AutoRX - it's like a bad CIA cover up. A good conspiracy needs everyone involved to be on the same page!
interesting arx claim
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I don't give a toss if it's grass green red, or sky blue pink under the valve cover. Before and after compression is all I'm interested in and I get an improvement every time. Eliminating VANOS rattle in the BMW was an added bonus (tip OEM VANOS seals are rubbish)
Re: Start-up noise--starving for oil [Re: roger1997s]
roger1997s Offline
Registered: 12/26/06
Posts: 5
Loc: nj
My Auto-Rx HORROR story. Read much about it and finally ordered 2 cans at $20 each, expensive. But I figured I'd give it a try. Now the problem--there is a 100% money back guarantee if it didn't work. No details provided (return container, time limit, etc???). I even did a search. I asked the question in the comments box when I ordered regarding how I get money back if it doesn't work.
WOW--got blasted from the owner, patent holder, CEO--all the same guy. Then we exchanged emails, I was friendly, curious, etc but he was NASTY. He decided to "disengage" and canceled purchase, refunded money. He stated he only wants long term customers!!!!
I guess his guarantee is WORTHLESS based on his reaction.
roger1997s Offline
Registered: 12/26/06
Posts: 5
Loc: nj
My Auto-Rx HORROR story. Read much about it and finally ordered 2 cans at $20 each, expensive. But I figured I'd give it a try. Now the problem--there is a 100% money back guarantee if it didn't work. No details provided (return container, time limit, etc???). I even did a search. I asked the question in the comments box when I ordered regarding how I get money back if it doesn't work.
WOW--got blasted from the owner, patent holder, CEO--all the same guy. Then we exchanged emails, I was friendly, curious, etc but he was NASTY. He decided to "disengage" and canceled purchase, refunded money. He stated he only wants long term customers!!!!
I guess his guarantee is WORTHLESS based on his reaction.
Right in the middle of his cancer treatment at Mayo Clinic. How convenient of you to omit that?
Originally Posted By: expat
"Especially since, when you see those pics flash by on that quaint arx site are of............ wait for it............... what's under valve covers."
Oh, you mean those before and after pics, that just happen to be Sepia tinted Before, and Blue tinted After.
Personally I never did lift my valve cover, nor did I cut open an Oil filter, I was looking for tangible results, like improved Compression, Improved Performance or improved economy.
"Especially since, when you see those pics flash by on that quaint arx site are of............ wait for it............... what's under valve covers."
Oh, you mean those before and after pics, that just happen to be Sepia tinted Before, and Blue tinted After.
Personally I never did lift my valve cover, nor did I cut open an Oil filter, I was looking for tangible results, like improved Compression, Improved Performance or improved economy.
Originally Posted By: sprintman
I don't give a toss if it's grass green red, or sky blue pink under the valve cover. Before and after compression is all I'm interested in and I get an improvement every time. Eliminating VANOS rattle in the BMW was an added bonus (tip OEM VANOS seals are rubbish)
Very much so.
I don't give a toss if it's grass green red, or sky blue pink under the valve cover. Before and after compression is all I'm interested in and I get an improvement every time. Eliminating VANOS rattle in the BMW was an added bonus (tip OEM VANOS seals are rubbish)
Very much so.
Beisan seals good. RX good too for VANOS seal rejuvenation. It sure beats replacing them, or at least delaying replacement.
Originally Posted By: chevrofreak
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
I don't see Trav as having an agenda, he tried the product it didn't work.
It didn't work for what he wanted it to work for. That doesn't mean it didn't do anything at all.
That could be true, but then both of us are speculating. Maybe he can elaborate more. We can put it another way, and say based on reading his comments he wasn't happy with the product. Others have been happy so we can call it mixed results? Some love it, some hate it. Same goes for lots of other products, only this one has some strange way of really firing up a lot of members here. JMO
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
I don't see Trav as having an agenda, he tried the product it didn't work.
It didn't work for what he wanted it to work for. That doesn't mean it didn't do anything at all.
