Have you tried friction modifiers in your engine oil?

Fredxt

Fredxt

Joined
May 9, 2023
Messages
210
Location
San Diego
Hey,
I am looking at a couple friction modifiers to use in my Honda K27Z7 (CRv 2014). Currently it get ~32mpg in highway which is better than the factory spec (on a 100mi loop).
I found this specs for a company named Vanderbilt Chemicals:
Not sure where this product can be found?
(Not a dealer of any company or so, if your opinion is all additives are snake oil please keep it to yourself)
 
Those appear to be meant for use in blending a final product in conjunction with other additives. Not as a standalone 'pour-in' additive.

You can't just dump it in and expect things to be 'better'. It might clash with another additive, or cause something else in the oil to not work as well.
 
Fredxt said:
Hey,
I am looking at a couple friction modifiers to use in my Honda K27Z7 (CRv 2014). Currently it get ~32mpg in highway which is better than the factory spec (on a 100mi loop).
I found this specs for a company named Vanderbilt Chemicals:
Not sure where this product can be found?
(Not a dealer of any company or so, if your opinion is all additives are snake oil please keep it to yourself)
Click to expand...
Don't bother. The only one I would ever consider for that purpose is LiquiMoly MoS2.

P.S. I know you meant K24Z7, but due to your typo I am here now fantasizing about a K24 being stroked out to a 2.7L size, thus making it a K27 sorta... Strokers usually have great midrange torque, which would be greatly appreciated by nearly every CR-V and Element owner out there. Then (if rods are beefed up enough) the i-VTEC could keep the high RPMs usable too... Then slap a turbo on that stroker... Ahhh the things I would do if I had a few thousand dollars laying around... Anyways, back to the poor reality with endless inflation.
 
Fredxt said:
Hey,
I am looking at a couple friction modifiers to use in my Honda K27Z7 (CRv 2014). Currently it get ~32mpg in highway which is better than the factory spec (on a 100mi loop).
I found this specs for a company named Vanderbilt Chemicals:
Not sure where this product can be found?
(Not a dealer of any company or so, if your opinion is all additives are snake oil please keep it to yourself)
Click to expand...
Modern formulated oils already have friction modifiers in them.

The term "friction modifier" encompasses a number of areas such as friction increasers, friction reducers, and friction modifiers.

rtvandrbilt supplies many of the individual chemistrys' for oil additive companies. Unless you are a formulator or an oil additive manf. I doubt you can purchase them.

In this Forum called OTC and Third Party Oil Additives OTC means "over-the-counter" and third party means certain specific additives are sold outside of a formulator's or additive manf. purview. LiquiMoly MoS2 and others fall into this forum's category.

Oil additive manf. and formulator's spend a lot of times testing their formulations, something OTC and Third Party Oil Additives companies do not do.
 
They claim that an oil with their additive reduces fuel consumption in the test used in API SP by 1%. So, in a best case scenario, when compared against an oil that just barely meets the API standard, you'll get a 1% improvement, which might save you about $10 in fuel over a 10,000 km OCI.

That's assuming it does much at all when mixed with an oil that already contains friction modifier. Any benefit would be too small to measure outside of a laboratory, so you'd never even know if the product worked or not.
 
Let's say car burns 10L per 100km, within 10000km it'd burn 1000L. 1% is 10L and with gas price $1.70/L that'd be $17.
I use Ceratec and have gone from 9.4L/100km to 8.9L/100km driving same route to and from work, it's worth it in my case, esp if Ceratec lasts 30k km while it should last longer.
 
dubber09 said:
Let's say car burns 10L per 100km, within 10000km it'd burn 1000L. 1% is 10L and with gas price $1.70/L that'd be $17.
I use Ceratec and have gone from 9.4L/100km to 8.9L/100km driving same route to and from work, it's worth it in my case, esp if Ceratec lasts 30k km while it should last longer.
Click to expand...
You can never, ever attribute an observed change like that to one isolated variable in everyday driving. Way too many uncontrolled variables. BTU variances in fuel are enough to skew everything.
 
kschachn said:
You can never, ever attribute an observed change like that to one isolated variable in everyday driving. Way too many uncontrolled variables. BTU variances in fuel are enough to skew everything.
Click to expand...
That is 25 to 26.4 MPG, which is actually very well measurable if your car has mpg averaging on dash. Drive 50 mile loop midnight highway at 60mph and it will well converge with less than 1mpg accuracy.
 
