Honda/Acura Oil Filters

[artbuc]

Just got off the phone with an on-line Honda dealer. He said Filtech still makes the 15400-PLM-A01 filter for Honda and Honeywell also makes the equivalent filter 15400-PLM-A02. He said Honda considers them interchangeable and that when he orders filters, they get a random distribution of both.

He is aware that there is alot of internet buzz saying that the A02 is inferior because it is made by Honeywell, but he assured me that Honeywell makes the A02 to Honda's specs and that the A02 should not be compared to any Fram filter.

Can anyone out there confirm that this is true? How does the Filtech A01 compare to Wix/NAPAGold or PureOne filters? Thanks.

 

[Johnny]

I have been using the Honeywell/Honda filters since 2005 and have had absolutely no problems. They are an excellent filter. Don't believe everything you hear in the net.

 

[Sayjac]

The A-02 is made to Honda specs and has a silicone adbv. IMO, it is similar to a Fram Tough Guard without the screen over bypass, and has a P type gasket. It still has the fiber endcaps like the orange can. So in several respects it is similar in design to other Fram filters. AFAIK, they don't publish the efficiency specs on either of the Honda filters.

Many folks prefer the A-01 with the open (no endcap) design. Again though, hard to tell the efficiency coompared to the other aftermarkets you listed (P1, Wix). A study done by our own river_rat (below) did show that type filter seems to excel in flow characterisics, not as much in filtration.

I've used the dealer installed Honda A-02 several times with no issues. Now however, I use a P1 and have been satisfied with the price for filtration and construction. For me, I don't see an advantage in either of the Honda filters over the aftermarkets you mentioned. JMO

http://filtrationcomparisons.weebly.com/

 

[qdeezie]

In my opinion, any filter that has paper (cardboard) end caps or worse yet, no end caps is a no go and is inferior no matter how you slice it. If it doesn't have metal end caps, I have a hard time believing that the filter will be as efficient as the ones with a metal end cap. I would look at the cost of the Honda/Acura filter (because you know the dealer has a nice markup) and use that towards the best off the shelf parts store filter I could get. The only fram filter in my opinion that's worth buying is the XG series, which is not what the Honda filter is modeled after. I think the Wix and PureOne filters are far better than O.E. Honda. To take it a step further, I personally would even use a Purolator classic over the OE Honda filter. Somewhere on this site, someone has 3 different Honda filters cut open and 2 out of 3 didn't have end caps. The only one that did have the end caps was the Honeywell filter and that was cardboard.

 

[qdeezie]

And what I meant by the best off the shelf filter is for instance, if the Honda filter is $6.00, buy a parts store filter that you know has metal end caps for $6.00.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted By: qdeezie
Somewhere on this site, someone has 3 different Honda filters cut open and 2 out of 3 didn't have end caps. The only one that did have the end caps was the Honeywell filter and that was cardboard.


I don't recall seeing those photos, but if the ones without any end caps are done right, it can be an OK design - kind of like the Toyota oil filters. But yeah, I agree that good 'ol metal end caps are hard to beat for structural integrity and sealing at the ends of the media pleats.

 

[qdeezie]

This is what I was referring to: https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/threads/honda-oem-honeywell-filtech-and-japan.137183/

For me, it's a question of value for the dollar I'm spending. If it's priced according to what the filter offers, I'm ok with it, but if it's not then, I'd rather spend on what gives me the better value.

 

[Johnny]

No end caps, no matter what they are made of do the filtering. The filter media does.

 

[AuthorEditor]

There's a guy over at ADV Rider who claims to be a Fram Technical Manager and he's setting some guys straight on oil filters. Too bad he doesn't hang around here too.

 

[trabuccomlfrd]

Originally Posted By: Johnny
I have been using the Honeywell/Honda filters since 2005 and have had absolutely no problems. They are an excellent filter. Don't believe everything you hear in the net.

i have cut open a subaru/honeywell filter witch is the same as the honda fiter and it is an exact replica of a fram, paper endcaps in all. i highly advise against them. i can post pictures of the one i cut open i desired

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: AuthorEditor
There's a guy over at ADV Rider who claims to be a Fram Technical Manager and he's setting some guys straight on oil filters. Too bad he doesn't hang around here too.


I do believe he has posted this here as well.

In regards to what he posted:

Originally Posted By: FRAM DUDE

Hello,
I work for Fram as the technical manager and would like to clear up the misinformation being presented here. 1. There is no "cardboard" in any Fram filter. The end caps in our filter are made of a engineered fiber material similar to the media itself. Given that the only job of the end cap is to seal the media, nothing glues to the media better. Our competitors have made an industry of calling our end cap cardboard because they simply do not want to put filter efficiency test numbers against ours. Honda automobiles use our filter as OE and it has these type of caps so its kind of funny you mention them. We have made their OE filters for years. Subaru uses the same design from us as well. Even the 345,000$ Bentley Arnage uses fiber end caps in its oil filter.
2. The antidrainback valve is either nitrile rubber or silicone depending on model. It seals against the steel tapping plate to keep the filter full of oil when the engine is off to prevent dry starts. We are in the process of coverting our entire MC filter line to silicone adv's


Then why do the FRAM high-end filters NOT have fibre end-caps?