That could be true, but then both of us are speculating. Maybe he can elaborate more. We can put it another way, and say based on reading his comments he wasn't happy with the product. Others have been happy so we can call it mixed results? Some love it, some hate it. Same goes for lots of other products, only this one has some strange way of really firing up a lot of members here. JMO
Better not mention MMO then?
Why not? MMO is to me, what A-Rx is to you. Only I don't sell it, or resort to insulting members who don't use it. It's loved by some hated by others, I've tried both most here know how I feel about it.
Well, for what it's worth, here are my experiences with ARX on two vehicles.
Vehicle #1: My 1998 BMW 528i sport. The treatment was a couple of years ago - maybe 2006? - at around 130,000km. This vehicle has been owned by me since 2001, and the first owner was personal friends with my indy mechanic at the time and only put 40,000km on the car. It's had a diet of 1) Pennzoil syn 5W50 @ 3,000-5,000km intervals for the first 50,000km. 2) Mobil 1 0W40 @6,000km/6month intervals for the next 70,000km. 3) GC @8,000km/6month intervals for the remaining miles. The last two summers I've been running Rotella 15W40 HDEO for a variety of reasons - back to GC in the winters.
When I did the treatments we were on "old" instructions which were for a short intervals (1000mi I think) and only one bottle despite having a 7L sump. This engine should have been spotless inside with the previous oil regimen, but I did have a single lifter ticking at a level annoying to me and I was curious about ring pack cleaning etc...
When I dumped the Mobil 1 I found out just how noisy my engine was. When the dino HDEO (my ARX carrier) went in the rest of the engine quieted so much that the lifter tick was actually very noticeable now. Over the next 500km I noticed a dramatic increase in power and the lifter tick *almost* went away. There were some little curly-Qs of carbon in the filter but no goo (as I expected).
In hindsight, the increase in power may have been due to VANOS seal reconditioning (a problem we were unaware of back at that time) and not exclusively from ring pack cleaning.
Now, in the mean time, I went back to GC with a maintenance dose. I have personally concluded that the ester in GC interacts negatively with the maint dose of ARX (despite what Frank@ARX says) and cancelled the cleaning effectiveness of each other. When I rinsed a measuring cup which contained ARX with GC, the ARX was isolated in a sphere in the middle of the cup. I posted about it here. I does NOT do that in the HDEOs I usually use as ARX carriers or rinse agents - it blends evenly.
My remaining light lifter tick did not improve over the next couple of years until I switched to dino HDEO one summer with a 4oz maint dose - the tick immediately started to improve again. I no longer run maint doses in GC. To be clear, my tick is just a little uneven noise in the engine character, not a clacking bouncing off of other cars. It's light - kind of like a stock E46 M3 sounds when everything is perfectly normal.
Vehicle #2: 2002 BMW 540
This is my father's and was running BMW 5W30 oil from the dealer at half the OLM interval - so around 10,000km OCI. Despite using "good" oil, changed more often than necessary, it had knocking, lifter clatter, traditional Castrol red buildup etc... Again we embarked on this exercise with the "old" instructions which were lighter duty.
During the process he did not describe any changes in power or fuel economy, but all the noises nearly stopped completely in short order. His knocking appears to be a now-known VANOS issue with the M62TU engine but even it was reduced. We started using GC after he was done ARX and it has remained improved.
Just to see if we could have any effect on the remaining VANOS knock, we're now running two bottles in HDEO and are at the 5000km mark - significantly more aggressive than the old instructions. We're about to start a rinse phase again with HDEO and see how things go.
So the product has worked for us, even when we used oil which should never had a problem (my lifter tick developed running Mobil 1, and my dad's running BMW syn). I do have some problems with Frank's style, and insistent defense of his product "doing everything right" even given some evidence about poor mixing with GC for instance. Be that as it may, I think the product has merit. It won't do something for everyone, and it won't clean dirt that isn't there.
Vehicle #1: My 1998 BMW 528i sport. The treatment was a couple of years ago - maybe 2006? - at around 130,000km. This vehicle has been owned by me since 2001, and the first owner was personal friends with my indy mechanic at the time and only put 40,000km on the car. It's had a diet of 1) Pennzoil syn 5W50 @ 3,000-5,000km intervals for the first 50,000km. 2) Mobil 1 0W40 @6,000km/6month intervals for the next 70,000km. 3) GC @8,000km/6month intervals for the remaining miles. The last two summers I've been running Rotella 15W40 HDEO for a variety of reasons - back to GC in the winters.
