I have an Auto-Rx Question.

[JohnBrowning]

I have 1500 miles on my conventional oil and started the second Auto-RX treatment. I noticed that about 11 miles after I added the Auto-RX the engine was alot quiter. This seems strange to me because it could not have cleaned anything that quickly!Is the EP additive you add to this the key to this? Is the Ep additive ester based? I also noticed that the transmission seemed to shift better with Auto-Rx in it. I am beginning to think that my engine and trans likes ester based EP additives if this is what you use in with the natural reacted fatty acids. I only ask because I am trying to decide if I am going to purchase some Redline for the car. On a positive note while I never noticed anything in the filters on the first run with Auto-RX in the car I have noticed that the oil for the second treatment looks the same as when I put it in! It is still almost clear like light honey or Miller beer.

[ June 13, 2003, 07:51 AM: Message edited by: BOBISTHEOILGUY ]

 

[Terry]

John, I can't speak to the composition of Auto-RX as I am under secrecy due to testing it.

I can say that it uses nothing but biodegradeable ester technology. No nitrogen,chlorine,no phos,no boron,or sulfur etc.
Lubricity of host oil is enhanced while cleaning is taking place, something I have never see in a fully formulated oil.

What kind of car to use the Redline ? Redline is an exceptional oil. Of course any oil will perform better and be stressed less if the engine is internally clean paricularily at high temp/high pressure points.

I wish I could share confidential data I interpreted by independent labs, ASTM standardized test protocals as this online group would be keen to see it. Of course those who seek to steal Franks secrets are lurking here too !

Suffice it to say I have never seen a cleaning substance that you and I could afford that has such remarkable thermally stable gravimetric capability. > 600 + F at 50% weight loss, how many solvents can perform that way ? Thats how it can clean at the critical areas through layers and not volatize like normal low flash solvents.

PS I know I'm not Frank but I like this product for its capabilites !

[ June 09, 2003, 01:04 AM: Message edited by: Terry ]

 

[JohnBrowning]

Thanks Terry! I read the pattent information but their were some areas that had multiple compounds that could be used. The pattent information pretty much spells out how to make his product for all practical purposes. I have a 1997 Buick Lasber 110,000 miles 3.8V6. I am doing my second Auto-RX treatment as we speak. I normaly would use M1 due to cost. I am thinking about useing Redline 5W40 in it. I have not used Redline in years and would like to see how it does over a 10,000 mile OCI. I drive 80-100 miles a day at HWY speeds.
Terry I have one more qustion for you. If I test my oil after second Auto-RX treatment will the oil be worthless as a basline? I do not want to waste my money on UOA if the Auto-RX is going to skew the wear metal results!

 

[Frank]

Auto-Rx is not going to skew any oil analysis results. John, I understand you read the patent; you read about a component of Auto-Rx not the finished chemistry. Terry Dyson, like myself, are bound by a secrecy agreement with Lubrizol (John, they make large percentage of additive packages for major oil companys). They have tested Auto-Rx for 2 years and they don't know the Auto-Rx formulation. Patent is an application patent not a chemical patent. Auto-Rx is a trade secret. This will be the last response to any questions regarding the patent or the Auto-Rx formulation. Glad you followed application instructions for transmission.

 

[Terry]

RX will disperse alot of the wear metals and most will be carried to the oil filter ( my liquid filter theory or Auto-RX).

Understand that RX is cleaning carbonacous deposits and not eating into metal. If mettalic particles are trapped in the deposits then RX captures them.If the engine is relatively clean then you wont see any discernable difference.

FTIR values will be changed while cleaning; higher OXD reading, lower NOx. Otherwise the the elements will be normal.

Most analysts will not be able to discern it is in the oil.

Enjoy !

 

[JohnBrowning]

Terry, I was worried about the Auto-RX scavanenging the third party abrasives wich could include normal wear meatal that have been embeded in sludge.My thoughts were that the wear metal detected could be higher then normaly because of all the wear metals that have been traped in the pores of the block and in sludge. I was not worried about Auto-RX attacking any material that belongs in the engine! THe reason I ask is because I plan on useing this as a base line to compare the extended drain Redline.

Frank I was trying to figure out why the engine is quiter with the product in. In 11 miles I could hear a difference. Today at 125 miles the engine is even less noisey. When I drain the Auto-RX out and refill the engine gets noisey again. I was hopeing to figure out what part of Auto-Rx was doing this so I could best select an oil to replicate the charteristic/property that is makeing it more quite. I am already running a 15W40 so their is not alot of room for a thicker oil viscosity short of 20W50 and single weight. It is a GM 3.8 V6.

 

[Frank]

Auto-Rx does not make your engine quieter, it is a metal cleaning non solvent cleaning compound, after your engine is cleaned oil will make it quieter providing you don't have a mechanial problem, as it is able to lubricate all rotating parts.Perhaps you have a mechanical problem just misdiagnosed ?
Your first application was not done correctly (you said you did not understand instructions )perhaps this application of Auto-Rx will work for you. Terry in the above post answered your other questions.Think you know Auto-Rx worked as represented in your transmission, logic would tell me it will do the same in your engine.

