Is my torque converter going out?

[ltslimjim]

Hey, all. I have a '99 2.4L Dodge Stratus with the 41te transmission. I don't believe this car ever had the transmission serviced prior to 100k. Just before that mark I had the ATF fluid changed around 97k; which was still all ATF +3 and 8 or 9 years old, and the standard filter change. I believe this mechanic I used put in store brand ATF+4, which I now believe was a mistake.

I've since put nearly 25k miles on the car. Lately, though, this car is no longer my daily driver and is due for a timing belt change. I'm about to have the transmission fluid changed again, with Valvoline ATF+4 this time.

I'm having some symptoms with the transmission, like a hard shift into reverse after first starting the car lately. Also, for the past few hundred miles when I go into WOT, sometimes it feels like the torque converter hesitates between being locked up or not until it finally complies with going into electronic OD.

My question is, would a simple fluid/filter change again with a good brand ATF+4 alone help with those types of symptoms, or would anyone recommend adding something like SeaFoam TransTune prior to dropping the fluid again?

 

[sangyup81]

drop the pan and change the ATF filter if you have one and give the OEM ATF a shot

 

[crazyoildude]

First try a transmission additive that swells the dry seals then after around 200 miles try a total fluid change and flush with valvoline atf+4 and a new factory mopar filter that had worked for me...you may have to have the tcm reprogrammed or replaced those modules have problems...

Note if the fluid is not burned the trans may be ok

 

[ltslimjim]

Originally Posted By: sangyup81
drop the pan and change the ATF filter if you have one and give the OEM ATF a shot


I've heard that Valvoline is what the dealers used before they started licensing to all number of brand names. Mopar can't be purchase retail anymore to my knowledge, they are trying to get you into the Dealer, but Valvoline has been making the official ATF+4 longer than anyone.

 

[ltslimjim]

Originally Posted By: crazyoildude
First try a transmission additive that swells the dry seals then after around 200 miles try a total fluid change and flush with valvoline atf+4 and a new factory mopar filter that had worked for me...you may have to have the tcm reprogrammed or replaced those modules have problems...

Note if the fluid is not burned the trans may be ok


I have a Wix filter kit on hand already and the Valvoline ATF+4 already purchased.

I did hear of the TCM potentially causing issues, but I figured it would adjust automatically over time? Isn't the hard shifting 'limp' mode actions in order to prevent wear?

EDIT:

A link to the filter kit I'm planning to use Wix 58934

Another option from AC Delco

 

[tomcat27]

some of the problems with the 41te are attributable to the solenoid pack... and store brand fluid should be ok as long as it is licensed (look for the license code on the bottle) as it must have the lubrizol additives to be licensed. altho admittedly I always use Valvoline, Mopar, or Amsoil

 

[ltslimjim]

Originally Posted By: tomcat27
some of the problems with the 41te are attributable to the solenoid pack... and store brand fluid should be ok as long as it is licensed (look for the license code on the bottle) as it must have the lubrizol additives to be licensed. altho admittedly I always use Valvoline, Mopar, or Amsoil


What this mechanic used was the O'Reilly Auto store brand. I believe this was after the licensing became widespread:

http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/detail/ORY0/ATF4.oap?pt=N0470&ppt=C0207

NOTE: The difference I CAN tell is that the store brand is rated for only 15k mile intervals, not the standard OEM 30k recommended. Another reason to stay away from a store brand, at least that one anyway. I guess by that, it means I was due 10k miles ago?

 

[Nick R]

Change the fluid again, and add a bottle of lubegard red.

 

[The Critic]

All ATF+4 is the same, regardless of brand as long it is licensed/approved by Chrysler.

 

[The_Jeff]

Sounds more like a valve body issue. Agree on the fluid change idea. IIRC dodges you can hit with a scan tool to see how the computer is tweaking the shift qualit y/firmness. If it's maxxed out to one side or the other you have a problem.

 

[meep]

how often are you at WOT? harder driving = harder AT life. you're at ~120,000 miles on an AT that wasn't serviced until 100k. not bad.

scan tool = good idea. this trans computer is pretty cool, it learns and remembers how much more fluid needs to be allowed through the solenoid/valve for each shift.... worn clutches = more fluid.... so the computer can give an indication of clutch life.

if the vehicle has been gently driven, it may just be solenoid seals or valve body. above suggestions for seal swellers not bad.