When I did the treatments we were on "old" instructions which were for a short intervals (1000mi I think) and only one bottle despite having a 7L sump. This engine should have been spotless inside with the previous oil regimen, but I did have a single lifter ticking at a level annoying to me and I was curious about ring pack cleaning etc...
When I dumped the Mobil 1 I found out just how noisy my engine was. When the dino HDEO (my ARX carrier) went in the rest of the engine quieted so much that the lifter tick was actually very noticeable now. Over the next 500km I noticed a dramatic increase in power and the lifter tick *almost* went away. There were some little curly-Qs of carbon in the filter but no goo (as I expected).
In hindsight, the increase in power may have been due to VANOS seal reconditioning (a problem we were unaware of back at that time) and not exclusively from ring pack cleaning.
Now, in the mean time, I went back to GC with a maintenance dose. I have personally concluded that the ester in GC interacts negatively with the maint dose of ARX (despite what Frank@ARX says) and cancelled the cleaning effectiveness of each other. When I rinsed a measuring cup which contained ARX with GC, the ARX was isolated in a sphere in the middle of the cup. I posted about it here. I does NOT do that in the HDEOs I usually use as ARX carriers or rinse agents - it blends evenly.
My remaining light lifter tick did not improve over the next couple of years until I switched to dino HDEO one summer with a 4oz maint dose - the tick immediately started to improve again. I no longer run maint doses in GC. To be clear, my tick is just a little uneven noise in the engine character, not a clacking bouncing off of other cars. It's light - kind of like a stock E46 M3 sounds when everything is perfectly normal.
Vehicle #2: 2002 BMW 540
This is my father's and was running BMW 5W30 oil from the dealer at half the OLM interval - so around 10,000km OCI. Despite using "good" oil, changed more often than necessary, it had knocking, lifter clatter, traditional Castrol red buildup etc... Again we embarked on this exercise with the "old" instructions which were lighter duty.
During the process he did not describe any changes in power or fuel economy, but all the noises nearly stopped completely in short order. His knocking appears to be a now-known VANOS issue with the M62TU engine but even it was reduced. We started using GC after he was done ARX and it has remained improved.
Just to see if we could have any effect on the remaining VANOS knock, we're now running two bottles in HDEO and are at the 5000km mark - significantly more aggressive than the old instructions. We're about to start a rinse phase again with HDEO and see how things go.
So the product has worked for us, even when we used oil which should never had a problem (my lifter tick developed running Mobil 1, and my dad's running BMW syn). I do have some problems with Frank's style, and insistent defense of his product "doing everything right" even given some evidence about poor mixing with GC for instance. Be that as it may, I think the product has merit. It won't do something for everyone, and it won't clean dirt that isn't there.
Originally Posted By: Ross
Trav. if your going to burn it, I will buy it from you.
Put me on that list too.
Trav. if your going to burn it, I will buy it from you.
Put me on that list too.
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: chevrofreak
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
I don't see Trav as having an agenda, he tried the product it didn't work.
It didn't work for what he wanted it to work for. That doesn't mean it didn't do anything at all.
That could be true, but then both of us are speculating. Maybe he can elaborate more. We can put it another way, and say based on reading his comments he wasn't happy with the product. Others have been happy so we can call it mixed results? Some love it, some hate it. Same goes for lots of other products, only this one has some strange way of really firing up a lot of members here. JMO
Okay I will elaborate. My brother and I bought a lot of ARX, in my family alone we have over 20 cars ranging from a very old 59 Eldorado to 2 LS7 powered cars, I also keep 3 vehicles in Germany along with my son and daughters cars.
We bought this product based on the stellar reports here and Aarons top engine pictures.
