use up at least a gallon of gas if you have efficient car. So subtract $2.50 from that.

Assuming we take IRS per mile as true cost of operating the vehicle, assuming 20 miles round trip, that is $11 cost just for operating the vehicle!

Uber works because most of the drivers are math challenged.


It's simple math. He said 30 cents a mile and he made $14, works out to 46 miles or 23 miles for the actual trip or $12.42 according to the IRS. The mistake is including the trip back to his starting point. True cabs just hang around the same spot for the next fare. So he was paid 60 cents a mile and wasted 20 minutes of his own time and gas going back to his starting point. However the IRS tax deduction is based on an average car with average mileage for the year. The depreciation and insurance per mile is different if you're driving 50-100k a year instead of 15k a year.

 

[IndyIan]

Originally Posted By: Vikas
Did he make $14 and then paid for the gas from that money? 40 minutes of driving will use up at least a gallon of gas if you have efficient car. So subtract $2.50 from that.

Assuming we take IRS per mile as true cost of operating the vehicle, assuming 20 miles round trip, that is $11 cost just for operating the vehicle!

Uber works because most of the drivers are math challenged.

So how much expense can you write off then as an uber contractor? If you get the $11 back from the tax man it doesn't sound so bad.

 

[zzyzzx]

The fact that Uber has to advertise on TV for drivers should tell you something.

 

[Mr Nice]

Originally Posted By: hatt
Originally Posted By: Indydriver
Originally Posted By: fields
A friend and I became Uber Drivers. He took a person from our airport to the bus depot, and made $14. It took him 20 minutes there and 20 minutes back. I figured he made about $.30 a mile for labor and car expenses! Do not think I will ever drive, and he will not again.


Your friend grossed $21/hr. Not bad for the easiest job in the world.
$21/hr for an independent contractor operating an expensive piece of equipment that needs a lot of insurance is a non starter. You can't make those numbers work.


$21 an hour with full benefits, retirement, paid training, insurance, OT, etc... is even better. It simply doesn't pay to drive as a contractor for a ride sharing company.

 

[jeepman3071]

Originally Posted By: Indydriver
Anyone driving Uber on their personal insurance is a fool and will get burned if they hurt someone. Proper business insurance is available in my state for $200/yr more than a personal policy. This is a serious issue that Riders should also consider before stepping foot in a ride share. It definitely is an Achilles heel of the concept.


Bingo. Saw a few nasty auto bodily injury claims with Uber riders. Driver gets distracted, hits a telephone pole, and is at fault for the accident which injured his/her passenger. Driver's insurance denies coverage, Uber wants nothing to do with it, and now the passenger sues the Uber driver for their medical bills.

I could go on and on, and will avoid using Uber until I absolutely have to. I'd rather have a friend drive me to the airport for a few bucks in gas.

 

[nthach]

Originally Posted By: JHZR2


Uber drivers' background, bonding, etc may be questionable, no idea. However, the uber vehicles I've been in are way nicer and better kept than any taxicabs I've ever been in.

The issue of liability and risk due to a driver's actions is a tough one. I'll bet taxi cabs use private contractors (many of who I have to wonder if they are citizens), and probably show very few assets on the books, in case of an event...

I avoid cabs, the ones in SF are decrepit and makes Muni look like Greyhound. I've been treated well by Uber or Lyft, as a passenger and someone who shares the road with them.

Many cab companies will form LLCs or shell companies in different names to get as many medallions as they can and to dodge their way around legalese - the family who ran a cab company in Oakland enjoyed a cozy relationship with then mayor Jean Quan and they got a few city grants to hire more workers. Turns out city money was used to open a hydroponics shop for weed growers and their son was going on junkets to Dubai and Yemen. Their drivers now drive for Lyft and Uber, they could have done AC Transit if they were citizens.

 

[nthach]

Originally Posted By: Mr Nice


$21 an hour with full benefits, retirement, paid training, insurance, OT, etc... is even better. It simply doesn't pay to drive as a contractor for a ride sharing company.




Many public transit agencies are contracting out to First Transit or MV Transportation, and those drivers barely make more than an Uber driver. Many bus drivers who want to drive for the bigger agencies will use the smaller ones who are contracted as a stepping stone.

Here's one example of a union bus job: http://www.actransit.org/be-an-ac-transit-bus-operator/
Contracted out: http://trideltatransit.com/employment.aspx

 

[oil_film_movies]

Originally Posted By: jeepman3071
Bingo. Saw a few nasty auto bodily injury claims with Uber riders. Driver gets distracted, hits a telephone pole, and is at fault for the accident which injured his/her passenger. Driver's insurance denies coverage, Uber wants nothing to do with it, and now the passenger sues the Uber driver for their medical bills.

