ksaschn has a right be be a little touchy---after all, he's has endured 14 years and over 200K miles driving a Toyota Echo---that'll put some hair on your chest for sure
Honda 0W-20 Semi-Syn Break-in, Odyssey 4,633 Miles
- Thread starter GarrettRay
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Originally Posted By: kender
Originally Posted By: GarrettRay
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Beat the stuffing out of you?!? You had one person correct you (and in a very mild way BTW) that your use of "make up oil" was not correct. You like to use the words "bullying" and "beat" and all that, but it's simply not true. I looked through all your previous posts and the responses, and at no time were you ever bullied.
And no, the reason is not in front of my bolded text. You said that Honda, in a specific service bulletin states that the oil should be left in the engine. Just because you are not "comfortable" with it doesn't mean that it is better to change it early. If your engine does not break in properly then you can have high oil consumption down the road. My question remains, what do you know that Honda does not?
High levels of metals in oil can be meaningless in terms of additional wear to the engine. If the metal is dissolved in the oil then it's not as if it is a bunch of metal flakes or shards running around destroying bearings. It's not going to have any affect at all actually.
High levels of metals in an already broken-in engine are a problem because it shows that something is wearing and that is unusual. But in a new engine it is normal of course. And your supposition that it is harmful is simply not correct.
Originally Posted By: GarrettRay
I told you why in the comment... it's located just in front of your sarcastic bolding of my words. You may feel comfortable driving a new vehicle with an engine full of dirty and contaminated oil, but I'm not.
Anyone else want to join in and beat the stuffing out of me and my first UOA post? Feel free to. Seems like it's a common practice on this site.
You accuse me of making claims without proof, (which I did not. I only said I wish I would have changed it earlier) yet you just did the same thing. Where is YOUR proof that high amounts of metal in a new engine doesn't do damage? You cannot take someone to task over their opinion with another opinion. Are you a politician?
Schaeffer's put the 4.5 quarts in the make-up oil box since I wrote down that I drained and refilled with 4.5 quarts. I simply transcribed the information and was immediately pummeled for it. The question I have is: WHAT DOES IT MATTER?! Everyone understands what it means, but I have no doubt that you and a whole host of others on this site are constantly trolling for any reason at all to bash someone over the head.
And thank you for validating my point!
Someone's a HOT HEAD!!!
Name calling now.... anyone else? This is the official "Beat Up The New Guy" thread. Feel free to jump in.
Originally Posted By: GarrettRay
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Beat the stuffing out of you?!? You had one person correct you (and in a very mild way BTW) that your use of "make up oil" was not correct. You like to use the words "bullying" and "beat" and all that, but it's simply not true. I looked through all your previous posts and the responses, and at no time were you ever bullied.
And no, the reason is not in front of my bolded text. You said that Honda, in a specific service bulletin states that the oil should be left in the engine. Just because you are not "comfortable" with it doesn't mean that it is better to change it early. If your engine does not break in properly then you can have high oil consumption down the road. My question remains, what do you know that Honda does not?
High levels of metals in oil can be meaningless in terms of additional wear to the engine. If the metal is dissolved in the oil then it's not as if it is a bunch of metal flakes or shards running around destroying bearings. It's not going to have any affect at all actually.
High levels of metals in an already broken-in engine are a problem because it shows that something is wearing and that is unusual. But in a new engine it is normal of course. And your supposition that it is harmful is simply not correct.
Originally Posted By: GarrettRay
I told you why in the comment... it's located just in front of your sarcastic bolding of my words. You may feel comfortable driving a new vehicle with an engine full of dirty and contaminated oil, but I'm not.
Anyone else want to join in and beat the stuffing out of me and my first UOA post? Feel free to. Seems like it's a common practice on this site.
You accuse me of making claims without proof, (which I did not. I only said I wish I would have changed it earlier) yet you just did the same thing. Where is YOUR proof that high amounts of metal in a new engine doesn't do damage? You cannot take someone to task over their opinion with another opinion. Are you a politician?
Schaeffer's put the 4.5 quarts in the make-up oil box since I wrote down that I drained and refilled with 4.5 quarts. I simply transcribed the information and was immediately pummeled for it. The question I have is: WHAT DOES IT MATTER?! Everyone understands what it means, but I have no doubt that you and a whole host of others on this site are constantly trolling for any reason at all to bash someone over the head.