Some of the issues we wanted to clear up were…
2002 GMC Yukon Denali valve lifter tick (constant single lifter noise)
2006 Infiniti M35x varnish build up under the valve covers
2005 Honda Odyssey varnish issues
2005 Toyota Corolla (euro) VVT actuators sticking
2000 Chevrolet Venture 3.4 rear seal weeping
2000 Ford F150 5.4 sticking cam chain tensioner and valve lash noise
1999 Ford 5.4 valve lash noise (single adjuster at start up)
2000 Ford Ranger low compression and dirty internals
2000 Toyota Solara 3.0 varnish and sludge issues
1995 Toyota heavy varnish
ARX did nothing for any one of these vehicles, most had 2 bottles for 5k
With a 5k so called rinse.
Kreen cleaned both of the U.S. Toyota cars within 1k. The GMC lifter was freed with 2 min of adding the product. The Ford 5.4 trucks have seen remarkable improvement in the less than 1k miles the product has been in the engine.
The Venture rear seal leak stopped with 3k with MMO.
The Ranger compression was improved instantly with BG 109 pre OC.
The other cars and the cars in Germany will be done next month when I go back for the summer.
Another interesting thing with ARX was when I tried it in my AWD Expedition transfer case (no issues just wanted to clean it before OCI) I added the amount specified by Frank and ran it, one night it went well below zero and the electric shift motor would not engage, when I asked about ARX possibly freezing in the case I was told that cant happen and there is probably some damage to the unit.
I warmed it in the garage overnight and changed the oil, it has been working perfectly for the last 2 years.
ARX is expensive and did nothing it promised, far less expensive products worked where ARX failed. What I didn’t like was the reaction of some members of this board and the owner of ARX when someone complains. Frank has a lot of followers and even moderators on his board that will react at a seconds notice in his defense.
When any other product does not live up to its claims it is promptly labeled as “snake oil”
When anyone applies this label is to ARX all kinds of vicious back biting and personal attacks occur.
It’s apparent to me anyway that even though Frank no longer sponsors he has managed to perpetuate his attacks from afar.
As far as my agenda being to discredit ARX it isn’t. The product does that based on its own merits.
Originally Posted By: chevrofreak
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
I don't see Trav as having an agenda, he tried the product it didn't work.
It didn't work for what he wanted it to work for. That doesn't mean it didn't do anything at all.
That could be true, but then both of us are speculating. Maybe he can elaborate more. We can put it another way, and say based on reading his comments he wasn't happy with the product. Others have been happy so we can call it mixed results? Some love it, some hate it. Same goes for lots of other products, only this one has some strange way of really firing up a lot of members here. JMO
Okay I will elaborate. My brother and I bought a lot of ARX, in my family alone we have over 20 cars ranging from a very old 59 Eldorado to 2 LS7 powered cars, I also keep 3 vehicles in Germany along with my son and daughters cars.
We bought this product based on the stellar reports here and Aarons top engine pictures.
Some of the issues we wanted to clear up were…
2002 GMC Yukon Denali valve lifter tick (constant single lifter noise)
2006 Infiniti M35x varnish build up under the valve covers
2005 Honda Odyssey varnish issues
2005 Toyota Corolla (euro) VVT actuators sticking
2000 Chevrolet Venture 3.4 rear seal weeping
2000 Ford F150 5.4 sticking cam chain tensioner and valve lash noise
1999 Ford 5.4 valve lash noise (single adjuster at start up)
2000 Ford Ranger low compression and dirty internals
2000 Toyota Solara 3.0 varnish and sludge issues
1995 Toyota heavy varnish
ARX did nothing for any one of these vehicles, most had 2 bottles for 5k
With a 5k so called rinse.
Kreen cleaned both of the U.S. Toyota cars within 1k. The GMC lifter was freed with 2 min of adding the product. The Ford 5.4 trucks have seen remarkable improvement in the less than 1k miles the product has been in the engine.
The Venture rear seal leak stopped with 3k with MMO.
The Ranger compression was improved instantly with BG 109 pre OC.
The other cars and the cars in Germany will be done next month when I go back for the summer.
Another interesting thing with ARX was when I tried it in my AWD Expedition transfer case (no issues just wanted to clean it before OCI) I added the amount specified by Frank and ran it, one night it went well below zero and the electric shift motor would not engage, when I asked about ARX possibly freezing in the case I was told that cant happen and there is probably some damage to the unit.