If they were as bad as many like to think, yes, there would be engines failing left and right.

HOWEVER

If they are as good as FRAM would lead you to believe, they would have no reason to use metal end-caps on ANY of their filters... But that is clearly not the case.

They are simply adequate. Nothing more, nothing less. For a filter that is intended to be in service for a "regular" interval, they are fine. Obviously, if even FRAM doesn't used them on filters designed for extended use, they obviously aren't "adequate enough" for that.

 

[AuthorEditor]

This guy Tegger has used and studied Honda oil filters and seems happy with them, though his report is a few years old. Tegger

 

[FZ1]

Interesting. Thanks.

 

[artbuc]

This is the most logical and straightforward post I have read regarding this controversial and sometimes confusing subject. Although I am a faithful NapaGold/Wix user, I just bought a 6 pack of Honda Filtech oil filters. Based on what I have read here, they should be fine on a 5k OCI. BTW, my MDX came with a Filtech oil filter.

 

[Sayjac]

Quote:
This guy Tegger has used and studied Honda oil filters and seems happy with them, though his report is a few years old. Tegger
I particularly enjoyed Tegger's take on why metal end caps are used instead of the fiber endcaps.
"I've been told that if a particular manufacturer is using metal end caps, it is more probably because either 1) That's what their machinery uses, or 2) They use the same end cap dies for industrial filters that are intended to filter water-based liquids. NOT because "metal is better". They may market "metal is better" if they perceive some sales advantage to doing so, but there is no functional advantage to metal. However, it does keep them from having to upgrade their machinery..."

Let's see, that would be upgrading their machinery to cheapen the product.

If Tegger bought that hornswoggle, I'm thinking Honeywell may also have some swamp land in Arizona that he would also be very interested in. What's the saying, he has a right to his opinion, just not a right to his own facts.

I guess all the high end filters like Amsoil, M1, RP, Bosch DP, et al. and on and on, have chosen metal because they they don't want "upgrade their machinery". Also interesting to note that Fram has chosen metal, not paper fiber, for it's best XG filter. And the fact that Honda chose Honeywell for it's OEM's wouldn't have anything to do with the concept that they were low bidder for the oil filter manufacture?

The Honda OE filters are OK for what they are. But, based on construction the A-02 is worth about $3.00 or less, and I'd pay ~$4.00 for the A-01. But, when I can get a Pure One with a known efficiency(99.9%), or even a Classic(97.5%), for me it's not worth a trip to the dealer, paying dealer price, or paying shipping charges online.

If one just prefers Honda OEM filters, fine. But, to claim that they are better because they fiber endcaps, unlike Tegger, I'm not buying that. But, I am glad Tegger is satisfied and is going to use the A-02, very reassuring.

 

[AuthorEditor]

Latest post from the Fram technical guy over at ADV Rider is interesting. I won't quote the whole thing, but here is a teaser. Worth it to read if you are interested in this Fram controversy.

Quote:
When you look through the net failures, the underlying story is-
small or big block chevy
Amatuer builder removes bypass from engine block, installs high pressure, high volume oil pump. Gets lots of dirt in engine during build. Installs a 3.50 Fram high efficiency filter. Starts engine with 20w50 oil. Filter plugs with dirt, no bypass valve, filter media cartridge collapses, engine dies.

Fram technical manager

 

[Sayjac]

As OVERKILL said, he's posted here before, run a search under the screen name. Nothing new, hit and run.

Also the information he once posted about the new Microgard "black can" didn't/doesn't agree with what's posted on the box. The old Puro Microgard was virtually the equal (~94%) in efficiency as the stated new "black can" efficiency. Which construction would one prefer for their dollar?

The only controversy is the bottom line. If one prefers paying the same or more for fiber endcap construction as they do for metal endcap constrcution with better rated efficiency, then that's what they should do. I don't happen to.

And, Fram chose metal for their top (XG) filter.

 

[FZ1]

Ain't seen nuthin' to cause me to stop usin' the M1 filter on my 02 V6 Accord. I figure the M1 is good enough for my purposes. I'm a big picture guy. Lol.

 

[Steve S]

The X Guard has to have the metal endcaps for the element material and the metal screen backing.

 

[Gary Allan]

Originally Posted By: FZ1
Ain't seen nuthin' to cause me to stop usin' the M1 filter on my 02 V6 Accord. I figure the M1 is good enough for my purposes. I'm a big picture guy. Lol.




With your OCI's I doubt you'll reduce any particle count over the cheaper alternatives.

Here's an idea! While you're saving all that money not doing UOA, why not save up by not using a (e)M1 filter ..and add even ANOTHER OCI to your routine??

Then you can start saying, "12 MILES! NO MORE!!!". Wouldn't that be fun?