And thank you for validating my point!
Someone's a HOT HEAD!!!
Name calling now.... anyone else? This is the official "Beat Up The New Guy" thread. Feel free to jump in.
Originally Posted By: 05Blazer
I changed the factory fill out on my Pilot at 1000K miles and changed it out with Redline and then replaced that 6500 miles early.
In the spirit of finickiness, isn't 1,000,000 miles a little long to have run the factory fill on your Pilot?
I changed the factory fill out on my Pilot at 1000K miles and changed it out with Redline and then replaced that 6500 miles early.
In the spirit of finickiness, isn't 1,000,000 miles a little long to have run the factory fill on your Pilot?
Originally Posted By: GarrettRay
Originally Posted By: JJ717
FYI, make-up oil is what you add during an oil change interval to replace what leaks out or burns.
GOOD LORD!
I don't believe I'll be posting anymore on this website...didn't know everybody was so freekin' picky!
I think JJ717 was only kindly telling you what makeup oil meant.
In fact, the makeup oil is an important field for the UOA. When they report the wear metals, they account for the dilution of the wear metals according to the makeup oil.
Therefore, there is a chance that your UOA report may be wrong. It could be that the software automatically multiplied your wear metals by 2 because they entered the sump value in the makeup-oil field. I would give them a call or send them an e-mail and tell them the correct amount of makeup oil and see if the wear-metal numbers would change.
Originally Posted By: JJ717
FYI, make-up oil is what you add during an oil change interval to replace what leaks out or burns.
GOOD LORD!
I don't believe I'll be posting anymore on this website...didn't know everybody was so freekin' picky!
I think JJ717 was only kindly telling you what makeup oil meant.
In fact, the makeup oil is an important field for the UOA. When they report the wear metals, they account for the dilution of the wear metals according to the makeup oil.
Therefore, there is a chance that your UOA report may be wrong. It could be that the software automatically multiplied your wear metals by 2 because they entered the sump value in the makeup-oil field. I would give them a call or send them an e-mail and tell them the correct amount of makeup oil and see if the wear-metal numbers would change.
Originally Posted By: GarrettRay
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Why? Honda has a good reason for saying that, what do you know that they don't?
Originally Posted By: GarrettRay
First oil sample taken from a drain and fill on my new 2014 Honda Odyssey with 4,633 miles. This is their "break in" oil, which according to a bulletin from Honda on another forum, advises dealerships to leave this oil in for a full OCI period, which would be around 10K. Seeing the level of contaminants contained in the oil from breaking in the motor, I wish I would have changed it at 1,000-1,500 miles like I normally do on a new engine. I decided to leave it in longer based on the bulletin, and now wish I would have ignored it. Oh well, here is the analysis:
I told you why in the comment... it's located just in front of your sarcastic bolding of my words. You may feel comfortable driving a new vehicle with an engine full of dirty and contaminated oil, but I'm not.
Anyone else want to join in and beat the stuffing out of me and my first UOA post? Feel free to. Seems like it's a common practice on this site.
You cannot be serious.
First things first the people here use facts and data,"feelings" are for girlfriends.
Secondly are there suddenly a large volume of Hondas dying. You'd think after building a billion engines they'd know something about breaking in their engines.
As far as the post saying its just an oil high in moly do you know this as fact. There are organic additives that don't show up on a used oil analysis so can you assure me that every oil on the market is including everything the Honda "break in oil" has included.
Thirdly a used oil analysis cannot see wear metals in any accurate way. They are to measure the life left in the oil or contamination such as silica(sand) or coolant.
Now as a tool used oil analysis can be valuable in spotting anomalies which can possibly point to a gasket issue if coolant is found or a filtration issue depending on the silica levels.
They aren't to measure wear. And yes your used oil analysis showed high wear metals,as it should,its breaking in but these metals are so small they aren't doing any damage,unless of course your oil filter is filled with metal shavings.
So feelings and comfort have no seat here at this table. Its data,simple.
So OP do tell what you know that the Honda engineers aren't aware of so we can educate the masses as to why one should ignore the manufacturers specific instructions as to break in.
Are you aware how important ring seal is especially with low tension rings. Can you assure the other Honda owners that the rings will seat adequately if Hondas instructions are not followed.
