ok, to say that we have more problems with the cooling system now, vs. then, is just hearsay, or skewed perception, imho. back in the 80's all those cars had plenty of problems. water pumps, cores, hoses,etc were commonplace repairs. communication was nil to most, and all the cores were much more stout, providing longer life during abusive/neglected conditions.....but they would still rot away at the same rate, none-the-less. now, as for it being the 96-98, well it's not confined to that either......go all the way back to 91, where the plastic gaskets were introduced...same exact problem (other than sludge) expired coolant eats them, period. these are the isuzu-gm collaborated motors. before then, was more gm, and 99-00 phased to 100% isuzu engines....plain and simple manufacturing, not just coolant problems. you know, i kinda laughed at that aluminum comment.......yes, dex-cool responds to oxygen, that's not news, but it doesn't eat the aluminum until it has been run out of life.......so will conventional. you see, aluminum also responds to oxygen. raw aluminum exposed to air will rapidly oxidize, though you can't visually see it until it builds up. what you are seeing is the coolant washing the oxidation away, much like water-wetter, and bonding with the surface for better heat transfer.
In the old days: No antifreeze problems.
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I've replaced my share of water pumps in the past using the old "GREEN" coolant when that all there was. Who knew better! I remember when a water pump was only good for about 100K. And the only head gaskets/intake manifold gaskets that I had to replace were on engines that were known for these issues reguardless of the coolant used.
Today with so much talk about using the correct coolant in your engine's system, it almost make you wonder if it all [censored]! I've used anything antifreeze in for example, a Honda's and never an issue in several hundred thousand miles. And we as a family have used the correct coolant in several GM/FORD/Mopar and nothing but problems. I know that Subaru and Toyota had some issues although I haven't had coolant issues with their vehicles.
I'm sure that every car company has their gasket issues once in a while. If it's going to happen, it's going to happen! I just wish the MFG's would just put in good gaskets.
Today with so much talk about using the correct coolant in your engine's system, it almost make you wonder if it all [censored]! I've used anything antifreeze in for example, a Honda's and never an issue in several hundred thousand miles. And we as a family have used the correct coolant in several GM/FORD/Mopar and nothing but problems. I know that Subaru and Toyota had some issues although I haven't had coolant issues with their vehicles.
I'm sure that every car company has their gasket issues once in a while. If it's going to happen, it's going to happen! I just wish the MFG's would just put in good gaskets.
+1, I agree. Dexcool's only main issue is the cooling system needs to remain full. But all cooling systems should be kept full anyway. Dexcool's OAT inhibitors do give great aluminum (and iron and steel as well) protection and the no borate and nitrite and lower pH also helps here. The inhibitors last quite abit longer than IAT silicate/phosphate formula of original green, especially the current low silicate formula.
Green was really optimized for all iron engines and copper radiators. Even then it is still considered a 2y/30k mile formula. Sure you can push that limit some but the protection is decreased. Even in HDs with iron engines supplements are added every 2 y/30k miles.
Now, OATs incuding Dexcool can be more aggressive with some gasket polymers, but these plastic gasket are just a poor choice even for original green. The gasket durability issue has been addressed on most models later than about '05.
Ford did the right thing to finally move over to Dexcool since it is so common now. The Asian and European (Euros have somewhat embraced Dexcool) makers should dexcool "proof" their cooling systems (pressurized surge tank, resistant gaskets, etc) and allow its use. Instead it seems they want to market their propietary products like they do ATF. Lets face it, all manufactures are using either an OAT or HOAT coolant now so there's little good reason to not validate them for Dexcool. Most of the time you can replace a late model's OAT/HOAT with Dexcool/Peak Global OAT.
Green was really optimized for all iron engines and copper radiators. Even then it is still considered a 2y/30k mile formula. Sure you can push that limit some but the protection is decreased. Even in HDs with iron engines supplements are added every 2 y/30k miles.
Now, OATs incuding Dexcool can be more aggressive with some gasket polymers, but these plastic gasket are just a poor choice even for original green. The gasket durability issue has been addressed on most models later than about '05.
Ford did the right thing to finally move over to Dexcool since it is so common now. The Asian and European (Euros have somewhat embraced Dexcool) makers should dexcool "proof" their cooling systems (pressurized surge tank, resistant gaskets, etc) and allow its use. Instead it seems they want to market their propietary products like they do ATF. Lets face it, all manufactures are using either an OAT or HOAT coolant now so there's little good reason to not validate them for Dexcool. Most of the time you can replace a late model's OAT/HOAT with Dexcool/Peak Global OAT.