I could go on and on, and will avoid using Uber until I absolutely have to. I'd rather have a friend drive me to the airport for a few bucks in gas.


How can Uber's insurance deny coverage? Uber and Lyft are supposed to cover an excess liability that the driver's own personal car insurance won't cover.
Are you saying riders are NOT covered at all (liability BI/PD)?

 

[SeaJay]

Driving livery, cab, uber or what ever service is a job that takes a lot of hours and a lot of hustle to make anything resembling a salary that can support a basic living at best.

 

[eljefino]

Originally Posted By: SeaJay
Driving livery, cab, uber or what ever service is a job that takes a lot of hours and a lot of hustle to make anything resembling a salary that can support a basic living at best.


So is roofing when it rains nine months a year.

Uber works if you're a night owl and can run three drunks home for $20 apiece.

Or if you're a contractor and it's your off season.

 

[Andrew1972]

Driving a car/truck does not take any special skill or even a high school diploma. It pays accordingly....

 

[Wolf359]

Originally Posted By: madRiver
Driving a car/truck does not take any special skill or even a high school diploma. It pays accordingly....


You'd be surprised at how many deadbeats are out there that can't drive for one reason or another. But it does have a somewhat low barrier to entry, but still requires a license and some driving skill. The bad drivers are kicked off if they don't get good reviews in their first 50 rides. You don't even need a car now, there are leasing companies that will lease out a car for Uber drivers by the week.

 

[Mr Nice]

Again, its better to work 20 hours part-time in retail than work as a ride share contractor. Uber keeps lowering the rates it pays their drivers.

Leasing a car to drive as a contractor is financial suicide.

 

[oil_film_movies]

Originally Posted By: Mr Nice
Leasing a car to drive as a contractor is financial suicide.
Well, in some cities Lyft only charges you $48 per week to rent a Hertz Kia Elantra or similar. That includes insurance,.. and you get unlimited mileage for personal use. You only pay for gas. You agree to give them 70 rides per week to get the $48 rate.

HOWEVER, I still think they play weird games with the insurance, trying to go to your insurance company first, then when they don't pay they "say" they will pay. Some strange scam going on there. We need a law to force them to lock in 100% of their own insurance on ride-share people just to keep the insurance company lawyers from blocking payouts on accidents for odd reasons only they could think of....

 

[SatinSilver]

$48 is a great weekly rate. Uber estimates a payment of around $116 per week with their leasing program but that would be with a Corolla or Camry and a year or two old.

https://www.uber.com/drive/vehicle-solutions/leasing/

 

[oil_film_movies]

Originally Posted By: SatinSilver
$48 is a great weekly rate. Uber estimates a payment of around $116 per week with their leasing program but that would be with a Corolla or Camry and a year or two old.

https://www.uber.com/drive/vehicle-solutions/leasing/


Lyft gives you a 2015-2016 Elantra, Cruze, or Corolla for that $48, which is technically the tax on the Hertz rental car.

I need to find out real-world experiences of insurance claims actions taken by the Uber-Lyft coverage rules that seems to oddly merge with your own personal car insurance policy in some way.

 

[Wolf359]

Originally Posted By: SatinSilver
$48 is a great weekly rate. Uber estimates a payment of around $116 per week with their leasing program but that would be with a Corolla or Camry and a year or two old.

https://www.uber.com/drive/vehicle-solutions/leasing/


The Camry seems pretty popular around here as Uber vehicles. I'm just starting to get used to people just randomly standing around on the street corner.

 

[hatt]

Originally Posted By: Wolf359


In theory it was really $42/hr for that one trip. He could have picked up another trip while he was there. He just included time getting to/from work which most people don't include when figuring out their hourly wage. Clearly the numbers don't work if you just do one trip.
$42/hr doesn't work either. Car, gas, maintenance, car insurance, taxes, social security, health insurance, retirement, vacation, etc add up quick. It's not a career. It's a flexible way to make ends meet. Just like working part time at McDs.

 

[GMZ]

Originally Posted By: hatt
$42/hr doesn't work either. Car, gas, maintenance, car insurance, taxes, social security, health insurance, retirement, vacation, etc add up quick. It's not a career. It's a flexible way to make ends meet. Just like working part time at McDs.


Correct. It generates cash flow but doesnt turn a profit, which is a zero sum game on the scale of an individual.