No one is picking on you. We just expect you to qualify your comments. With facts,not feelings.
Personally I don't see any point in getting used oil analysis done unless its part of establishing trends or determining an oil change interval.
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Why? Honda has a good reason for saying that, what do you know that they don't?
Originally Posted By: GarrettRay
First oil sample taken from a drain and fill on my new 2014 Honda Odyssey with 4,633 miles. This is their "break in" oil, which according to a bulletin from Honda on another forum, advises dealerships to leave this oil in for a full OCI period, which would be around 10K. Seeing the level of contaminants contained in the oil from breaking in the motor, I wish I would have changed it at 1,000-1,500 miles like I normally do on a new engine. I decided to leave it in longer based on the bulletin, and now wish I would have ignored it. Oh well, here is the analysis:
I told you why in the comment... it's located just in front of your sarcastic bolding of my words. You may feel comfortable driving a new vehicle with an engine full of dirty and contaminated oil, but I'm not.
Anyone else want to join in and beat the stuffing out of me and my first UOA post? Feel free to. Seems like it's a common practice on this site.
You cannot be serious.
First things first the people here use facts and data,"feelings" are for girlfriends.
Secondly are there suddenly a large volume of Hondas dying. You'd think after building a billion engines they'd know something about breaking in their engines.
As far as the post saying its just an oil high in moly do you know this as fact. There are organic additives that don't show up on a used oil analysis so can you assure me that every oil on the market is including everything the Honda "break in oil" has included.
Thirdly a used oil analysis cannot see wear metals in any accurate way. They are to measure the life left in the oil or contamination such as silica(sand) or coolant.
Now as a tool used oil analysis can be valuable in spotting anomalies which can possibly point to a gasket issue if coolant is found or a filtration issue depending on the silica levels.
They aren't to measure wear. And yes your used oil analysis showed high wear metals,as it should,its breaking in but these metals are so small they aren't doing any damage,unless of course your oil filter is filled with metal shavings.
So feelings and comfort have no seat here at this table. Its data,simple.
So OP do tell what you know that the Honda engineers aren't aware of so we can educate the masses as to why one should ignore the manufacturers specific instructions as to break in.
Are you aware how important ring seal is especially with low tension rings. Can you assure the other Honda owners that the rings will seat adequately if Hondas instructions are not followed.
No one is picking on you. We just expect you to qualify your comments. With facts,not feelings.
Personally I don't see any point in getting used oil analysis done unless its part of establishing trends or determining an oil change interval.
Originally Posted By: Clevy
Thirdly a used oil analysis cannot see wear metals in any accurate way. They are to measure the life left in the oil or contamination such as silica(sand) or coolant.
Now as a tool used oil analysis can be valuable in spotting anomalies which can possibly point to a gasket issue if coolant is found or a filtration issue depending on the silica levels.
They aren't to measure wear.
How/why is it you are now saying not to measure wear by UOA? Aluminum from piston skirts, chromium from piston rings, iron from cam lobes, crank journals, copper from bearings/bushings, if one has more of these elements does one not have more wear? How do these things get deposited in the absence of wear? Would the PPM of AL/FE etc... not be an objective way to quantify the amount of wear? Where(pun intended) do these metals come from?
From this very website "By analyzing a sample of used engine oil, you can determine the wear rate..." But you say we aren't to measure wear with them?
Thirdly a used oil analysis cannot see wear metals in any accurate way. They are to measure the life left in the oil or contamination such as silica(sand) or coolant.
Now as a tool used oil analysis can be valuable in spotting anomalies which can possibly point to a gasket issue if coolant is found or a filtration issue depending on the silica levels.
They aren't to measure wear.
How/why is it you are now saying not to measure wear by UOA? Aluminum from piston skirts, chromium from piston rings, iron from cam lobes, crank journals, copper from bearings/bushings, if one has more of these elements does one not have more wear? How do these things get deposited in the absence of wear? Would the PPM of AL/FE etc... not be an objective way to quantify the amount of wear? Where(pun intended) do these metals come from?
From this very website "By analyzing a sample of used engine oil, you can determine the wear rate..." But you say we aren't to measure wear with them?
