Havoline 5w-20 NO oil consumption. #@$%!?
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Just press "Quote" by your post, and at the link on top of the page, change "newreply.php" to "editpost.php"
EDIT: Beat me to it, and got to prove that it works!
EDIT: Beat me to it, and got to prove that it works!
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I'd love some proof to back that up (there isn't any). Head on over to Caddyinfo.com and Cadillacowners.com and nobody will tell you they go through a quart in 400 miles.
As for poor GM design, this car has been way more reliable than either of my in-laws Toyotas (which is why they don't drive Toyotas anymore). But this is
No, Buster, it IS accurate. NO engine consumes no oil. As stated, it's just not possible. Some will use more than others...just the nature of the beast...just like some tend to sludge more than others (Toyota?). And then the home corporation insults them by saying their engine sludged up due to their lack of maintenance, even though they do 3000 mile OCIs...yeah... Oh, sorry, again I'm
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A lot of consumption may make an engine last longer, but that's only for people who check their oil frequently, which the vast, vast majority do not do. Thus for most an oil consuming engine means a seized up engine. Anyway, this is all common sense for us. But I wouldn't go around saying that an engine that can only last with religious care by the owner is a good design (the same goes for the sludgers).
Boy, I'm sorry I changed the subject in THIS thread...
For the record, the subject engine has a 7.5 quart sump, so it can use a quart or two in the 5-7k mile OCI without harming anything. There's also an oil level sensor that will alert an owner if the level DOES fall below about 5 quarts. Nobody has ever had an oiling related problem that I know of with this engine.
But anyway, my only point was that some oil consumption is not necessarily a bad thing; some of those perceptions still exist. Most 4-valve engines that like to rev high will use some oil, and my original comment was supporting the reply to Pablo that if he drove his Odyssey hard(er), that it might begin to consume oil. This isn't a bad thing, in fact, it's operating exactly as designed.
That's it. I'm sorry I got caught up in the name brand mudslinging. It's not productive.
For the record, the subject engine has a 7.5 quart sump, so it can use a quart or two in the 5-7k mile OCI without harming anything. There's also an oil level sensor that will alert an owner if the level DOES fall below about 5 quarts. Nobody has ever had an oiling related problem that I know of with this engine.
But anyway, my only point was that some oil consumption is not necessarily a bad thing; some of those perceptions still exist. Most 4-valve engines that like to rev high will use some oil, and my original comment was supporting the reply to Pablo that if he drove his Odyssey hard(er), that it might begin to consume oil. This isn't a bad thing, in fact, it's operating exactly as designed.
That's it. I'm sorry I got caught up in the name brand mudslinging. It's not productive.
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Jason don't feel bad for changing the subject. I'm actually interested in this. I agree with what you are saying as it makes perfect sense. I'm sure my car has used some amount of oil over the 4,200 miles so far.
What about people that claim they break-in the car when new by driving it very hard right off the lot and never have any oil consumption? The break it in hard method seems to work well for a lot of people. Also, what about sustained highway driving at high speeds (80 mph)?
Patman
Staff member
I'll bet if you measured how much oil comes out at oil change time vs how much oil went in at the beginning, the engine would've used at least 100ml of oil at the absolute minimum. It just doesn't show you such a small change on the dipstick, but the consumption has to be there.
On a side note, my Corvette's dipstick is strange, all along whenever I've been checking it, the level has shown the exact same and does not drop throughout the interval, but when I drain out the oil at oil change time, there is definitely a lot less coming out than what went in. I don't know an exact number yet (will know in a few weeks when I do my next oil change) but I suspect this engine is actually using about a quart every 3 or 4000 miles. But as I mentioned, oddly enough, the dipstick does not reflect this, it always shows full. (so in essence, the dipstick is useless on this car, much like the dipstick on my old 5.0 Mustang was)
[quote.....when I drain out the oil at oil change time, there is definitely a lot less coming out than what went in. I don't know an exact number yet (will know in a few weeks when I do my next oil change) but I suspect this engine is actually using about a quart every 3 or 4000 miles. But as I mentioned, oddly enough, the dipstick does not reflect this, it always shows full. (so in essence, the dipstick is useless on this car, much like the dipstick on my old 5.0 Mustang was)
Some is hung up in the oil filter, you know...that's part of the difference....
Some is hung up in the oil filter, you know...that's part of the difference....