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Originally Posted By: electrolover
idk the prestone is green and says its good for 100k, i change at 50k. and like i said ive never had a problem with 70% prestone.
point being GREEN still works great!! so why not ditch the other more expensive stuff?
its not green its a almost yellow color, and it is the same as dexcool, dont try to argue this. Only real green out there is Chevron Green and Zerex green.
idk the prestone is green and says its good for 100k, i change at 50k. and like i said ive never had a problem with 70% prestone.
point being GREEN still works great!! so why not ditch the other more expensive stuff?
its not green its a almost yellow color, and it is the same as dexcool, dont try to argue this. Only real green out there is Chevron Green and Zerex green.
Originally Posted By: defektes
Originally Posted By: electrolover
idk the prestone is green and says its good for 100k, i change at 50k. and like i said ive never had a problem with 70% prestone.
point being GREEN still works great!! so why not ditch the other more expensive stuff?
its not green its a almost yellow color, and it is the same as dexcool, dont try to argue this. Only real green out there is Chevron Green and Zerex green.
So, is this to say that PEAK Long Life(not GLOBAL) full strength or 50/50(mix with any make/model/color) is OK to use in most vehicles cooling systems? PEAK claims on their website that it is Phos/Sil FREE.
Originally Posted By: electrolover
idk the prestone is green and says its good for 100k, i change at 50k. and like i said ive never had a problem with 70% prestone.
point being GREEN still works great!! so why not ditch the other more expensive stuff?
its not green its a almost yellow color, and it is the same as dexcool, dont try to argue this. Only real green out there is Chevron Green and Zerex green.
So, is this to say that PEAK Long Life(not GLOBAL) full strength or 50/50(mix with any make/model/color) is OK to use in most vehicles cooling systems? PEAK claims on their website that it is Phos/Sil FREE.
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Peak Long Life is another Dex-Cool clone. Read the back of the bottle. It has 2-EHA listed.
Old school/traditional green 'freeze was great as long as it was replaced every two yrs. Back in the 80's I saw the end result of old school green when it was left in service to long. It would literally turn into brown water with actual chunks of rust in it (Asian and American cars).
Whether you peruse these forums and/or maintain cars you'll quickly find that today's modern coolants last way longer and that in turn extends the life of the entire cooling system.
Whether you peruse these forums and/or maintain cars you'll quickly find that today's modern coolants last way longer and that in turn extends the life of the entire cooling system.
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Kestas
Staff member
I find the title misleading. We didn't hang on to cars as long as we do now. For decades, I've always had problems with the cooling system when cars got to the 10-15 year mark. If anything, I think cars today are more resistant to problems with the cooling system.
I see a lot of sympathy for the plethora of coolant choices we have today. Maybe the green isn't as good as what we have today, but it worked and worked very well for the maintenance minded person who could muster a few minutes every 30k to drain and fill.
Now, to change the coolant (although more rare now with 150k intervals) you just have to look in the manual to find out what you have then go on a pilgrimage to find what you are looking for. If you take it to a garage you now have to worry if they do it right, or if you don't know any better, you might have unforeseen troubles if they use the wrong stuff.
I'm not too sure what happened, but at my old job a co-worker went to a quickie lube and they changed the coolant. Soon after he was getting a water pump replaced because it didn't agree with what they put in.
Better or not, it needs to be universal like it used to be. Just grab a jug and go, no research involved. Don't look now, but they're doing this to use with oil and all the required ratings to use certain oils. Its been done with Power steering and transmissions. At least we still have good ole universal brake fluid and washer fluid left.
Now, to change the coolant (although more rare now with 150k intervals) you just have to look in the manual to find out what you have then go on a pilgrimage to find what you are looking for. If you take it to a garage you now have to worry if they do it right, or if you don't know any better, you might have unforeseen troubles if they use the wrong stuff.
I'm not too sure what happened, but at my old job a co-worker went to a quickie lube and they changed the coolant. Soon after he was getting a water pump replaced because it didn't agree with what they put in.
Better or not, it needs to be universal like it used to be. Just grab a jug and go, no research involved. Don't look now, but they're doing this to use with oil and all the required ratings to use certain oils. Its been done with Power steering and transmissions. At least we still have good ole universal brake fluid and washer fluid left.