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: Cardiobuck
Originally Posted By: Clevy
Thirdly a used oil analysis cannot see wear metals in any accurate way. They are to measure the life left in the oil or contamination such as silica(sand) or coolant.
Now as a tool used oil analysis can be valuable in spotting anomalies which can possibly point to a gasket issue if coolant is found or a filtration issue depending on the silica levels.
They aren't to measure wear.
How/why is it you are now saying not to measure wear by UOA? Aluminum from piston skirts, chromium from piston rings, iron from cam lobes, crank journals, copper from bearings/bushings, if one has more of these elements does one not have more wear? How do these things get deposited in the absence of wear? Would the PPM of AL/FE etc... not be an objective way to quantify the amount of wear? Where(pun intended) do these metals come from?
From this very website "By analyzing a sample of used engine oil, you can determine the wear rate..." But you say we aren't to measure wear with them?
Please read:
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/used-oil-analysis/
Originally Posted By: Clevy
Thirdly a used oil analysis cannot see wear metals in any accurate way. They are to measure the life left in the oil or contamination such as silica(sand) or coolant.
Now as a tool used oil analysis can be valuable in spotting anomalies which can possibly point to a gasket issue if coolant is found or a filtration issue depending on the silica levels.
They aren't to measure wear.
How/why is it you are now saying not to measure wear by UOA? Aluminum from piston skirts, chromium from piston rings, iron from cam lobes, crank journals, copper from bearings/bushings, if one has more of these elements does one not have more wear? How do these things get deposited in the absence of wear? Would the PPM of AL/FE etc... not be an objective way to quantify the amount of wear? Where(pun intended) do these metals come from?
From this very website "By analyzing a sample of used engine oil, you can determine the wear rate..." But you say we aren't to measure wear with them?
Please read:
http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/used-oil-analysis/
Originally Posted By: Clevy
Originally Posted By: GarrettRay
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Why? Honda has a good reason for saying that, what do you know that they don't?
Originally Posted By: GarrettRay
First oil sample taken from a drain and fill on my new 2014 Honda Odyssey with 4,633 miles. This is their "break in" oil, which according to a bulletin from Honda on another forum, advises dealerships to leave this oil in for a full OCI period, which would be around 10K. Seeing the level of contaminants contained in the oil from breaking in the motor, I wish I would have changed it at 1,000-1,500 miles like I normally do on a new engine. I decided to leave it in longer based on the bulletin, and now wish I would have ignored it. Oh well, here is the analysis:
I told you why in the comment... it's located just in front of your sarcastic bolding of my words. You may feel comfortable driving a new vehicle with an engine full of dirty and contaminated oil, but I'm not.
Anyone else want to join in and beat the stuffing out of me and my first UOA post? Feel free to. Seems like it's a common practice on this site.
You cannot be serious.
First things first the people here use facts and data,"feelings" are for girlfriends.
Secondly are there suddenly a large volume of Hondas dying. You'd think after building a billion engines they'd know something about breaking in their engines.
As far as the post saying its just an oil high in moly do you know this as fact. There are organic additives that don't show up on a used oil analysis so can you assure me that every oil on the market is including everything the Honda "break in oil" has included.
Thirdly a used oil analysis cannot see wear metals in any accurate way. They are to measure the life left in the oil or contamination such as silica(sand) or coolant.
Now as a tool used oil analysis can be valuable in spotting anomalies which can possibly point to a gasket issue if coolant is found or a filtration issue depending on the silica levels.
They aren't to measure wear. And yes your used oil analysis showed high wear metals,as it should,its breaking in but these metals are so small they aren't doing any damage,unless of course your oil filter is filled with metal shavings.
So feelings and comfort have no seat here at this table. Its data,simple.
So OP do tell what you know that the Honda engineers aren't aware of so we can educate the masses as to why one should ignore the manufacturers specific instructions as to break in.
Are you aware how important ring seal is especially with low tension rings. Can you assure the other Honda owners that the rings will seat adequately if Hondas instructions are not followed.
No one is picking on you. We just expect you to qualify your comments. With facts,not feelings.
Personally I don't see any point in getting used oil analysis done unless its part of establishing trends or determining an oil change interval.