I didn't need to go on a hwy, driving to and from same office last 4 years, got good stats :cool:
Another thing is engine wear, if it extends engine life it's worth it.
 
dubber09 said:
I didn't need to go on a hwy, driving to and from same office last 4 years, got good stats :cool:
Another thing is engine wear, if it extends engine life it's worth it.
Click to expand...
I can tell you one more thing that increase mpg by 1 or so. It's clean-boost-maxx, a combustion improver. Mix 1oz in 15 gal gas (2x dose) with 1 oz of LX4. This is my current homemade UCL for about 2$ per shot, after I sopped paying amsoil 5$ per bottle of UCL :D
 
Let me tell you something guys. One I saw this product cannot be found, I used another one that is off the shelf. I contacted the company and asked for Safety datasheet and whether their product contains chlorinated paraffins. They provided the first but did not comment on their formulation. Now, I will obtain some chlorine test kit and will test the crankcase oil to see if there is chlorine in it:

Clor-D-Tect® Q4000 - Dexsil

Clor-D-Tect Q4000 is a proven test to measure chlorine in crankcase oil, hydraulic oil, diesel fuel, lubricating oils, and virtually any hydrocarbon based solvent.
www.dexsil.com www.dexsil.com
should be able to detect up to 4000ppm which is bad enough to make the call.
 
If you know any UOA company that does chlorine test please let me know, I would prefer them do it than me :D
 
kschachn said:
I didn’t say it wasn’t measurable.

Understand, right?
Click to expand...
Yes, you said it cannot be attribute to one factor and I just told you how to measure it in 1 trip. If you use the same gas (same station, same batch), drive on the same road, 2 consequtive nights, yes it can be measured and attributes to 1 change (e.g. oil, gas, whatever). Maybe my first answer was not complete, so, please consider this one sir.
 
Fredxt said:
Yes, you said it cannot be attribute to one factor and I just told you how to measure it in 1 trip. If you use the same gas (same station, same batch), drive on the same road, 2 consequtive nights, yes it can be measured and attributes to 1 change (e.g. oil, gas, whatever). Maybe my first answer was not complete, so, please consider this one sir.
Click to expand...
Okay. Still can't be done. Same gas station is irrelevant, I once linked an article showing that even at the same gas station the energy density of the gasoline varied about 4%. To have any hope of measuring real-world fuel economy you must start with standardized test fuel and run over a closed course with trained drivers at the same time of day. Even then it's a stretch.

Here is a discussion on such measurements by someone who knows what he's talking about. It's about gasoline but still the same variables.

Best Brand of Gasoline

Get all my Premium at Sam's Club. Other places around here are 40-50 cents more expensive than Sam's Club premium, making it well worth driving a couple extra miles to fill it up. Get my 87 wherever it's convenient.
bobistheoilguy.com
 
kschachn said:
Okay. Still can't be done. Same gas station is irrelevant, I once linked an article showing that even at the same gas station the energy density of the gasoline varied about 4%. To have any hope of measuring real-world fuel economy you must start with standardized test fuel and run over a closed course with trained drivers at the same time of day. Even then it's a stretch.

Here is a discussion on such measurements by someone who knows what he's talking about. It's about gasoline but still the same variables.

Best Brand of Gasoline

Get all my Premium at Sam's Club. Other places around here are 40-50 cents more expensive than Sam's Club premium, making it well worth driving a couple extra miles to fill it up. Get my 87 wherever it's convenient.
bobistheoilguy.com
Click to expand...
OK, it's even easier than that. Fill the tank, Take 1 50 mile loop, add the snake oil and then take 50 mile look again. Same road, same gas, same night, same driver, same speed, same tier, same weather. Also, reset the averaging once you are on the highway and read before you leave, that eliminates any city driving effect. End of discussion?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

I
Down the Gear Oil rabbit hole again: for Eaton Torsen “upgrade”
2
Replies
22
Views
4K
Impatient
3
Synthetic oil bad in a lawnmower? Any truth in this self proclaimed experts statements?
10 11 12
Replies
221
Views
58K
weldor
wwillson
  • Locked
Shell Rotella Gas Truck synthetic engine oil Q&A - Answers
Replies
18
Views
56K
SlavaB
MolaKule
  • Locked
Manual Transmission Fluids - Updated
Replies
13
Views
11K
MolaKule
E
  • Locked
Import Motor Oil Specifications
Replies
5
Views
4K
weasley
Back
Top