I'm about to have new front rotors and pads put on. Is bedding in new brakes required or is driving normally after they are installed just fine?
Is bedding in new brakes required?
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I've bought a few sets off ebay, and they have specific bed in instructions.
I follow the instructions - brakes work great.
I follow the instructions - brakes work great.
Even if not required you can go easy for a while because it's your car and it won't hurt anything even if it's not required.
They all seem to work fine with normal driving from my experience.
Bedding just makes your brakes optimum performance come sooner and in a controlled environment.
If the rotors and pads are changed and there is no bed-in done (on pads that need to be bed) you run a risk of uneven pad material transfer since most drivers modulate brake pedal pressure during normal day-to-day braking and they come to complete stops.
If the rotors and pads are changed and there is no bed-in done (on pads that need to be bed) you run a risk of uneven pad material transfer since most drivers modulate brake pedal pressure during normal day-to-day braking and they come to complete stops.
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Don't know if bedding is necessary, but I do it and never had issues. It's not difficult, so why not do it?
I've never done it on any car I've ever driven. Then again, the only cars I've ever driven were bland econoboxes. if I were putting high end brakes on an expensive sports car then I'd follow the bedding in instructions to the letter.
in every car I've done brakes on I just drive normally after a few drives its broken in.
depends on the brakes.
Typically if you didn't buy racing brakes, then no it's not necessary. Just drive normally, and be careful the first few brakings.
You can ask your mechanic when you pick the car up if you need to do anything. They should advise you.
Typically if you didn't buy racing brakes, then no it's not necessary. Just drive normally, and be careful the first few brakings.
You can ask your mechanic when you pick the car up if you need to do anything. They should advise you.
Follow the directions from the pad manufacturer. Bedding is typically pretty simple. On high performance or race pads, it can be very important; not bedding the pads correctly can lead to various kinds of failure which aren't fun on track.
Generally not necessary. However, modern pads can still out-gas and fade significantly until heated to full temp for a few cycles.
So, "IF" you plan on performance driving, towing, or any other situation where the brakes will be asked to work hard, a few full heat cycles will help.
There was a guy on here who experienced brake fade during some spirited driving. Had he heat cycled the pads beforehand, it may not have been a problem.
Anybody who is doing track days should bed in pads first. Lest they find that they can't slow for the 5th turn due to brake fade.
So, "IF" you plan on performance driving, towing, or any other situation where the brakes will be asked to work hard, a few full heat cycles will help.
There was a guy on here who experienced brake fade during some spirited driving. Had he heat cycled the pads beforehand, it may not have been a problem.
Anybody who is doing track days should bed in pads first. Lest they find that they can't slow for the 5th turn due to brake fade.
I've always brake in new pads/shoes! If you don't cut or turn your drums/rotors then irregularities exists and when called for, those few extra feet needed to have a controlled stop would have been lost! Out of the box from any manufacture I've see garbage sold as premium! Pad surfaces were ground at an angle not in parallel with steel backing plates it was bonded to. Brake shoes were ground at factory with tapers, large diameter on outboard diameter versus inner diameter being smaller. Also it helps to get the new brake material bedded into the steel surfaces that has a different friction material on it. There's more issues with this procedure in shoe brake ins and proper installations than time will allow for.
Aggressive bedding can cause glazing and brake squeal. I figure if a 200 MPH super bike recommends drive normally with easy brake application for the first 200 miles its good enough for the grocery getter.
This is the break in procedure from the OE makers of Porsche pads, nothing to aggressive here either. For the rear pads there is no break in procedure you can never get them to apply with the same or more pressure as the front.
Quote:
The bedding in/brake in procedure should be done as follows:
Drive at around 35 mph (60 kmh) about 500 – 800 yards (solid discs about 500 yards, vented discs 750 yards) with slightly dragging brakes (a.k.a. light brake pedal pressure) (brake pressure < 5 bar). This process allows the brake temperature to slowly and evenly build up to 300 degrees C (572F).
Now if possible drive about 2200 yards maintaining same speed without braking to allow the pads and discs to evenly cool down. At the end perform a regular brake application from 35 mph to 0. However, no Panic Stop.
Now the friction surface evenly developed friction coal, the pads bonded with the disc surface, and tensions in the disc materials disappeared.
This is the break in procedure from the OE makers of Porsche pads, nothing to aggressive here either. For the rear pads there is no break in procedure you can never get them to apply with the same or more pressure as the front.
Quote:
The bedding in/brake in procedure should be done as follows:
Drive at around 35 mph (60 kmh) about 500 – 800 yards (solid discs about 500 yards, vented discs 750 yards) with slightly dragging brakes (a.k.a. light brake pedal pressure) (brake pressure < 5 bar). This process allows the brake temperature to slowly and evenly build up to 300 degrees C (572F).