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Originally Posted By: Ursae_Majoris
Peak Long Life is another Dex-Cool clone. Read the back of the bottle. It has 2-EHA listed.
then why would they bother making peak global? it really is dex-cool. just so i have it right all universal coolants are dex-cool whether they are yellow or green makes no difference?
i dont think just because they have a common ingredient makes them the same. they all have water...so what does that mean?
Peak Long Life is another Dex-Cool clone. Read the back of the bottle. It has 2-EHA listed.
then why would they bother making peak global? it really is dex-cool. just so i have it right all universal coolants are dex-cool whether they are yellow or green makes no difference?
i dont think just because they have a common ingredient makes them the same. they all have water...so what does that mean?
Originally Posted By: electrolover
Originally Posted By: Ursae_Majoris
Peak Long Life is another Dex-Cool clone. Read the back of the bottle. It has 2-EHA listed.
then why would they bother making peak global? it really is dex-cool. just so i have it right all universal coolants are dex-cool whether they are yellow or green makes no difference?
i dont think just because they have a common ingredient makes them the same. they all have water...so what does that mean?
Peak Global is a universal OAT coolant but not a dexclone. It is a benzoate inhibitor coolant. It does not contain 2-EHA the hallmark of Dexcool. They probably marketed it for a lot of the problems Dexcool rightly or wrongly was blamed for. 2-EHA was blamed for sludging and being aggressive with some gaskets. I'd say that any OAT could be more aggressive with some gasket material not just 2EHA. It's main shortcoming is that it is not tolerant of air in the system and the cooling system needs to remain completely full at all times. Although Ford has said Dexcool did effect gaskets on some of its engines during testing and Honda has said not to use Dexcool in their vehicles.
All these antifreezes would be the same, they are ethylene glycol based but it is the inhibitors that makes the difference. The color that they are dyed does not mean much.
There is 3 general classes of antifreeze IAT, OAT and HOAT. Green is an IAT and has fast acting inhibitors and a shorter life. OAT has slower acting inhibitors but can give very good corrosion protection and a longer life, etc.
Originally Posted By: Ursae_Majoris
Peak Long Life is another Dex-Cool clone. Read the back of the bottle. It has 2-EHA listed.
then why would they bother making peak global? it really is dex-cool. just so i have it right all universal coolants are dex-cool whether they are yellow or green makes no difference?
i dont think just because they have a common ingredient makes them the same. they all have water...so what does that mean?
Peak Global is a universal OAT coolant but not a dexclone. It is a benzoate inhibitor coolant. It does not contain 2-EHA the hallmark of Dexcool. They probably marketed it for a lot of the problems Dexcool rightly or wrongly was blamed for. 2-EHA was blamed for sludging and being aggressive with some gaskets. I'd say that any OAT could be more aggressive with some gasket material not just 2EHA. It's main shortcoming is that it is not tolerant of air in the system and the cooling system needs to remain completely full at all times. Although Ford has said Dexcool did effect gaskets on some of its engines during testing and Honda has said not to use Dexcool in their vehicles.
All these antifreezes would be the same, they are ethylene glycol based but it is the inhibitors that makes the difference. The color that they are dyed does not mean much.
There is 3 general classes of antifreeze IAT, OAT and HOAT. Green is an IAT and has fast acting inhibitors and a shorter life. OAT has slower acting inhibitors but can give very good corrosion protection and a longer life, etc.
peak global is orange and dex-cool approved. why would it not be dex-cool.
peak long life is universal and yellow. why would you call it a dex-cool
i would think if a coolant says universal mix with anything
it would have similarities with alot of coolants
or am i just retarded? i would think orange would go with orange and so on
peak long life is universal and yellow. why would you call it a dex-cool
i would think if a coolant says universal mix with anything
it would have similarities with alot of coolants
or am i just retarded? i would think orange would go with orange and so on
Originally Posted By: electrolover
peak global is orange and dex-cool approved. why would it not be dex-cool.
peak long life is universal and yellow. why would you call it a dex-cool
i would think if a coolant says universal mix with anything
it would have similarities with alot of coolants
or am i just retarded? i would think orange would go with orange and so on
Peak Global is not Dexcool approved or licensed. It only says recommended for use where Dexcool is required. Color does not mean anything, I explained that. It's the inhibitor package that matters. Universal coolants is a claim by anti-freeze manufactures. All it means is that the coolants will not have a chemical reaction when mixed. it's not real quarantee of performance.
peak global is orange and dex-cool approved. why would it not be dex-cool.
