How bad are these VR6 Passat GDI intake valves?

[jsean]

How bad do these intake valves look? This is on my VR6 Passat. It’s always had a rough idle for the first 30 seconds after a cold start. That’s when the rpm is “high”. After this, idle will drop and it idles smoothly. No power loss or changes to mpg.

I’m wondering if this is normal or is it time for carbon cleaning? Carbon cleaning on this car is pretty expensive and I’m wondering if running a couple of cans of the CRC GDI intake cleaner will help clean up some of the wet looking deposits?


These pictures are from last Nov., pre piston soak.

 

[Lubener]

Bad, very bad...

 

[Bailey28]

I can't see anything but black fuzz, camera is zoomed in too far.

 

[jsean]

I can't see anything but black fuzz, camera is zoomed in too far.

Sorry, that’s my cheapo scope with the side view lens. No zoom in/out option.

I can reupload the same pictures outlining the valves if it helps you and the others a bit?

 

[Trav]

How bad do these intake valves look? This is on my VR6 Passat. It’s always had a rough idle for the first 30 seconds after a cold start. That’s when the rpm is “high”. After this, idle will drop and it idles smoothly. No power loss or changes to mpg.

I’m wondering if this is normal or is it time for carbon cleaning? Carbon cleaning on this car is pretty expensive and I’m wondering if running a couple of cans of the CRC GDI intake cleaner will help clean up some of the wet looking deposits?


These pictures are from last Nov., pre piston soak.

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The looks to a be a lot of oil, That with the rough running cold is a good indicator of a failure in the PCV system. Year and engine code?

 

[jsean]

I was burning a ton of oil pre piston soak (about a quart every 300 miles in Sport mode). These are pictures from that time.
Good catch on the year and code - 2013 with 3.6 CDVB engine. I updated the original post as well. From what I’ve read, if there’s a PCV failure, I’d either have major oil consumption and/or plugging the port near the PCV diaphragm on the intake with my finger will cause the idle to change. I don’t have noticeable oil consumption (lost 4 notches on the dipstick with 4,600 miles on this OCI) and plugging the port doesn’t change the engine idle (warm or cold).

The rough running is just the first 30 seconds upon startup. Very consistent behavior through the cold winter we had and during the couple of 90F days we had earlier this month.

 

[demarpaint]

Not good imo it looks like an oil burner.

 

[jsean]

Not good imo it looks like an oil burner.

I’m hoping it’s a former oil burner now. 1st OCI after piston soak with Valvoline Restore and Protect was 1/2qt make up oil iirc. 2nd OCI now again with Valvoline Restore and Protect is at 4,600 miles - oil level has dropped 4 notches but I think I won’t be needing to add any oil over the next 400 miles.
It’s the deposits on the valves I’m unsure of.

IVD cleaning is about $1,500-$1,700 at the euro shops. What I’m really hoping to do is prolong this with some magic in a can because the deposits look wet instead of being dry and caked on and take care of it around 150k miles when I’m going to have to spend a few grand with redoing the timing system anyways.

 

[slo town]

I have a healthy, 70K mile VR6 Passat. We have no rough idle during cold starts. I'm curious, what the total miles on your engine?

Scott

 

[demarpaint]

I’m hoping it’s a former oil burner now. 1st OCI after piston soak with Valvoline Restore and Protect was 1/2qt make up oil iirc. 2nd OCI now again with Valvoline Restore and Protect is at 4,600 miles - oil level has dropped 4 notches but I think I won’t be needing to add any oil over the next 400 miles.
It’s the deposits on the valves I’m unsure of.

IVD cleaning is about $1,500-$1,700 at the euro shops. What I’m really hoping to do is prolong this with some magic in a can because the deposits look wet instead of being dry and caked on and take care of it around 150k miles when I’m going to have to spend a few grand with redoing the timing system anyways.

You might possibly be the next Valvoline Restore and Protect success story. Although you might have a few things going on there, some of which Valvoline Restore and Protect might not be able to address. In any event good luck!!! Keep us updated.

 

[jsean]

I have a healthy, 70K mile VR6 Passat. We have no rough idle during cold starts. I'm curious, what the total miles on your engine?

Scott

I have a healthy, 70K mile VR6 Passat. We have no rough idle during cold starts. I'm curious, what the total miles on your engine?

Scott

Thanks for chiming in. I was hoping you’d respond since you have the VR6 as well. I’m at a little over 116,500 miles now. Do you feel any additional vibrations at all during the first 30 seconds upon cold start? That’s what I’m describing as rough idle, maybe not the best description.

Does your VR6 idle down as well?
I’ll add videos of warm idling and a cold start here shortly. Feel free to take a look and let me know if it’s similar to your VR6

 

[jsean]

You might possibly be the next Valvoline Restore and Protect success story. Although you might have a few things going on there, some of which Valvoline Restore and Protect might not be able to address. In any event good luck!!! Keep us updated.

Will do! I attribute most of my oil burning resolution to the B12 piston soak with the Valvoline Restore and Protect helping clean up whatever that remains. No complaints from me either ways given my 300 miles/qt consumption.

