Is 0w40 slightly Thicker than 5w30?

[Greg L]

The reason I ask:

I have been using Castrol Edge 5w30 in our 2007 Prius since last year.

My supply of the Castrol is about to run out, so I have been topping off with Pennzoil Ultra 0w40...which works fine. The question I have is: my next full OCI, should I just switch to my stash of Pennzoil Ultra 0w40, once the Edge runs out?


It is getting warmer here, not sure how much that will affect the weight.

Thoughts?


Thanks,

GL

 

[69GTX]

A stronger 5w30 grade like M1 runs around 11.1 vis at 100 deg C. The Castrol is probably close to that. The 0w-40 M1 used to be up at 13.5-13.8 but revent VOA's on the new FS stuff seems closer to 12.8-13.2. And that stuff shears darn pretty quick in the new Hellcats where it's at 11.8-12.4 in 500-1000 miles.

The gap between the 0w-40 vs. 5w30 grades does seem to be shrinking. For those that want a stronger 40 grade they can use the 5w-40 which are still in the mid to upper 13's. Shouldn't be any problem running your 0w-40 PU in the warmer months in Northern Caifornia. And by fall, it will probably have sheared down to a 30 grade.

 

[d00df00d]

0w-40 is significantly thicker than 5w30.

 

[OVERKILL]

Depends on which 5w30

A Euro 5w30 and a 0w-40 are VERY close to the same viscosity. A typical GF-5 NA 5w30 has an HTHS down closer to the 3.0 mark, making it a bit thinner.

 

[Greg L]

I should mention the Castrol Edge is the EP (extended performance) variety.


Here are their number from the PDF MSDS:

5w30 Viscosity @ 100C, cSt ASTM D445 = 10.8

 

[Greg L]

And Pennzoil Ultra:

0w40 Viscosity is 13.7 at 100C degrees

 

[zeng]

That difference in KV@100*C in itself is substantial.
Having said that, I don't see any issue with a 0W40 in this car.

 

[cmhj]

yes

 

[KCJeep]

The kv@100's are not that far apart, but the HTHS is. As noted above, the 0w40 is a good bit thicker.

I would absolutely still use it though.

 

[edyvw]

Depends which 5W30.
If you are talking about ACEA A1/A5, GF-5 and generally 5W30 oils you can find on shelfs in Wal Mart, yes 0W40 is significantly thicker.
If you are talking about 0/5W30 Euro oils (meeting ACEA A3, B3 B4, C3) then it is NOT significantly thicker.
For example.
New Mobil 1 0W40 FS has cst of 12.9. I am running Mobil 1 ESP 5w30 in my BMW that has cst of 12.1. Even more important for turbo application, Mobil 1 0W40 FS has HTHS of 3.6. Mobil 1 ESP 5w30 has HTHS of 3.58. So basically, no difference.

 

[SR5]

Originally Posted By: edyvw
Even more important for turbo application, Mobil 1 0W40 FS has HTHS of 3.6. Mobil 1 ESP 5w30 has HTHS of 3.58. So basically, no difference.


I hear what you are saying about Euro 5w30 oils.

The Australian Castrol Edge 5w30 A3/B4 has a HTHS of 3.6 cP, same as the new Mobil 1 0W-40 FS.

The old Mobil 1 0W-40 was 3.8 cP, while regular ILSAC Mobil 1 5w30 has a HTHS of 3.1 cP.

Right now I'm using Castrol GTX 15w40 and it has a HTHS of 4.0 cP, while Mobil 1 Advanced Fuel Economy 0w30 has a HTHS of 3.0 cP.

So a 30 weight can be as low as 3.0 cP and a 40 weight can be as high as 4.0 cP with 3.5-3.6 cP being the border region.

 

[dlundblad]

I wonder how Castrol's 10w40 Edge HM compares to Mobil 1 0w40

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted By: SR5
Originally Posted By: edyvw
Even more important for turbo application, Mobil 1 0W40 FS has HTHS of 3.6. Mobil 1 ESP 5w30 has HTHS of 3.58. So basically, no difference.


I hear what you are saying about Euro 5w30 oils.

The Australian Castrol Edge 5w30 A3/B4 has a HTHS of 3.6 cP, same as the new Mobil 1 0W-40 FS.

The old Mobil 1 0W-40 was 3.8 cP, while regular ILSAC Mobil 1 5w30 has a HTHS of 3.1 cP.

Right now I'm using Castrol GTX 15w40 and it has a HTHS of 4.0 cP, while Mobil 1 Advanced Fuel Economy 0w30 has a HTHS of 3.0 cP.

So a 30 weight can be as low as 3.0 cP and a 40 weight can be as high as 4.0 cP with 3.5-3.6 cP being the border region.



Redline 5W40 has HTHS of 4.4cp.
Their 5W30 is 3.7!

 

[SR5]

Originally Posted By: edyvw

Redline 5W40 has HTHS of 4.4cp.
Their 5W30 is 3.7!


Yes and Penrite 10-Tenths 10W-40 has a HTHS of 4.45 cP (from memory) and Mobil 1 5W-50 has a HTHS of 4.4 and Mobil 1 15W-50 has a HTHS of 4.5 cP.

So just like 30 & 40 weight meet at 3.5 - 3.6 cP, it looks like 40 & 50 weight meet at 4.4 - 4.5 cP.

Yet most xW-20 oils are about 2.6 - 2.7 cP. This is a fairly narrow range. Of course RedLine 0W-20 is 2.9 & Red Line 5W-20 at 3.0 cP is the exception.

What was the OP's question again ? I may have got side tracked.

 

[Gokhan]

0W-40 is actually a lot thicker than 5w30, especially Mobil 1 0W-40 SN. It's almost as thick as 15w40 HDEO when hot.

 

[BobFout]

Originally Posted By: Gokhan
0W-40 is actually a lot thicker than 5w30, especially Mobil 1 0W-40 SN. It's almost as thick as 15w40 HDEO when hot.

Mobil 1 0w40 is not close to HDEO 15w40s for either 100C visco or 150C HTHS.


http://www.pqiamerica.com/March2013PCMO/HDEO SUMMARYrev2.html

15w40 HTHS are close to 4.3 cP.

 

[53' Stude]

LOL!

BobFout: thanks for the HONEST info as I was like "what the heavens name is Gokhan saying!?"

 

[KitaCam]

Topped up my 5w30 fill with Pennzoil Ultra Platinum 0w40 and the 40w definitely poured thicker than the 30w.

 

[bobbydavro]

A 0W-40 is often thinner than a 5w30 (3.5cp HTHS) if you look at the Newtonian viscosity. The base oil will be much thinner on a 0W-40 and therefore also use more VII to get the Kv100 where it needs to be

Don't underestimate this base oil viscosity. It's more relevant than the non Newtonian oil and measurements made (HTHS and kv100 of fully formulated oil )

Not sure I can see a link between HTHS and turbo deposits though? VII amount and type are certainly more of interest.

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: bobbydavro
A 0W-40 is often thinner than a 5w30 (3.5cp HTHS) if you look at the Newtonian viscosity.

The only issue is that most people in North America haven't seen, let alone tried, a 5w30 in A3/B4; E6, E7, E9; or C3.