Is Subaru's AWD the best?

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Originally Posted by PimTac
Comparing 4WD to awd is a bit of apples and oranges. The awd systems on many vehicles have improved over the years and caught up to Subaru.

The predictive systems are the better ones in my opinion. Audi, Mazda, Kia.


It appears that way.

Looking forward to seeing Toyota's new 2019 Rav 4. They enhanced their AWD system.

The Crosstrek gives you 8.7"'s of ground clearance.
 
Subaru's system is very good, but it's high regard is more the result of decades of successful marketing than actual performance IMO. The current crop of the competition's AWD systems are far better now than when Subaru was one of the few games in town.

Downside of Subaru's system is the crummy vehicle it is attached to. The stuff of reliability and longevity legends 15 years ago, current offerings are simply awful (first hand experience).
 
Originally Posted by KCJeep
Subaru's system is very good, but it's high regard is more the result of decades of successful marketing than actual performance IMO. The current crop of the competition's AWD systems are far better now than when Subaru was one of the few games in town.

Downside of Subaru's system is the crummy vehicle it is attached to. The stuff of reliability and longevity legends 15 years ago, current offerings are simply awful (first hand experience).


Possibly, but they are doing something right because sales are at record highs and the resale values are up there. Their CVT has been very reliable.
 
To me, discussing which AWD vehicle has the best AWD ability is like arguing about which tires are best. There's just too many variables at play. The specific 'road' you're on, the type of snow, ice, slush. How the driver is driving, etc..etc.

Like I've said in many threads on this Subaru AWD topic, the last three late model Subarus I've owned (2012, 2014 and 2016) were fitted with such horrible factory all season tires, the AWD system helped very little. Again, this was for my driving, not everyone's. When fitted with decent snow tires, the AWD was remarkably better for me.

As much as I think Subarus are great in many ways, I haven't found them to be ideal winter climate vehicles as sold in factory form.

The HVAC system is extremely marginal on newer models as well compared to what I'm used to. That's another topic I guess..
 
The CVT ATS with X-Mode I think is their best one. Some would say the STI with the torque vectoring is their best but that's based on the dated, tried and true VC center diff system. It works well.

They all have open diffs. One of the attributes Subaru used to talk about was the symetrical aspect of it and the lower center of gravity due to the boxer engine. I'm not sure how much that helps or not compared to other AWD competitors.

The 2019 Rav 4 will get torque vectoring.
 
One thing about the newer systems is the computer system and the sensors it employs. On the Mazda the computer processes 200 decisions a second.

Of course what is most important is that you feel secure as you drive in inclement weather. These systems also function in wet conditions and in certain other situations like going downhill at speed going into a curve. They work so seamlessly.
 
Originally Posted by BHopkins
Originally Posted by doitmyself
Reading the comments of the Youtube video, it seems that the tests were done on OEM all season tires, which throws some huge variables into the results. They should have done the comparison using identical tires on each vehicle since tire quality is a HUGE factor in this.


It has always been a question of mine what the results of car tests would be if all cars were shod with the same tire. However, it seems totally fair to test and rate a car's performance with the OEM tires mounted. After all, the OEM tires are what each manufacturer selected to put on their car. We would all hope that they selected a tire that will make their car shine. Not always true, but hey, If Toyota and Honda selected inferior tires, then they deserve to have been rated worse.



I've also wondered how different the results of car tests would be if each car was shod with identical, purpose-built tires (e.g., summer tires for dry/wet, winter for ice/snow, etc.). Since I have try to have two sets of tires for each of my vehicles (usually one with all-season and another with winter tires), I'm particularly interested in real-world and even extreme testing, performed with dedicated tires. The facts remain, for which I've come to the following conclusios:

1. The OEM's choice of tire is a COMPROMISE, usually geared toward economy for economy-oriented vehicles.

They can't offer a package that gets similar or better MPG to the competition, while also superior in all other aspects (e.g., wet, snow, off-road). Specifically for Subaru, they can offer summer tires for their sporty cars (BRZ, WRX, STI), but would have owners and insurance agents knocking down their doors come winter time here in the north were they to offer these tires for their vanilla vehicles! For economy-oriented vehicles, people expect many things, but at a minimum output of effort and money.

