Inaccurate Lumen Ratings On LED Light Bulbs

[billt460]

This is getting as bad as a lot of the lumen ratings on Amazon LED Flashlights. I have a few high lumen LED bulbs outside on a dusk till dawn photocell. On one of my carriage lights in between the garage doors, I had a 3010 lumen rated LED bulb. (It's the one shown in the top link).

I replaced it with what is supposed to be a 6000 lumen "corn cob" LED bulb. (The one shown in the lower link). There is no way the new bulb is twice as bright. (3010 vs. 6000). They are both the same Kelvin rating, ("Daylight" not that yellowy "Soft White").

This is blatant false advertising. I honestly can't tell if it's any brighter at all. Then they keep trying to rate them using these silly "watts equivalent" ratings, that's supposed to compare the LED brightness, to that of a larger wattage incandescent light that isn't even being sold any longer.

It reminds me of that silly "Drams Equivalent" they rate shotgun shell power by. Comparing them to the equivalent of black powder from back in the 19th century, black powder era. That no one remotely cares about, or understands for that matter.

All of this seems to be getting worse as time passes. I love LED bulbs, but they really need to get their act together on how they rate these things in regard to brightness. Now they're all over the map.... Either by accident, or on purpose to boost sales... OK, rant over.

https://www.lowes.com/pd/GE-Ultra-B...QCVwqDsGL0FsGCK1kzsRADobHXcwwZ1BoC9QgQAvD_BwE

Amazon.com

 

[wings&wheels]

One word: Amazon The Wild West of retail.

That said, outside of the big box stores, I have had good luck w/ Superbright LED's, but yes, complete agreement on brightness ratings.

 

[vpr5703]

Check out The Torque Test Channel on YouTube - They've done lumen tests on flashlights before. Some of them do meet and exceed their ratings. But not many

 

[wag123]

This is getting as bad as a lot of the lumen ratings on Amazon LED Flashlights. I have a few high lumen LED bulbs outside on a dusk till dawn photocell. On one of my carriage lights in between the garage doors, I had a 3010 lumen rated LED bulb. (It's the one shown in the top link).

I replaced it with what is supposed to be a 6000 lumen "corn cob" LED bulb. (The one shown in the lower link). There is no way the new bulb is twice as bright. (3010 vs. 6000). They are both the same Kelvin rating, ("Daylight" not that yellowy "Soft White").

This is blatant false advertising. I honestly can't tell if it's any brighter at all. Then they keep trying to rate them using these silly "watts equivalent" ratings, that's supposed to compare the LED brightness, to that of a larger wattage incandescent light that isn't even being sold any longer.

It reminds me of that silly "Drams Equivalent" they rate shotgun shell power by. Comparing them to the equivalent of black powder from back in the 19th century, black powder era. That no one remotely cares about, or understands for that matter.

All of this seems to be getting worse as time passes. I love LED bulbs, but they really need to get their act together on how they rate these things in regard to brightness. Now they're all over the map.... Either by accident, or on purpose to boost sales... OK, rant over.

https://www.lowes.com/pd/GE-Ultra-B...QCVwqDsGL0FsGCK1kzsRADobHXcwwZ1BoC9QgQAvD_BwE

Amazon.com

It is the "Wild West" when it comes to advertising specifications on anything coming from China. They wildly inflate MANY product's specifications such as... lumens, amplifier output, generator output, compressor output, horsepower, torque, battery MAH, run time, etc, etc. They can get away with doing this because China does not have an equivalent to our FTC who stops this sort of thing from happening here.

 

[walterjay]

Doubling the lumens of a light does not equate a doubling of perceived brightness. As lumens increase the "just noticeable difference" decreases.

 

[tmorris1]

This is getting as bad as a lot of the lumen ratings on Amazon LED Flashlights. I have a few high lumen LED bulbs outside on a dusk till dawn photocell. On one of my carriage lights in between the garage doors, I had a 3010 lumen rated LED bulb. (It's the one shown in the top link).