First off...Yes, I agree about your "feelings" comment. However, if someone on this website sees 4 or 5 quarts listed in the "Make Up Oil" section, it should be an automatic given that this vehicle had a drain and fill. YES, I AM AWARE OF WHAT MAKE-UP OIL IS! Someone making rude comments about something so elementary is obviously looking to start a fight or be a blatant smartazz. I will not tolerate it....unless it's someone making a joke about it, as the first poster after my OP did. I'm fine with that. Everybody else chiming in because they feel the need to 'educate' me is rude and distasteful. That's called being a "know-it-all" and people like that really rub me the wrong way.
Second: I made no comment or insinuation of what was in Honda's oil.
Third: I also made no suggestion AT ALL of what other Honda owners should do with their vehicles. Although I see a lot of people on this site doing that. I simply stated that I wish I would have changed it sooner. How does this imply that others should do the same thing? I simply posted my first UOA, and every "know-it-all" began smacking me around for it. Why???? 100% of the comments on this website are 100% opinion....that is all. If you or anyone else believes this to be untrue, then I'm sorry to be the one to let the steam out of your train. Attacking people for their opinions with your own OPINIONS is about as dumb as it gets!
Fourth: Honda is in the business of selling vehicles, right? WHY ON EARTH would they be interested in our vehicles lasting very long? Short answer: They are NOT. It is up to the owner to make educated guesses on what to do to make them last as long as possible. Honda could not care less about how long my Odyssey lasts, except that it makes it past the warranty. That's it! Except for high-end sport car manufactures, ALL vehicle manufactures specifically engineer them to last for a short period of time.....so they can sell you another one. Again, that's my opinion. I have no proof nor would I waste the time on here if I did.
This website (I thought) is for sharing information collected from oil samples. I did not realized when I signed up here that it was a battle ground for opinionated people. I will not be posting anymore UOAs here, I can definitely assure everyone of that. Getting pummeled in a forum thread is not my idea of learning something.
Originally Posted By: GarrettRay
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Why? Honda has a good reason for saying that, what do you know that they don't?
Originally Posted By: GarrettRay
First oil sample taken from a drain and fill on my new 2014 Honda Odyssey with 4,633 miles. This is their "break in" oil, which according to a bulletin from Honda on another forum, advises dealerships to leave this oil in for a full OCI period, which would be around 10K. Seeing the level of contaminants contained in the oil from breaking in the motor, I wish I would have changed it at 1,000-1,500 miles like I normally do on a new engine. I decided to leave it in longer based on the bulletin, and now wish I would have ignored it. Oh well, here is the analysis:
I told you why in the comment... it's located just in front of your sarcastic bolding of my words. You may feel comfortable driving a new vehicle with an engine full of dirty and contaminated oil, but I'm not.
Anyone else want to join in and beat the stuffing out of me and my first UOA post? Feel free to. Seems like it's a common practice on this site.
You cannot be serious.
First things first the people here use facts and data,"feelings" are for girlfriends.
Secondly are there suddenly a large volume of Hondas dying. You'd think after building a billion engines they'd know something about breaking in their engines.
As far as the post saying its just an oil high in moly do you know this as fact. There are organic additives that don't show up on a used oil analysis so can you assure me that every oil on the market is including everything the Honda "break in oil" has included.
Thirdly a used oil analysis cannot see wear metals in any accurate way. They are to measure the life left in the oil or contamination such as silica(sand) or coolant.
Now as a tool used oil analysis can be valuable in spotting anomalies which can possibly point to a gasket issue if coolant is found or a filtration issue depending on the silica levels.
They aren't to measure wear. And yes your used oil analysis showed high wear metals,as it should,its breaking in but these metals are so small they aren't doing any damage,unless of course your oil filter is filled with metal shavings.
So feelings and comfort have no seat here at this table. Its data,simple.
So OP do tell what you know that the Honda engineers aren't aware of so we can educate the masses as to why one should ignore the manufacturers specific instructions as to break in.
Are you aware how important ring seal is especially with low tension rings. Can you assure the other Honda owners that the rings will seat adequately if Hondas instructions are not followed.
No one is picking on you. We just expect you to qualify your comments. With facts,not feelings.
Personally I don't see any point in getting used oil analysis done unless its part of establishing trends or determining an oil change interval.