2. Roller/dedicated course tests:

Every tire will perform similarly on a set of rollers. Fair, right? I don't trust things like this, because a course can be specifically placed/designed to show an advantage that may not translate into the real-world, even if one vehicle apparently excels and another miserably fails. This isn't entirely true, of course, but I take fake tests like these with a grain of salt!

3. Dedicated tires for testing:

Not many people off-road their compact car or CUV, so dedicated snow/mud/etc. makes total sense for larger, model-vs-model testing, to showcase real-world ability, for those who will actually be doing this kind of driving. In other words, a snowy, rutted hill-climb isn't very realistic for the majority of AWD vehicle owners, and those who will be tackling similar terrain likely wouldn't be foolish enough to do so with OE tires! It sure as heck will get more views, though, to see something struggle against great odds, right!?
 
Originally Posted by PimTac
One thing about the newer systems is the computer system and the sensors it employs. On the Mazda the computer processes 200 decisions a second.

Of course what is most important is that you feel secure as you drive in inclement weather. These systems also function in wet conditions and in certain other situations like going downhill at speed going into a curve. They work so seamlessly.


Good point. For rain/snow they are fantastic. I didn't know the Mazda system was as good as it is.

I wonder how well a CX -3 or 5 would do on the beach? Snow and beach use is my primary concern for my next car. I live in south Jersey and used to go to Avolon, NJ in the winter.
 
Hard to say which is "best." I prefer the combination AWD/4WD systems like in my truck (or my old 4Runner). It has a rear locker and you can choose between 2WD, 4HI, 4LO, and AUTO (essentially unlocked AWD).
 
Originally Posted by buster
Originally Posted by DriveHard
I'm not saying it is the best of the bunch, but I would love to see how the AWD system on the Jeep Renegade stacks up against these other guys. Played around in some mud at the Farm Progress Show yesterday that would have been tough in my 4wd truck with rear locker. Was pretty impressed.


The Jeep Renegades are nice. Although I'm confused which one has which AWD/4WD system. LOL



There are only AWD and FWD versions. It says 4x4 on the back, but it is basically a sophisticated AWD system that is active all the time. I have the Trailhawk version that even has the ability to select the terrain type (snow, sand, rock, mud, or LOCKED).
 
Originally Posted by DriveHard
Originally Posted by buster
Originally Posted by DriveHard
I'm not saying it is the best of the bunch, but I would love to see how the AWD system on the Jeep Renegade stacks up against these other guys. Played around in some mud at the Farm Progress Show yesterday that would have been tough in my 4wd truck with rear locker. Was pretty impressed.


The Jeep Renegades are nice. Although I'm confused which one has which AWD/4WD system. LOL



There are only AWD and FWD versions. It says 4x4 on the back, but it is basically a sophisticated AWD system that is active all the time. I have the Trailhawk version that even has the ability to select the terrain type (snow, sand, rock, mud, or LOCKED).


Nice!
 
I could out drive my wifes 2009 Forester (with factory tires) in a terrible Yaris with blizzaks. I used to like the Subaru rallye style driving flavor in the '90's but with all NOW all the ninnies and nannies - NO! Last good driver was a 1996 Impreza Wagon 5M.

I HATE ABS and TCS and Hill Holder. these Poor driver aides Have almost caused me to crash due to their MALFUNCIONING or HINDERANCES in extreme driving circumstances.


I liked driving our 2005 rav 4 5 speed AWD better than a Subaru.
 
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Guys & gals, I had surgery today. I won't post until I'm off the meds that make my posts nonsense. Might be4-6 days?

I'm ok, the surgery went well.
 
Originally Posted by FlyPenFly
This forum talking about 4wd systems is like when other forums talk about oil.


Signature line of the century. My hat is off!
 
I think its more about a very capable AWD system based on a a more simplistic design and it just plain works and hold up pretty darn well. Some work better but are way too complex and dont hold up as well over time like the subaru's.
 
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