I replaced it with what is supposed to be a 6000 lumen "corn cob" LED bulb. (The one shown in the lower link). There is no way the new bulb is twice as bright. (3010 vs. 6000). They are both the same Kelvin rating, ("Daylight" not that yellowy "Soft White").

This is blatant false advertising. I honestly can't tell if it's any brighter at all. Then they keep trying to rate them using these silly "watts equivalent" ratings, that's supposed to compare the LED brightness, to that of a larger wattage incandescent light that isn't even being sold any longer.

It reminds me of that silly "Drams Equivalent" they rate shotgun shell power by. Comparing them to the equivalent of black powder from back in the 19th century, black powder era. That no one remotely cares about, or understands for that matter.

All of this seems to be getting worse as time passes. I love LED bulbs, but they really need to get their act together on how they rate these things in regard to brightness. Now they're all over the map.... Either by accident, or on purpose to boost sales... OK, rant over.

https://www.lowes.com/pd/GE-Ultra-B...QCVwqDsGL0FsGCK1kzsRADobHXcwwZ1BoC9QgQAvD_BwE

Amazon.com

Shocker that you can't trust the information from a Chinese company! Most cheap Chinese products are junk.

 

[pbm]

It is the "Wild West" when it comes to advertising specifications on anything coming from China. They wildly inflate MANY product's specifications such as... lumens, amplifier output, generator output, compressor output, horsepower, torque, battery MAH, run time, etc, etc. They can get away with doing this because China does not have an equivalent to our FTC who stops this sort of thing from happening here.

I would have thought that our 'FTC' could fine the maker of a product that willfully lies about it's product if it's sold in the USA regardless of COO?

 

[billt460]

I would have thought that our 'FTC' could fine the maker of a product that willfully lies about it's product if it's sold in the USA regardless of COO?

That along with testing. Much like UL does. How hard can it be to test the brightness of a light bulb? If it doesn't live up to the standard advertised, don't allow it to be sold here.

 

[Hermann]

Having bought 6 mini LED flashlight from the Zon I have been impressed. 4 are the same, just different colors. Figured all 4 might be trash in a year. Still on the first one. The switches are unbelievably smooth and durable for a $3 flashlight. Used daily twice or thrice. They are the 9 led's in a circle type. Bright and easy on batteries. I also have two mini LED blacklights. Got those free from eating out rewards card. Grand total for all these was $11.99. I am glad battery prices are starting to come down on the Zon.

 

[vpr5703]

That along with testing. Much like UL does. How hard can it be to test the brightness of a light bulb? If it doesn't live up to the standard advertised, don't allow it to be sold here.

The question isn't about how hard it is to test. It's about how much product there is to test vs how much man-hours are available. If the FTC tested every product for claims, it would take eons and basically we wouldn't ever see anything on the market. Just look at how many different flashlights are available on Amazon alone. Sure, most are copies of each other, but how do you determine that if they're named differently?

This issue is hard to fix

 

[Rmay635703]

I would have thought that our 'FTC' could fine the maker of a product that willfully lies about it's product if it's sold in the USA regardless of COO?

Walmarts “hi lumen” bulbs although a godsend since they fit normal lamps are cheap and very much decieving.

Anything that says 150, 200 or 300 watts is brighter than a “100watt” led equivalent

But comparing these bulbs to each other or the real deal is a lesson in futility, the lumens count is many times random as well with the 200 bulb being dimmer than the 150.

I’ve resorted to “dehousing” and even modifying the high watt bulbs to put in my fixtures to get the max brightness with it aimed where I want the light, without modifying they many times don’t fit or are blasting a bright white spot on the ceiling instead of down where I need the light

 

[KGMtech]

The rated lifespan of any LED bulb is, IMHO, just as much BS as the rest of the marketing.

 

[billt460]

The rated lifespan of any LED bulb is, IMHO, just as much BS as the rest of the marketing.

