HDEO for 1971 Dodge 413-1 RV

Joined
Oct 23, 2022
Messages
77
Location
San Diego
FSM calls for 20W-50, but that was 1971 dino fluid.
Would a modern 15W-40 synthetic protect just as well? I'll be changing before long.
60k miles, rebuilt Holley 4150 runs great and it runs WOT for ~10 minutes at a time on big hills, with manifolds glowing orange.
I have some basic 20W-50 in it now with a pint of MMO and a zinc additive for the tappets.
From what I've read here a diesel oil might be a good choice.
I have also heard that HPL BAS 10w50 is recommended.

Some might not know that the exhaust valves do not have seals - they are intended to "leak" slightly to guarantee stem lubrication under severe duty. There was actually a FSM warning builders NOT to install them.
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I would ditch the MMO. The HDEO would probably work but why not go syn? Cool Rv !
 
The oil you’ve questioned should be a great choice however the glowing manifolds are a sign of retarded engine timing and/or an extreme lean fuel condition.
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The timing is from Mopar Performance Small Block V-8 Electronic Ignition Kit and verified with a degree tape. Dizzy curve was adjusted by DynoTune.
I also installed O2 sensors and verified it is always slightly "rich" since local gas is 10% ethanol.
It takes about 10 minutes at WOT for them to noticeably glow. Someone in a Mopar forum said they were used for generators in the Pacific 24/7 and the manifolds always glowed. The water pump is 2x the size of a basic 440 and feeds the heads directly...
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The pic reminds me, there is room for a giant oil filter, what is the largest that will thread on?
 
Actually we still make a SL/CI4 plus 20w50. We have continued making that for Miss Geico - Huski as it has done a very good job for them.

David
Thanks Dave, I got your reco for the 20w50. There is a lot of threads here re 15w40 in big blocks and wondered if would be satisfactory, or be "safe" and stick with 20w50?
The 413 industrial makes 265HP@3600 and 440Tq@2200 pushing 11,000lbs, so not a real lot, it's the long grades at WOT that are different than most trucks.
 
I would ditch the MMO. The HDEO would probably work but why not go syn? Cool Rv !
I'd expect to use some version of synthetic, are no HDEOs syn? that's why I'm asking the experts!
MMO was at the reco of Rick Walker, carb rebuilder and Dodge truck division factory mechanic in the 70s-80s.
When I first bought it I used MMO and Seafoam down the carb too until the intake was clean and pistons had no carbon. I scoped them with my snake cam:
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It takes about 10 minutes at WOT for them to noticeably glow. Someone in a Mopar forum said they were used for generators in the Pacific 24/7 and the manifolds always glowed.
I've heard the same thing about Chrysler 413s used for irrigation pumps on the High Plains.

If the compression is 7.5:1, it seems like there might be plenty of room to play with advance. MSD makes an adjustable timing control with a dial that lets you adjust advance while you're driving. It requires and MSD ignition box, but it could be useful if you change elevation a lot.
 
I've heard the same thing about Chrysler 413s used for irrigation pumps on the High Plains.

If the compression is 7.5:1, it seems like there might be plenty of room to play with advance. MSD makes an adjustable timing control with a dial that lets you adjust advance while you're driving. It requires and MSD ignition box, but it could be useful if you change elevation a lot.
I'd heard there are stand-alone ignition retarders too, but I have an internal electronics dizzy so there's no way to attach. I live at 4k and travel to 7000 or so. With the low compression it does not ping until advance is wayyy past optimal so the old dial-back-from-ping is not feasible. Because of where the dizzy is I can actually rotate it while driving uphill, but I found that the change is too subtle to tell seat of the pants.
I'm not sure what altitude the Mopar Performance settings above are meant for of course - mech advance is 38 BTDC @ 2800 and 56 BTDC with vacuum as per the Mopar link. Having it fully tuned on a dyno would be nice, but it is ~$800 and not at the top of the list.
 
A modern 15w-40 has plenty of additives and a good HTHS. But you can also get full syn M1 15w-50 for $29 at walmart. So why not get that. But either trounce the crap formulations back in the 60's. And do skip the additive entirely. It's not needed.
 
What a cool motor home! I don't know about Mopar motors, only Chevy Big Blocks, but I'm guessing any 15w-40, 20w-50, 15w-50, even a 5w-40 if it gets cold when you are using it would work fine. Old school rocks!
 
What a cool motor home! I don't know about Mopar motors, only Chevy Big Blocks, but I'm guessing any 15w-40, 20w-50, 15w-50, even a 5w-40 if it gets cold when you are using it would work fine. Old school rocks!
Thanks, the work keeps me out of the bars...
I now have an 8HP70 and adapter to swap the A727 - more fun.
 
Most gasoline industrial engines of that vintage run a long life on 15w-40. We had several IH trucks on the farm with 404 or 446 gas V8's and they were tough as nails. When hauling corn those trucks were often right to the floor in soft ground, and the manifolds were glowing just like you described.

If you are looking to stay with a 50 grade product, check your local farm store for Mystik 15w-50. You can also get it at Orielly's.
 
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