I warmed it in the garage overnight and changed the oil, it has been working perfectly for the last 2 years.
ARX is expensive and did nothing it promised, far less expensive products worked where ARX failed. What I didn’t like was the reaction of some members of this board and the owner of ARX when someone complains. Frank has a lot of followers and even moderators on his board that will react at a seconds notice in his defense.
When any other product does not live up to its claims it is promptly labeled as “snake oil”
When anyone applies this label is to ARX all kinds of vicious back biting and personal attacks occur.
It’s apparent to me anyway that even though Frank no longer sponsors he has managed to perpetuate his attacks from afar.
As far as my agenda being to discredit ARX it isn’t. The product does that based on its own merits.
Wow a 10 vehicle test from 1 customer! I'd say that is a fair test, thanks for answering my question.
Originally Posted By: Trav
Another interesting thing with ARX was when I tried it in my AWD Expedition transfer case (no issues just wanted to clean it before OCI) I added the amount specified by Frank and ran it, one night it went well below zero and the electric shift motor would not engage, when I asked about ARX possibly freezing in the case I was told that cant happen and there is probably some damage to the unit.
Trave, you may recall some people reporting waxy feling crystals in ARx and not being able to pour all of it out of the bottle. Frank said to heat the ARx to get rid of the crysals. Sounds like something that could hang up an electric shifter in sub zero weather to me.
Another interesting thing with ARX was when I tried it in my AWD Expedition transfer case (no issues just wanted to clean it before OCI) I added the amount specified by Frank and ran it, one night it went well below zero and the electric shift motor would not engage, when I asked about ARX possibly freezing in the case I was told that cant happen and there is probably some damage to the unit.
Trave, you may recall some people reporting waxy feling crystals in ARx and not being able to pour all of it out of the bottle. Frank said to heat the ARx to get rid of the crysals. Sounds like something that could hang up an electric shifter in sub zero weather to me.
Will those crystals form again when the product cools down again? A an electronic transfer case is pretty expensive I'd want to be sure anything I add to it is proven not to cause issues. Engines get very hot and mix things up pretty well so nothing to worry about there. JMO
Yes i do remember.I emailed Frank and asked him about this issue in the winter,i was told it mixes with the host oil and will not be a problem.But yes you are correct it apparently did freeze the shift motor,i cant see any other reason as it worked perfectly before and after it was warmed up and changed.
Originally Posted By: Trav
2002 GMC Yukon Denali valve lifter tick (constant single lifter noise)
2006 Infiniti M35x varnish build up under the valve covers
2005 Honda Odyssey varnish issues
2005 Toyota Corolla (euro) VVT actuators sticking
2000 Chevrolet Venture 3.4 rear seal weeping
2000 Ford F150 5.4 sticking cam chain tensioner and valve lash noise
1999 Ford 5.4 valve lash noise (single adjuster at start up)
2000 Ford Ranger low compression and dirty internals
2000 Toyota Solara 3.0 varnish and sludge issues
1995 Toyota heavy varnish
This is certainly an impressive list.... I'll just add one comment - a lot of what you were trying to clean up is varnish related. Even the ticking lifters could be a varnish deposit in a bad place. Even during the "can do no wrong" heyday of ARX here, it was constantly stipulated that it wasn't the tool for varnish and was not effective against varnish or staining.
It would not surprise me, since it was stated repeatedly, if ARX didn't do much for your varnish.
OK, two comments
It's also been said before that there are a lot of stronger/quicker products that will do some of what ARX claims to do. If you're dealing with a sludger, there is some danger in working too fast and this was a niche that ARX was marketed towards. (yes I'm choosing my words). 5qts of kerosene will clean up a sludge problem pretty quickly, but there may be lots of ongoing issues and possibly blocked passages.
This is not to say that I don't accept the fact that faster products may be the way to go for some things. I'm tempted to try something "faster/stronger" before my next OC to see if the lifter will straighten out. I have a bottle of Swepco 502 someone gave me and I've googled a lot of people with good results using it for lifter noise.