It's based on some bs number of hours per day. Not total hours. Everything involving these things amounts to a meaningless, unprovable, crap shoot.

 

[wag123]

I would have thought that our 'FTC' could fine the maker of a product that willfully lies about it's product if it's sold in the USA regardless of COO?

That would be nice if it happened, and if the FTC could actually enforce the violation, which they can't. Who is going to call a violation out to the FTC and who is going to test/verify that the violation is valid? Who would collect the fine? Nobody in the Chinese government will. If they banned the import/sale of a product, how could it be enforced? How about all of the counterfeit/knock-off auto parts (and other goods) that they are importing and selling here? The FTC does not have a bottomless pit of employees to police these violators. The Chinese companies simply do these things with impunity.
For example, there must be at least 50000 Chinese products sold on Amazon that are in blatant violation of FTC regulations. The safety valve on Amazon is that you can send the product back, but then, how would most people even know that the 400 watt audio amplifier they purchased is only putting out 30 watts, or the 1 million candlepower flashlight that they purchased is only producing 80 candlepower?

 

[John105]

Doubling the lumens of a light does not equate a doubling of perceived brightness. As lumens increase the "just noticeable difference" decreases.

Kinda like many things. Doubling amplifier power, increases volume 3 db…but I agree LED is the Wild West, sorta like tires. Tires have had UTQG standards for 4+ decades and like EPA ratings self reported, ie meaningless. LED has no standards…

 

[vpr5703]

That would be nice if it happened, and if the FTC could actually enforce the violation, which they can't. Who is going to call a violation out to the FTC and who is going to test/verify that the violation is valid? Who would collect the fine? Nobody in the Chinese government will. If they banned the import/sale of a product, how could it be enforced? How about all of the counterfeit/knock-off auto parts (and other goods) that they are importing and selling here? The FTC does not have a bottomless pit of employees to police these violators. The Chinese companies simply do these things with impunity.
For example, there must be at least 50000 Chinese products sold on Amazon that are in blatant violation of FTC regulations. The safety valve on Amazon is that you can send the product back, but then, how would most people even know that the 400 watt audio amplifier they purchased is only putting out 30 watts, or the 1 million candlepower flashlight that they purchased is only producing 80 candlepower?

There have been several instances (and likely still *are* instances) of sellers on Amazon offering laser pointers that blatantly go *FAR* above FDA limits but do not have safeguards as designated by the FDA. To the point of being a legitimate hazard to personal safety, not to mention a fire hazard.

 

[John105]

It's based on some bs number of hours per day. Not total hours. Everything involving these things amounts to a meaningless, unprovable, crap shoot.

I’ve had led bulbs fail in less than a year. Even if on 24 hours a day it’s nowhere near what’s claimed.

 

[wag123]

There have been several instances (and likely still *are* instances) of sellers on Amazon offering laser pointers that blatantly go *FAR* above FDA limits but do not have safeguards as designated by the FDA. To the point of being a legitimate hazard to personal safety, not to mention a fire hazard.

Then there is the distinct possibility (high probability) that the output that they are claiming to produce is not anywhere near the output that they are actually producing.

 

[vpr5703]

Then there is the distinct possibility (high probability) that the output that they are claiming to produce is not anywhere near the output that they are actually producing.

the same YT channel I recommended earlier did a test on some laser pointers purchased from Amazon, and one of them was outputting 1 or 2 *WATTS* IIRC. FDA limits for a visible beam laser pointer is 5mw. It was enough to burn paper and really cause problems if you accidentally looked into the aperture.

 

[John105]

Was just thinking of this, quality is still important. My 2006 car as far as I know has original incandescent bulbs. At least under my ownership since 2016, only the high mount 7440 got replaced by me. It would be a major job replacing front turn and parking lamps. I’d probably replace the xenon headlamps at the same time which are likely original, going on 19 years old.

Led bulbs are no longer expensive but they were a while back and I’ve had a bunch fail as I remember feeling ripped off….