I’m hoping this is a nothing burger and I can go back to worrying if I should plan for a VW502 or 504 oil in my 2020 Passat vs. the factory recommended VW508

 

[jsean]

Warm idling video:


Cold start video including idle down at about the 30s interval:

 

[shortyb]

Has the breather been replaced? Any oil leaks? Believe it or not, a bad G62 temp sensor can cause rough running on start-up until idle drop. Had that happen on my CCTA. That kind of consumption points to the pesky low tension ring stick (which the piston soak seems to have loosened up some) and/or a failing breather. Breather doesn't have to completely fail to allow a moderate amount of oil vapor into the intake tract either. SAPS rating has little to do with IVD, think it's a combination of the breather, mileage and stuck rings that is causing the consumption. Save your money on the CRC if you expect a large amount of cleaning, only a proper walnut/media blasting will restore them to almost new condition. Once that is done, the CRC IVD spray can help MAINTAIN a better level of cleanliness, but thats about all it can do.

 

[PandaBear]

IVD cleaning is about $1,500-$1,700 at the euro shops.

Is it really that much? I remember someone on Lexus forum said walnut blasting is about $700 a few years ago.

 

[97prizm]

How bad do these intake valves look? This is on my VR6 Passat. It’s always had a rough idle for the first 30 seconds after a cold start. That’s when the rpm is “high”. After this, idle will drop and it idles smoothly. No power loss or changes to mpg.

I’m wondering if this is normal or is it time for carbon cleaning? Carbon cleaning on this car is pretty expensive and I’m wondering if running a couple of cans of the CRC GDI intake cleaner will help clean up some of the wet looking deposits?


These pictures are from last Nov., pre piston soak.

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Not good. Plus try cleaning the maf with cleaner as a dirty one can cause issues. That looks super caked on. Maybe one of the intake cleaning kits to start.

 

[slo town]

Thanks for chiming in. I was hoping you’d respond since you have the VR6 as well. I’m at a little over 116,500 miles now. Do you feel any additional vibrations at all during the first 30 seconds upon cold start? That’s what I’m describing as rough idle, maybe not the best description.

Does your VR6 idle down as well?
I’ll add videos of warm idling and a cold start here shortly. Feel free to take a look and let me know if it’s similar to your VR6

I went out and did an overnight cold start for you, but understand we live in Cali and the garage thermometer said 64 degrees. Regardless, the last time the VR6 was driven was 6 days ago, so it was thoroughly cooled off.

Car fired in 2 seconds and dropped to "hot idle" in 23 seconds. During fast idle I would say it's not perfectly smooth. IMO the VR6 has an edginess to it. We have a pair of 6 cylinder BMWs and those are smooth as silk, hot or cold. In comparison the VR6 seems to be a bit of a ruffian - but that's one of the things I like about it.

Let me add too, our VR6 has never used any oil at all. 5K mile OCIs from new with a lifetime of Euro Castrol 0W-40. It's not a short tripped car. Sue and I bought it for our road trips so as a consequence it sits for several weeks at a time.

Scott

 

[slo town]

Warm idling video:


Cold start video including idle down at about the 30s interval:

Just noticed your videos. I'd say your cold start idle looks and sounds much like ours.

Your oil consumption was/is a problem, however.

Scott

 

[jsean]

Has the breather been replaced? Any oil leaks? Believe it or not, a bad G62 temp sensor can cause rough running on start-up until idle drop. Had that happen on my CCTA. That kind of consumption points to the pesky low tension ring stick (which the piston soak seems to have loosened up some) and/or a failing breather. Breather doesn't have to completely fail to allow a moderate amount of oil vapor into the intake tract either. SAPS rating has little to do with IVD, think it's a combination of the breather, mileage and stuck rings that is causing the consumption. Save your money on the CRC if you expect a large amount of cleaning, only a proper walnut/media blasting will restore them to almost new condition. Once that is done, the CRC IVD spray can help MAINTAIN a better level of cleanliness, but thats about all it can do.

Thanks for the response. The PCV diaphragm was intact in Oct/Nov last year when I did the piston soak. I’m not opposed to changing out the diaphragm (looks like RKX makes just the diaphragm kit without having to change the whole valve cover) and I might do that later this summer anyways as a PM item.

I had not considered the ECT (didn’t realize they were called G62 on the VWs - this is our first VW and GDI vehicle, so thanks for that). Ime, ECTs caused problems with warm startups. But again I’ll look at how much a new G62 sensor and see if I can get to it without too much hassle and change it out.

I figured the walnut blasting was the best course of action. I’ll try and take the spark plugs out sometime this week and stick the scope in there again to see if I can take a quick peek at any of the valves for comparison of current vs. Oct/Nov photos I posted on here.

 

[jsean]

Is it really that much? I remember someone on Lexus forum said walnut blasting is about $700 a few years ago.

On the VR6 Passats unfortunately it is. They’re going to have to put it in service position - not really sure how they’re doing that. I didn’t find any extension points on the front end but I also don’t know where to look on this car.
If this was $700 for walnut blasting, I’d 100% just have it done at a shop.