Yeah. Although I should say it is using less oil, not that it has stopped consuming. Its overfilled less than when it started. But its like a third of what the consumption was even with durablend 10W30.
Oh, I also used a oversize filter, MC FL1A.
"Boy, I'm sorry I changed the subject in THIS thread...
For the record, the subject engine has a 7.5 quart sump, so it can use a quart or two in the 5-7k mile OCI without harming anything. There's also an oil level sensor that will alert an owner if the level DOES fall below about 5 quarts. Nobody has ever had an oiling related problem that I know of with this engine."
I didn't mean to bash the Northstar engine. I was talking about oil burners in general. The Toyota 7AFE engine is another example of an otherwise good design that burns oil. The oil level warning system is a very good idea. Did the Northstar come with this originally or did GM add it later? BTW, I'm not bashing anything nor did I mean to help take this thread off topic. I just enjoy discussing this stuff.
For the record, the subject engine has a 7.5 quart sump, so it can use a quart or two in the 5-7k mile OCI without harming anything. There's also an oil level sensor that will alert an owner if the level DOES fall below about 5 quarts. Nobody has ever had an oiling related problem that I know of with this engine."
I didn't mean to bash the Northstar engine. I was talking about oil burners in general. The Toyota 7AFE engine is another example of an otherwise good design that burns oil. The oil level warning system is a very good idea. Did the Northstar come with this originally or did GM add it later? BTW, I'm not bashing anything nor did I mean to help take this thread off topic. I just enjoy discussing this stuff.
My 2001 Corolla that I bought with 6 miles on it, burned 1qt every 2,500 miles to 3,000 miles and ran like new when I traded it in with 180,000. Now many people I know have any oil consumption at all with that engine. Didn't seem to matter. I didn't break-in the engine the right way. Put very little load on it.
My saab never seems to be low, but I have the sinking feeling that it is fuel dilution.....Although my used oil analysis didn't show as much.....I cut open a filter last night in my shop, and this morning, when I went to retrieve something from there, the place smelled like I'd spilled a gallon of gas on the floor.
Jason, not bashing GM but i know of three cases of high oil use in Northstar engines all three used at least a quart within 600 miles. I wish you good luck with your Caddy. PATMAN : you are correct it might use a little between changes , but all i can go by is the dipstick and the oil level never changes. Oil use is not a bad thing for example if you use a quart in 1,500 miles you can extend your oil change intervals , but if it gets to high you wont pass your state emissions test. Two of these Caddys had to be taken of the road because they failed state emissions test.
Patman
Staff member
The oil filter in my Corvette is small, and only holds maybe a half quart at most. When I fill it at oil change time I put in 7L of oil, and when I drained it out at the end of my last interval (which was 8000 miles) I noticed that only approximately 5L came out.
Well, 1 qt in 600 miles is certainly excessive...there was obviously something wrong internally. GM's own spec, what some call pretty liberal, is 1 qt in 1000 miles...so they were WAY below that. Most people complain when they find out their Northstar engine uses a quart in 2000 miles, because their small block Chevy never did that. We always explain that a small amount of oil consumption is "good" for the engine. A quart or two of "top off" during each OCI is greatly beneficial to the engine. And like in the Corvette, the large sump in the Northstar is to prevent oil loss at 1G of cornering. That is, you can turn the engine 45* in any direction and the pickup will still be under oil. So even a few quarts during an OCI won't hurt the engine because even on the dyno stands, the engines can run at WOT continuously with only 5 quarts...so no normal Cadillac driver will ever approach that dangerous threashold.
I broke in my 05 1ZZFE per the book (no more than 4k for the 1st 1k miles and keep changing the RPM) but bought it with 250 miles on it (it was a dealer trade and all those miles were some lot boy/salesman driving it from ID to UT)
I'm using about 8-10oz every 4k miles so that makes it 1 qt per 10-12k miles at 75k miles.
The engine is known to use oil. My engine is at 2900-3000 rpm for almost 2 hours each day. So in 75k miles my engine has turned over 13,500,000,000 times so far!
It should use some oil....
Buster, what oil did you use with your 2001?
Take care, bill
Patman
Staff member
Bill, I think the easier question to ask Buster is what oil he DIDN'T try in that car!!
Sorry, didn't type in the correct place: I meant to write:
Well, of course it's not THAT much difference! That is significant!
Well, of course it's not THAT much difference! That is significant!
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