First off...Yes, I agree about your "feelings" comment. However, if someone on this website sees 4 or 5 quarts listed in the "Make Up Oil" section, it should be an automatic given that this vehicle had a drain and fill. YES, I AM AWARE OF WHAT MAKE-UP OIL IS! Someone making rude comments about something so elementary is obviously looking to start a fight or be a blatant smartazz. I will not tolerate it....unless it's someone making a joke about it, as the first poster after my OP did. I'm fine with that. Everybody else chiming in because they feel the need to 'educate' me is rude and distasteful. That's called being a "know-it-all" and people like that really rub me the wrong way.
Second: I made no comment or insinuation of what was in Honda's oil.
Third: I also made no suggestion AT ALL of what other Honda owners should do with their vehicles. Although I see a lot of people on this site doing that. I simply stated that I wish I would have changed it sooner. How does this imply that others should do the same thing? I simply posted my first UOA, and every "know-it-all" began smacking me around for it. Why???? 100% of the comments on this website are 100% opinion....that is all. If you or anyone else believes this to be untrue, then I'm sorry to be the one to let the steam out of your train. Attacking people for their opinions with your own OPINIONS is about as dumb as it gets!
Fourth: Honda is in the business of selling vehicles, right? WHY ON EARTH would they be interested in our vehicles lasting very long? Short answer: They are NOT. It is up to the owner to make educated guesses on what to do to make them last as long as possible. Honda could not care less about how long my Odyssey lasts, except that it makes it past the warranty. That's it! Except for high-end sport car manufactures, ALL vehicle manufactures specifically engineer them to last for a short period of time.....so they can sell you another one. Again, that's my opinion. I have no proof nor would I waste the time on here if I did.
This website (I thought) is for sharing information collected from oil samples. I did not realized when I signed up here that it was a battle ground for opinionated people. I will not be posting anymore UOAs here, I can definitely assure everyone of that. Getting pummeled in a forum thread is not my idea of learning something.
Now you're just being silly. You might get away with making that argument about another brand, but Honda? Lol, pretty much how you slice it a Honda is going to last longer than any other brand. I would say they know more about longevity than anyone else, Toyota included.
You might want to take a different approach on that - just sayin.
Originally Posted By: GarrettRay
Fourth:Honda is in the business of selling vehicles, right? WHY ON EARTH would they be interested in our vehicles lasting very long? Short answer: They are NOT. It is up to the owner to make educated guesses on what to do to make them last as long as possible. Honda could not care less about how long my Odyssey lasts, except that it makes it past the warranty. That's it! Except for high-end sport car manufactures, ALL vehicle manufactures specifically engineer them to last for a short period of time.....so they can sell you another one.
You might want to take a different approach on that - just sayin.
Originally Posted By: GarrettRay
Fourth:Honda is in the business of selling vehicles, right? WHY ON EARTH would they be interested in our vehicles lasting very long? Short answer: They are NOT. It is up to the owner to make educated guesses on what to do to make them last as long as possible. Honda could not care less about how long my Odyssey lasts, except that it makes it past the warranty. That's it! Except for high-end sport car manufactures, ALL vehicle manufactures specifically engineer them to last for a short period of time.....so they can sell you another one.
Again... in YOUR OPINION.
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Now you're just being silly. You might get away with making that argument about another brand, but Honda? Lol, pretty much how you slice it a Honda is going to last longer than any other brand. I would say they know more about longevity than anyone else, Toyota included.
You might want to take a different approach on that - just sayin.
Originally Posted By: GarrettRay
Fourth:Honda is in the business of selling vehicles, right? WHY ON EARTH would they be interested in our vehicles lasting very long? Short answer: They are NOT. It is up to the owner to make educated guesses on what to do to make them last as long as possible. Honda could not care less about how long my Odyssey lasts, except that it makes it past the warranty. That's it! Except for high-end sport car manufactures, ALL vehicle manufactures specifically engineer them to last for a short period of time.....so they can sell you another one.
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Now you're just being silly. You might get away with making that argument about another brand, but Honda? Lol, pretty much how you slice it a Honda is going to last longer than any other brand. I would say they know more about longevity than anyone else, Toyota included.
You might want to take a different approach on that - just sayin.