Now if possible drive about 2200 yards maintaining same speed without braking to allow the pads and discs to evenly cool down. At the end perform a regular brake application from 35 mph to 0. However, no Panic Stop.
Now the friction surface evenly developed friction coal, the pads bonded with the disc surface, and tensions in the disc materials disappeared.
Heat cycles allow any binders and/or release agents to be 'burned' out of the pad, and a proper bedding procedure (which brings about those heat cycles) will allow an even deposition of pad material on the disc.
Both of these are desirable as they bring about more effective and therefore safer braking.
Both of these are desirable as they bring about more effective and therefore safer braking.
Most manufacturer websites have instructions or they are in the box with the pads. Either way I would follow whatever is instructed or bed them with 10-15 50 mph to 30 mph stops
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What is brake fade? Is that where you press harder on the pedal and it doesn't stop any faster?
Originally Posted By: motor_oil_madman
What is brake fade? Is that where you press harder on the pedal and it doesn't stop any faster?
Where the performance of the friction materials (not fluids) drops when they get hot from use. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brake_fade "The reduction of friction termed brake fade is caused when the temperature reaches the "kneepoint" on the temperature-friction curve and gas builds up between disc and pad. "
What is brake fade? Is that where you press harder on the pedal and it doesn't stop any faster?
Where the performance of the friction materials (not fluids) drops when they get hot from use. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brake_fade "The reduction of friction termed brake fade is caused when the temperature reaches the "kneepoint" on the temperature-friction curve and gas builds up between disc and pad. "
Looking into it further, the manufacturer of the rotors and pads going on the vehicle (Wagner) recommends the following:
"An effective burnish cycle to seat the friction materials into the opposing rotor and drum surfaces requires approximately 200 stops. The 200 stops are consistent with the burnish procedure outlined in the Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards FMVSS 105 and FMVSS 135. 200 stops may not be practical for many repair shops. Therefore, we recommend the following burnish procedure:
Make approximately 20 “Complete Stops” from 30-mph
- OR –
20 “Slow-Downs” from 50-mph to 20-mph with light to moderate pedal pressure
NO PANIC STOPS
Allow at least 30 seconds between brake applications for the brake pads or shoes to cool down
It is critical to follow cool down procedures to avoid damaging NAO, Ceramic and Semi-Met friction material as well as the rotor/drum
No high speed stops and/or braking under heavy loads that could result in glazed or otherwise damaged linings
Using these guidelines, the friction materials will have conformed to the surface of the rotors and drums for improved stopping performance. In addition, the thermal conditioning of the friction materials during this process will increase the stability of braking effectiveness over a greater range of temperatures compared to when they were first installed. It’s a good practice for the repair shops to communicate with their customers that their technicians have conditioned the friction and rotors and that the customers should continue this process by avoiding aggressive braking for the next couple of days. Good communication of this information will be helpful and prevent comebacks."
Source - http://www.wagnerbrake.com/technical/technical-tips/break-in.html
"An effective burnish cycle to seat the friction materials into the opposing rotor and drum surfaces requires approximately 200 stops. The 200 stops are consistent with the burnish procedure outlined in the Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards FMVSS 105 and FMVSS 135. 200 stops may not be practical for many repair shops. Therefore, we recommend the following burnish procedure:
Make approximately 20 “Complete Stops” from 30-mph
- OR –
20 “Slow-Downs” from 50-mph to 20-mph with light to moderate pedal pressure
NO PANIC STOPS
Allow at least 30 seconds between brake applications for the brake pads or shoes to cool down
It is critical to follow cool down procedures to avoid damaging NAO, Ceramic and Semi-Met friction material as well as the rotor/drum
No high speed stops and/or braking under heavy loads that could result in glazed or otherwise damaged linings
Using these guidelines, the friction materials will have conformed to the surface of the rotors and drums for improved stopping performance. In addition, the thermal conditioning of the friction materials during this process will increase the stability of braking effectiveness over a greater range of temperatures compared to when they were first installed. It’s a good practice for the repair shops to communicate with their customers that their technicians have conditioned the friction and rotors and that the customers should continue this process by avoiding aggressive braking for the next couple of days. Good communication of this information will be helpful and prevent comebacks."
Source - http://www.wagnerbrake.com/technical/technical-tips/break-in.html
I used the Zuckhausen/Stoptech procedure to no avail, usually ends in pedal pulsation. I've been suggesting normal driving with no emergency stops for 100 miles when I do brakes for friends, and I've been doing the same here.
Something more aggressive like a PBR Metal Master or Pagid/Textar might need a bit more persuasion.
Something more aggressive like a PBR Metal Master or Pagid/Textar might need a bit more persuasion.
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