House addition questions

[The_Jeff]

Originally Posted By: Pop_Rivit
Originally Posted By: eljefino
and if you can claim poverty. See if anyone got away with it. Like you have a sick mom who's going to live with you and you need her on the first floor b/c she can't climb stairs, and you need a bathroom etc.


Around here we consider that lying; not only is it unethical but it has the potential to get to into legal trouble when you falsify claims before a governing body such as a zoning/building/assessors office.

Besides, anyone who's been around the business for a bit has already dealt with shysters trying to pass of things like that; most of the folks in those offices are pretty adept at spotting liars.


I'm not one to get into OP's offline business. Maybe he has such a situation but hasn't thought of it benefiting him in this manner.

Besides, I said "if".

Please get off your moral high horse.

 

[supton]

Originally Posted By: IndyIan
Your rafter ties are your 2nd floor joists, you don't need more, you just need the connection between the wall studs and floor joists to stop failing now, as it did hold for several decades. Or perhaps a few studs have started to rot allowing them to flex.
Its up to you, I would gut the shifting wall atleast and replace and reinforce the structure as needed to make it solid. Also then you can see if your siding is leaking from the outside, and replace that too if you need it.
Then you can sell it in safe condition if you want and let someone else deal with the rest.
Also I was thinking that it might be to your advantage to move soon before house prices rebound, as I think the absolute cost difference between your current place and new one will be less, than if you wait for the rebound to get your original buying price?


I suspect the previous owner took out a load bearing wall. I could be wrong, as I'm not sure how the bedroom would be configured with a wall in the middle of it. One of the options I'm weighing is adding columns to the structure. That would be vastly cheaper than an addition.

Rafter ties / floor joists are located 3 feet below the intersection of the roof and the wall. Wall is 2x4's on a wide spacing (21"?), thus I think it is easy for the roof to yank on the wall. There is nothing under the ridge of the roof to support it, thus there is a downward force (dead weight of the roof plus snowload) which scissors outward on the wall. One side of the roof is buttressed by an addition, so I think it's moving relatively little; thus one wall is "seeing" the force exerted by both halves of the roof.

Oddly enough I think the balloon construction means the continous run of 2x4 down to the foundation means the wood is stronger than if this had been a platform build. OTOH that means the floor joists were simply nailed to the studs not bolted, so I'm not sure how good the forces are resisted by the nails. If it were possible to just sister up joists and studs I would; put a big ole bolt through all four pieces, that should be strong I'd think (double shear on the bolt, that should have strength). Problem is, the forces are still against the grain, not into the grain. Seems like it will still move, albeit more slowly.

 

[IndyIan]

You can just use metal ties as well.
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Simpson-Strong-Tie-Hurricane-Tie-H3Z/202092488
2 per joist stud connection would be stronger than the studs I'd think. We used something similar on our 12/12 roof as our floor joists were perpendicular to the rafters. They have a engineered strength and our engineer did the roof load calcs and they do the job with only 1 per rafter.

 

[supton]

One thought is to put a beam on the bulging wall, like one of those laminated beams meant for floors, so as to get lots of stiffness. Rafters transfer force to this beam, then to the wall; then rafter ties on the ends to tie the roof ends together. Unconventional though.

Sketch of the house.
http://www.uptonplayground.com/gallery/main.php?g2_view=core.DownloadItem&g2_itemId=6699

 

[supton]

Got ahold of the town inspector. Didn't have a recommendation on a structural engineer, but did clarified on the need for permits. If I reside with wood, no permit required. Although the work would be past the $1k mark it would be considered "replacing with like" thus no permit required. So I'm good to go on whatever renovation I need, short of an addition. He didn't seem concerned; no "I need to come out and look at this" so I don't have to worry about that.

Forgot to ask about burying the tires though. Odds are they would defer to whatever the state says about the matter. But that is only an issue if we decide to put the addition on.

One headache down, several more to go.

 

[supton]

http://www.jwkhomeinspections.com/blog/c...-inspector.html

Third pic down shows basically what I have going on. Well, that shows platform framing not balloon, so technically I have psuedo rafter ties where the joists are. In my case, the height of the wall is 3', so adding a proper rafter tie would be at belt height.

 

[LargeCarManX2]

Originally Posted By: Win
Originally Posted By: LargeCarManX2
.... Problem now a day's is "International" building codes in most areas....yes, even po-dunk towns have adopted these. ...


Yep. These goofy things are all the rage now. I call ours that "(unprintable) French property code".

What a pain in the behind it is.


Yup! pull a permit to build a room addition on and the rest of the structure needs to be up graded to international code which is way....out....of....line!

 

[datech]

I was reading all the posts on this and I thought of something...
A thorough exam might show where exactly the failure is.

Are there nails letting loose somewhere? (how long are those nails? how long before they let go entirely?)
Are the wall studs bending above the floor level?
connecting everything together with more hardware will probably help somewhat(long deck screws? metal straps?)

I would say it is good the overall dimensions are fairly small.

 

[supton]

I don't think anything is letting lose, but I have not opened up the ceiling. I'm missing a photo of the ridge, so I can't compare pics from two years ago. I put some photos together, never tried this google docs but here goes:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B_AGcJJ_DMXBdVVPTHF1NDlHOTQ/edit?usp=sharing

 

[datech]

I looked at the pdf and I can see a slight curve in the roof area around that light, but the photos aren't clear enough to see what is going on.

I would say it might be pretty slight and the cracks in the drywall pretty minor so maybe you don't have a real severe problem.

It would seem to me that just logically thinking there must be either:
1. bending of the wall studs outward above the 2nd floor line
2. failure of fasteners in the ties/floor joists to wall stud joint.
3. cracks or some kind of failure in some of the lumber somewhere.

I have read that houses change the most in the first 50-60 years and then after that they are more stabile.

Your house is a pretty good looking house, at least on the surface. Hopefully it will hold together for a while until you can figure something out.