As a last ditch, keep some brake fluid in the trunk. if you get stranded, dump a tbsp in the AT and run it. the seals will swell, pressures will come up, and it will run--- maybe a month (or less) until they all blow. in other words, it will get you home, get you to the shop, and then implode.

 

[ltslimjim]

So, if I added something like Lubegard in the red bottle, would it have to be flushed or is that a simple additive, not a fre-transmission flush fluid?

 

[eagle23]

Lubegard red is an additive that you leave in. I tried it, as have others, on various transmissions. In my case, a 91 Ford Ranger pickup with the A4LD trans. After about 50 miles, the difference was noticeable. Honda owners have also used it with good success.

It can't hurt to do the ATF change you have planned, filter change, and Lubegard red. The computer stuff I have no experience with. Keep us posted!

 

[ltslimjim]

Will do, car will go in the shop within the next 2 weeks.

 

[ltslimjim]

OK I purchased the LubeGard in the red bottle today for use after I change my ATF. Usually, on a filter/fluid change the 'initial fill' says 4.1-4.2 Quarts. I have 4 Quarts of the Valvoline ATF+4.

So, does that mean it's safe to top off the remaining 3-6 oz worth with the LubeGard OR should I make sure I put it in first, 9 oz worth, as 9.2 Quarts is the entire capacity of transmission, before adding Valvoline and bringing to proper level???

I'm thinking along the lines of adding most of the LubeGard after the fluid/filter is changed, and then putting in 3 Quarts of Valvoline and topping off to the correct ATF fluid level with the 4th Quart of Valvoline that I have.

Just waiting on my timing belt/tensioner/pulley kit that I ordered from RockAuto, as I'm having this done at the same time as the timing belt service.

 

[turbochem]

Originally Posted By: ltslimjim
Originally Posted By: tomcat27
some of the problems with the 41te are attributable to the solenoid pack... and store brand fluid should be ok as long as it is licensed (look for the license code on the bottle) as it must have the lubrizol additives to be licensed. altho admittedly I always use Valvoline, Mopar, or Amsoil


What this mechanic used was the O'Reilly Auto store brand. I believe this was after the licensing became widespread:

http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/detail/ORY0/ATF4.oap?pt=N0470&ppt=C0207

NOTE: The difference I CAN tell is that the store brand is rated for only 15k mile intervals, not the standard OEM 30k recommended. Another reason to stay away from a store brand, at least that one anyway. I guess by that, it means I was due 10k miles ago?


But ATF +4 needs to meet ATF +4 specs, no? And what is this "rated" business? And where did you get your info? That is all... =0}

 

[ltslimjim]

Originally Posted By: turbochem
Originally Posted By: ltslimjim
Originally Posted By: tomcat27
some of the problems with the 41te are attributable to the solenoid pack... and store brand fluid should be ok as long as it is licensed (look for the license code on the bottle) as it must have the lubrizol additives to be licensed. altho admittedly I always use Valvoline, Mopar, or Amsoil


What this mechanic used was the O'Reilly Auto store brand. I believe this was after the licensing became widespread:

http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/detail/ORY0/ATF4.oap?pt=N0470&ppt=C0207

NOTE: The difference I CAN tell is that the store brand is rated for only 15k mile intervals, not the standard OEM 30k recommended. Another reason to stay away from a store brand, at least that one anyway. I guess by that, it means I was due 10k miles ago?


But ATF +4 needs to meet ATF +4 specs, no? And what is this "rated" business? And where did you get your info? That is all... =0}


On the bottle of O'Reilly's ATF+4 it states for use in service up to 15,000k miles.

I'm not sure if O'Reilly is stating ATF+4 'compatible' or ATF+4 licensed or certified.

EDIT: Apparently, it is, but weird how it said less service mileage?

http://www.centerforqa.com/licensedatf4brands.html

 

[eagle23]

>>So, does that mean it's safe to top off the remaining 3-6 oz worth with the LubeGard OR should I make sure I put it in first, 9 oz worth, as 9.2 Quarts is the entire capacity of transmission, before adding Valvoline and bringing to proper level???
I don't recall the LG red ratio, but the 1 oz/qt you suggest sounds right. I would add it in proportion to the total fill of the trans. If you later change the pan fluid (the 4 qts +/-) then I'd add the proportional amount of LG red to replace what was drained. It wouldn't matter if you added it at the beginning, middle or end. It all gets mixed in less than a minute once you're in gear..