Originally Posted By: GarrettRay
Fourth:Honda is in the business of selling vehicles, right? WHY ON EARTH would they be interested in our vehicles lasting very long? Short answer: They are NOT. It is up to the owner to make educated guesses on what to do to make them last as long as possible. Honda could not care less about how long my Odyssey lasts, except that it makes it past the warranty. That's it! Except for high-end sport car manufactures, ALL vehicle manufactures specifically engineer them to last for a short period of time.....so they can sell you another one.
Hardly. Of course there are many ways to measure "reliability" or "longevity" or whatever you want to call it, but Honda is always in the top tier.
http://wot.motortrend.com/1401_honda_most_durable_mainstream_brand_for_past_25_years.html
Originally Posted By: GarrettRay
Again... in YOUR OPINION.
http://wot.motortrend.com/1401_honda_most_durable_mainstream_brand_for_past_25_years.html
Originally Posted By: GarrettRay
Again... in YOUR OPINION.
Bottom line, I'll stand by my assertion that Honda knows more about their vehicles than you do.
Even if you are armed with a one-time $30 UOA.
Even if you are armed with a one-time $30 UOA.
I've often heard that stubbornness and opinionated are two traits that always come with one another. LOL!
Motor Trend?? You MUST be kidding! They have been a biased publication since inception. They make their money from advertisements, not subscriptions. Subscriptions pay the postage. Therefore whoever is buying a lot of pages to put their vehicles on, wait for it................. get's the award! Again, using opinions from others to prove your opinion is.....yeah, pretty much meaningless. Sorry......."just saying".
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Hardly. Of course there are many ways to measure "reliability" or "longevity" or whatever you want to call it, but Honda is always in the top tier.
http://wot.motortrend.com/1401_honda_most_durable_mainstream_brand_for_past_25_years.html
Motor Trend?? You MUST be kidding! They have been a biased publication since inception. They make their money from advertisements, not subscriptions. Subscriptions pay the postage. Therefore whoever is buying a lot of pages to put their vehicles on, wait for it................. get's the award! Again, using opinions from others to prove your opinion is.....yeah, pretty much meaningless. Sorry......."just saying".
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Hardly. Of course there are many ways to measure "reliability" or "longevity" or whatever you want to call it, but Honda is always in the top tier.
http://wot.motortrend.com/1401_honda_most_durable_mainstream_brand_for_past_25_years.html
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Bottom line, I'll stand by my assertion that Honda knows more about their vehicles than you do.
Even if you are armed with a one-time $30 UOA.
Once again you make the claim that I said I know more about vehicles than Honda. Where do you get this?? I clearly stated that it is my OPINON....nothing more. I made no insinuation whatsoever that other Honda owners should do anything! Yet, you twist my words into something that isn't true. YOU, are the one making claims as if they are factual. I'm beginning to think you're doing this because you enjoying pushing people around. I just bet you're a real joy to be around....not.
Bottom line, I'll stand by my assertion that Honda knows more about their vehicles than you do.
Even if you are armed with a one-time $30 UOA.
Once again you make the claim that I said I know more about vehicles than Honda. Where do you get this?? I clearly stated that it is my OPINON....nothing more. I made no insinuation whatsoever that other Honda owners should do anything! Yet, you twist my words into something that isn't true. YOU, are the one making claims as if they are factual. I'm beginning to think you're doing this because you enjoying pushing people around. I just bet you're a real joy to be around....not.
BTW.... My UOAs are free. I work for a fuel company that sells Schaeffer products.
Originally Posted By: GarrettRay
BTW.... My UOAs are free. I work for a fuel company that sells Schaeffer products.
Schaeffer.
I'm jealous.
BTW.... My UOAs are free. I work for a fuel company that sells Schaeffer products.
Schaeffer.
I'm jealous.
Originally Posted By: Clevy
Originally Posted By: GarrettRay
BTW.... My UOAs are free. I work for a fuel company that sells Schaeffer products.
Schaeffer.
I'm jealous.
I'm not the type that becomes a 'fanboy' of anything, but I will admit that I am really impressed with their stuff. We use their fuel additives and treatments in our diesel too, and it seems to be the best that we're able to buy from anyone. Using Schaeffer diesel treat, we can drop a load of B-11's cloud point much further than with other brands.
Originally Posted By: GarrettRay
BTW.... My UOAs are free. I work for a fuel company that sells Schaeffer products.
Schaeffer.
I'm jealous.