2002 GMC Yukon Denali valve lifter tick (constant single lifter noise)
2006 Infiniti M35x varnish build up under the valve covers
2005 Honda Odyssey varnish issues
2005 Toyota Corolla (euro) VVT actuators sticking
2000 Chevrolet Venture 3.4 rear seal weeping
2000 Ford F150 5.4 sticking cam chain tensioner and valve lash noise
1999 Ford 5.4 valve lash noise (single adjuster at start up)
2000 Ford Ranger low compression and dirty internals
2000 Toyota Solara 3.0 varnish and sludge issues
1995 Toyota heavy varnish
This is certainly an impressive list.... I'll just add one comment - a lot of what you were trying to clean up is varnish related. Even the ticking lifters could be a varnish deposit in a bad place. Even during the "can do no wrong" heyday of ARX here, it was constantly stipulated that it wasn't the tool for varnish and was not effective against varnish or staining.
It would not surprise me, since it was stated repeatedly, if ARX didn't do much for your varnish.
OK, two comments
It's also been said before that there are a lot of stronger/quicker products that will do some of what ARX claims to do. If you're dealing with a sludger, there is some danger in working too fast and this was a niche that ARX was marketed towards. (yes I'm choosing my words). 5qts of kerosene will clean up a sludge problem pretty quickly, but there may be lots of ongoing issues and possibly blocked passages.This is not to say that I don't accept the fact that faster products may be the way to go for some things. I'm tempted to try something "faster/stronger" before my next OC to see if the lifter will straighten out. I have a bottle of Swepco 502 someone gave me and I've googled a lot of people with good results using it for lifter noise.
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Quote:
Even during the "can do no wrong" heyday of ARX here, it was constantly stipulated that it wasn't the tool for varnish and was not effective against varnish or staining.
It works great for places under forced circulation. It's of variable results where the porosity of the aluminum makes it difficult to clean. I've show image after image of BRIGHT aluminum where it was obvious that the stuff had worked and where it had yet to work.
What occurred is Frank got over apologetic about someone challenging him about how it didn't work on his aluminum head and from that point on it was gospel cast in stone.
Frank stepped on himself and now everyone and their brother runs with it whenever they have opportunity.
But ..for the 19th evolution in re-education ..that will soon fade into nothingness when the next opportunity presents itself ...
I really can't believe that this many people can have this much blackness in their soul to continue to beat down on this 72 year old vendor on chemo. Some day you'll understand the concept of time ..when you have little of it ..and how it may alter the way you look at goals that you need to achieve.
Any comments? Any blindness?
When he's dead, I'll let you know so you can throw a party.
Have a nice day!
Even during the "can do no wrong" heyday of ARX here, it was constantly stipulated that it wasn't the tool for varnish and was not effective against varnish or staining.
It works great for places under forced circulation. It's of variable results where the porosity of the aluminum makes it difficult to clean. I've show image after image of BRIGHT aluminum where it was obvious that the stuff had worked and where it had yet to work.
What occurred is Frank got over apologetic about someone challenging him about how it didn't work on his aluminum head and from that point on it was gospel cast in stone.
Frank stepped on himself and now everyone and their brother runs with it whenever they have opportunity.
But ..for the 19th evolution in re-education ..that will soon fade into nothingness when the next opportunity presents itself ...
I really can't believe that this many people can have this much blackness in their soul to continue to beat down on this 72 year old vendor on chemo. Some day you'll understand the concept of time ..when you have little of it ..and how it may alter the way you look at goals that you need to achieve.
Any comments? Any blindness?
When he's dead, I'll let you know so you can throw a party.
Have a nice day!
I've had good luck with ARX but Frank's people skills have a lot to be desired. This is not a good way to market a product but is a good way to get people to attack it on a personal level.
I can fully appreciate his health problems but sending nasty e-mails to people asking for a refund that you ADVERTISE is bad business. I'd buy his product again but it's hard to recommend it with the questionable customer service record of the company.
I can fully appreciate his health problems but sending nasty e-mails to people asking for a refund that you ADVERTISE is bad business. I'd buy his product again but it's hard to recommend it with the questionable customer service record of the company.
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