 

[JohnBrowning]

Yes Frank, when I read the old sites various application instructionsI did not understand the instruction to mean that one "HAD" to use old oil. I figured that was a consesion for lazy or cheap people that just wanted to be able to add it to their exsisting oil between oil changes. I did notice though that the patent information sites applications for automotive use in which the oil was first replaced with fresh oil and then the Auto-RX was added to the fresh crank case oil.So while my botched up application my note have been the best or most effective use of your product it was not as though it had not been used that way in testing as it is listed in the patent application. It worked well in my transmission and that had 2 gallons of fresh fluid and a filter a week before I added your product. I also left the Auto-RX in an extra 500 miles to try to correct my mistake under Terry advice. I truly think that the difference is that the engine had always been servied well prior to my Grandfather death and my Grandmother getting ill so their was not alot of deposits to be cleaned. The transmission on the other hand had never been servied(109,000 miles on factory fluid) so their was more to clean. Transmissions are much more sensitve to deposits then engines. The noise is very subtle it is not a mechanical problem. Their are all kinds of harmonics in a running engine and if you have attentive listening skill you can hear subtle difference between on fluid and another. I was mainly hopeing it would stop my oil leak at rear main seal. It did not as far as the filter being clean I am just as thankful that their was nothing in their to be cleaned as I would have been had Auto-RX filled the filter full of third party abrasives! I plan on cutting into this filter as soon as the millage is right.

 

[Frank]

If you do the second application of Auto-Rx correctly and drain it at the prescribed mileage, fill up with new clean conventional oil, and drive from 10 miles to 3000 miles, rear main sea leak will stop. There is no way to give exact mileage when leak will stop, however, stop it will. By the way, clean oil you read about in patent was used for 55 gallon web offset gear boxes, where not only did we have to reduce bulk oil cost, reduce temperature, stop seal leaks, chemistry had to be able to be applied on the fly. Auto-Rx works as represented. Using existing oil is to lessen expense, if someone wants to use clean oil fine.

 

[Spartane]

Hi John,

I too noticed the noise reduction/smoother engine effect when I added a 3 oz maintenance dose of Auto-Rx to my 2003 ECHO. The little 1.5 litre ECHO engine is so small that it tends to pass a bit of 4-cylinder jitter through to the steering wheel. The Auto-Rx was added to the original breakin oil at about 4000kms or so, so I doubt that there was any carbon buildup in the engine!

However, I found that the smoothing effect only seemed to last for about a week or so before it wore off (remember, this was only a small maintenance dose of Auto-Rx - not the full bottle).

Later, I switched the oil to Mobil 1 5W30 and added the same 3oz maintenance Auto-Rx dose during the oil change. The car ran a bit smoother after the oil change, but this is fairly normal for most oil changes, since the old oil is dirty and the new oil is clean. I drove if for about 3000Kms before my Schaeffers 132 oil additive arrived (about 6 weeks ago). I added about 4 - 5 ozs of 132 to the Mobil 1 and boy did that do the trick. That little 1.5 litre 4-cylinder motor smoothed out better than ever (silky-smooth). Those annoying upper harmonics that occurred at idle with the auto-transmission in gear mostly vanished. An engine resonance that occurred at cruising speed between 60 - 65MPH is completely gone; the car is silky-smooth and quiet up there too. And more important, the smoothing effect is still working six weeks later!

Now I know there's a big difference between my lower viscosity 5W30 Mobil 1 synthetic and your 15W40 oil, so the 332 may not do the same thing for you. I'm just letting you know about this in case you find it useful.

 

[Frank]

Thanks for your post. I have been trying to find yet another way to explain Auto-Rx is not an oil additive. By the way, I agree with Ken2 on this subject.

Member
Member # 655

posted June 11, 2003 05:37 PM
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Tommie,

The Delvac 1 or the Redline have everything they need for excellent engine protection, as does Schaeffer's oil and several others. What you get from the jug with these can't be improved upon. I wouldn't mix Delvac 1 and Redline...each is excellent oil as it is, and the combination us unlikely to be better than either.

Consider the 132 for oil-burning engines or for improving poor quality oil when you should have bought better oil in the first place--which you did. Where would I use 132?...maybe in an engine with 5W-20 and the owner can't accept that this oil is OK for his engine.


Ken

[ June 11, 2003, 05:39 PM: Message edited by: Ken2 ]
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have borrowed this post from Ken2 it's my feeling also

 

[Rick20]

Auto-Rx is more than just a cleaner. Sure it is sold and marketed as a cleaner. However its made up, primarily, of three esters. One being a naturally occuring fatty alcohol, esterified, which serves as the primary cleaning component of varnish and combustion contaminants. It also contains a polyol ester and an aliphatic ester in it formulation. These little animals were added to give the product properties of enhanced ep and a foundation resistant to oxidation. These are good properties to be added to the package when cleaning a motor. One of the secondary esters is primarily used in aircraft lubrication, the other is a chlor free, phos free, boron free, friction reducer, primarily used in metal fabrication, be it stamping, machining, to keep friction down when heat can be the difference in a good part and the scrap bucket. These are a couple of good allies when removing third party abrasives from your motor. Drive on.