I'm not the type that becomes a 'fanboy' of anything, but I will admit that I am really impressed with their stuff. We use their fuel additives and treatments in our diesel too, and it seems to be the best that we're able to buy from anyone. Using Schaeffer diesel treat, we can drop a load of B-11's cloud point much further than with other brands.
Well I don't make that claim out of nowhere. You are the one who said that you are aware of Honda's specific instruction to leave the oil in the engine, yet because you were uncomfortable with that you removed it early. Not only did you remove it early you lamented that you had not removed it sooner. So that's not twisting anything. You are claiming to know something that the Honda engineers do not.
You are not commenting in a rational manner. Not only that, you make repeated complaints about myself and others bullying you and beating the stuffing out of you, yet all the while you are the one who seems to be the most critical and offensive.
Originally Posted By: GarrettRay
Once again you make the claim that I said I know more about vehicles than Honda. Where do you get this?? I clearly stated that it is my OPINON....nothing more. I made no insinuation whatsoever that other Honda owners should do anything! Yet, you twist my words into something that isn't true. YOU, are the one making claims as if they are factual. I'm beginning to think you're doing this because you enjoying pushing people around. I just bet you're a real joy to be around....not.
You are not commenting in a rational manner. Not only that, you make repeated complaints about myself and others bullying you and beating the stuffing out of you, yet all the while you are the one who seems to be the most critical and offensive.
Originally Posted By: GarrettRay
Once again you make the claim that I said I know more about vehicles than Honda. Where do you get this?? I clearly stated that it is my OPINON....nothing more. I made no insinuation whatsoever that other Honda owners should do anything! Yet, you twist my words into something that isn't true. YOU, are the one making claims as if they are factual. I'm beginning to think you're doing this because you enjoying pushing people around. I just bet you're a real joy to be around....not.
Did you even read the article? It's not Motor Trend making the claim, they reference other agencies that do. The article is not original investigative reporting. Sheesh.
And if you don't like that source, please feel free to look for other sources yourself. Seriously, Honda wins on overall reliability and durability all over the place.
Originally Posted By: GarrettRay
I've often heard that stubbornness and opinionated are two traits that always come with one another. LOL!
Motor Trend?? You MUST be kidding! They have been a biased publication since inception. They make their money from advertisements, not subscriptions. Subscriptions pay the postage. Therefore whoever is buying a lot of pages to put their vehicles on, wait for it................. get's the award! Again, using opinions from others to prove your opinion is.....yeah, pretty much meaningless. Sorry......."just saying".
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Hardly. Of course there are many ways to measure "reliability" or "longevity" or whatever you want to call it, but Honda is always in the top tier.
http://wot.motortrend.com/1401_honda_most_durable_mainstream_brand_for_past_25_years.html
And if you don't like that source, please feel free to look for other sources yourself. Seriously, Honda wins on overall reliability and durability all over the place.
Originally Posted By: GarrettRay
I've often heard that stubbornness and opinionated are two traits that always come with one another. LOL!
Motor Trend?? You MUST be kidding! They have been a biased publication since inception. They make their money from advertisements, not subscriptions. Subscriptions pay the postage. Therefore whoever is buying a lot of pages to put their vehicles on, wait for it................. get's the award! Again, using opinions from others to prove your opinion is.....yeah, pretty much meaningless. Sorry......."just saying".
Originally Posted By: kschachn
Hardly. Of course there are many ways to measure "reliability" or "longevity" or whatever you want to call it, but Honda is always in the top tier.
http://wot.motortrend.com/1401_honda_most_durable_mainstream_brand_for_past_25_years.html
Ok... so... I'm lost.
There was a drain and fill on this vehicle? Right?
So what was put in?
What was used as the "make up oil"?
And how many miles into this was this drain and fill done?
I was kind of interested in seeing the makeup of what Honda used from the factory, but I will be satisfied if I can figure out a VOA to look at for the "Make up oil" used in this example.
I'm curious.
Thanks.
There was a drain and fill on this vehicle? Right?
So what was put in?
What was used as the "make up oil"?
And how many miles into this was this drain and fill done?
I was kind of interested in seeing the makeup of what Honda used from the factory, but I will be satisfied if I can figure out a VOA to look at for the "Make up oil" used in this example.
I'm curious.
Thanks.
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