peak long life is universal and yellow. why would you call it a dex-cool
i would think if a coolant says universal mix with anything
it would have similarities with alot of coolants
or am i just retarded? i would think orange would go with orange and so on
Peak Global is not Dexcool approved or licensed. It only says recommended for use where Dexcool is required. Color does not mean anything, I explained that. It's the inhibitor package that matters. Universal coolants is a claim by anti-freeze manufactures. All it means is that the coolants will not have a chemical reaction when mixed. it's not real quarantee of performance.
not every one is a scientist or chemist
whats the difference whats its made of?
if it says all makes it all makes
if it says its dex-cool its dex-cool
match the color or flush it all out imo
but i have seen alot of cars get peak or maxlife added to them for top off with out any problems.
there is no since in playing junior chemist
all i need to know is green to green yellow to yellow and orange to orange. like most of the world
whats the difference whats its made of?
if it says all makes it all makes
if it says its dex-cool its dex-cool
match the color or flush it all out imo
but i have seen alot of cars get peak or maxlife added to them for top off with out any problems.
there is no since in playing junior chemist
all i need to know is green to green yellow to yellow and orange to orange. like most of the world
Well what ever makes you happy. If you already have all the answers then why seem like you are asking questions? A person gives the information and you dismiss it like it offends you. You don't want to consider some of the shortcomings of using dexclone in everything maybe because you haven't seen any problems, but others have. I could've just told you, and someone else did, what the auto manufacturers recommend and it isn't to just "match orange with orange etc or to use All Makes. You can put All makes in a early model Ford or whatever else and believe it is the same, or Peak Global in a GM and believe it is the same as Dexcool if you want.
yea dude im really upset because if what you say is right ive been putting dex-cool in my fords and im not ok with that.
so im goin to believe its wrong until it comes time to flush and fill(2 years) then ill get some motorcraft gold and put back in it
but until then prestone is not dex-cool ok
so im goin to believe its wrong until it comes time to flush and fill(2 years) then ill get some motorcraft gold and put back in it
but until then prestone is not dex-cool ok
You can lead horse (electrolover) to water....
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
Originally Posted By: electrolover
Originally Posted By: Ursae_Majoris
Peak Long Life is another Dex-Cool clone. Read the back of the bottle. It has 2-EHA listed.
then why would they bother making peak global? it really is dex-cool. just so i have it right all universal coolants are dex-cool whether they are yellow or green makes no difference?
i dont think just because they have a common ingredient makes them the same. they all have water...so what does that mean?
Peak Global is a universal OAT coolant but not a dexclone. It is a benzoate inhibitor coolant. It does not contain 2-EHA the hallmark of Dexcool.
I was wrong, Peak does not list the ingredients on the bottle. MSDS does say that LL is silicate and phosphate free, so it is a pure OAT, akin to Dexcool.
General consensus on BITOG was that Peak LL had 2-EHA, unlike their Global formula.
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=815073&fpart=1
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1373636&fpart=2
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1536992&page=2
Old World industries is very secretive about their formulations. How did you find out it was benzoate and not 2-EHA in Peak LL?
Originally Posted By: electrolover
Originally Posted By: Ursae_Majoris
Peak Long Life is another Dex-Cool clone. Read the back of the bottle. It has 2-EHA listed.
then why would they bother making peak global? it really is dex-cool. just so i have it right all universal coolants are dex-cool whether they are yellow or green makes no difference?
i dont think just because they have a common ingredient makes them the same. they all have water...so what does that mean?
Peak Global is a universal OAT coolant but not a dexclone. It is a benzoate inhibitor coolant. It does not contain 2-EHA the hallmark of Dexcool.
I was wrong, Peak does not list the ingredients on the bottle. MSDS does say that LL is silicate and phosphate free, so it is a pure OAT, akin to Dexcool.
General consensus on BITOG was that Peak LL had 2-EHA, unlike their Global formula.
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=815073&fpart=1
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1373636&fpart=2
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1536992&page=2
Old World industries is very secretive about their formulations. How did you find out it was benzoate and not 2-EHA in Peak LL?
Originally Posted By: j_mac
but lets stay on topic
...in the old days we just had green antifreeze, and no problems.
You could leave that stuff in there for years, perhaps never change it and not have any issues.
I have been driving for 50 years and your statement is flawed to the extreme.
but lets stay on topic
...in the old days we just had green antifreeze, and no problems.
You could leave that stuff in there for years, perhaps never change it and not have any issues.
I have been driving for 50 years and your statement is flawed to the extreme.
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