GTL base oil synthesis

[thickvthin]

In a post by Molakule, on GTL base oil synthesis he wrote (i have to figure out how to link it directly):
"The resulting synthetic GTL liquid base oil may have a viscosity range of from 2 cSt to 50 cSt, with the preferable range being 3.5 cSt to 30cSt. The viscosity index averages 130, for example, for a 4 cSt oil. The pour points average about -45C."
The thread is close and I happen to stumble upon it this week. After reading I was wondering :
1. Is it easier and cheaper to syntesize 50 cst GTL than 2 cst.?
2. Any quick guesses at pour point of 2cst, 6cst, 10cst, 30ct and 50cst?
3. At some cSt, does GTL become cheaper to synthesize than Group II or III?

Thanks in advance.

 

[thickvthin]

oh and VI of say 2, 6, 10, 30, 50 cSt base oils. thanks.

 

[Brian123]

In a post by Molakule, on GTL base oil synthesis he wrote (i have to figure out how to link it directly):

No Need!

"The resulting synthetic GTL liquid base oil may have a viscosity range of from 2 cSt to 50 cSt, with the preferable range being 3.5 cSt to 30cSt.

Overthinking!

The viscosity index averages 130, for example, for a 4 cSt oil. The pour points average about -45C."

Overthinking Again!

The thread is close and I happen to stumble upon it this week.

The Thread is closed for various reasons!

1. Is it easier and cheaper to syntesize 50 cst GTL than 2 cst.?
2. Any quick guesses at pour point of 2cst, 6cst, 10cst, 30ct and 50cst?
3. At some cSt, does GTL become cheaper to synthesize than Group II or III?

If you are doing a 5000-mile OCI use Valvoline Restore and Protect 5W-30
If you are going beyond a 5000-mile OCI then you can use these 2 oils:

1) HPL
2) AMSOIL Signature Series

I would like to give Mobil 1 ESP a shot in this discussion but beyond 5000 miles on this oil you better get a used oil analysis! To answer your 3 questions, I have no answer, the 3 oil's I mentioned you can use without asking a bunch of questions.

 

[thickvthin]

No Need!

Overthinking!

Overthinking Again!

The Thread is closed for various reasons!

If you are doing a 5000-mile OCI use Valvoline Restore and Protect 5W-30
If you are going beyond a 5000-mile OCI then you can use these 2 oils:

1) HPL
2) AMSOIL Signature Series

I would like to give Mobil 1 ESP a shot in this discussion but beyond 5000 miles on this oil you better get a used oil analysis! To answer your 3 questions, I have no answer, the 3 oil's I mentioned you can use without asking a bunch of questions.

u r perhaps underthinking jk. not a thread re brands but appreciate the 3 oils suggested.

 

[kschachn]

@MolaKule

 

[Brian123]

u r perhaps underthinking jk.

I used to overthink and it was not worth overthinking!

. not a thread re brands but appreciate the 3 oils suggested.

Unless you have the expertise to make a motor oil, the 3 oil's I mentioned will serve you well.
On this Forum we have a few members, and I have done this, we overthink stuff about motor oil.
I am looking at Zinc, Phos, HTHS Number, and looking at the SDS and PDS, as well as the numbers at 40C and 100C, it does not matter, but I think it does, but I cannot prove it.
The finished product is the most important thing for a motor oil, but I am still looking at the HTHS Number and other things, but not with Valvoline Restore and Protect 5W-30!

 

[thickvthin]

I used to overthink and it was not worth overthinking!

Unless you have the expertise to make a motor oil, the 3 oil's I mentioned will serve you well.
On this Forum we have a few members, and I have done this, we overthink stuff about motor oil.
I am looking at Zinc, Phos, HTHS Number, and looking at the SDS and PDS, as well as the numbers at 40C and 100C, it does not matter, but I think it does, but I cannot prove it.
The finished product is the most important thing for a motor oil, but I am still looking at the HTHS Number and other things, but not with Valvoline Restore and Protect 5W-30!

not interested in blending. just interested in general knowledge.

 

[MolaKule]

1. Is it easier and cheaper to syntesize 50 cst GTL than 2 cst.?

No because the resulting stream is continuous; various parameters are altered to arrive at a specific viscosity.

2. Any quick guesses at pour point of 2cst, 6cst, 10cst, 30ct and 50cst?

No. It only matters when formulating.

3. At some cSt, does GTL become cheaper to synthesize than Group II or III?

Thanks in advance.

Group II is not synthesized to any degree. GTL is slightly more expensive than other Group III's.

 

[MolaKule]

@thickvthin Here is the White Paper on GTL:

Thread 'GTL Base Oil Synthesis'

Jun 1, 2023

The GTL Group III+ Base Oil Synthesis Process (A Summary derived from various Patents)
by MolaKule​

The Gas-to-Liquid process is executed primarily by using a Fisher-Tropsch process

https://www.netl.doe.gov/research/c...-systems/gasification/gasifipedia/ftsynthesis

whereby a mixture of Carbon monoxide CO and Hydrogen H2 gases are catalytically converted into liquid hydrocarbons, in a mole ratio of approximately 0.7 to 2.5. (A catalyst is a substance that increases the rate of a chemical reaction without itself undergoing any...

• MolaKule
• Replies: 16
• Forum: White Papers and Technical Discussions

• 
• 
• 

 

[thickvthin]

No because the resulting stream is continuous; various parameters are altered to arrive at a specific viscosity.

No. It only matters when formulating.

Group II is not synthesized to any degree. GTL is slightly more expensive than other Group III's.

thanks

 

[4wd]

Much of it goes to fuel anyway …

 

[CleanSump]

If you are doing a 5000-mile OCI use Valvoline Restore and Protect 5W-30
If you are going beyond a 5000-mile OCI then you can use these 2 oils:...

Wrong. Valvoline states the OEM recommended OCI.
https://www.valvolineglobal.com/en/restore-and-protect/

Only the Valvolene Instant Oil Change chain advertising says 5k.

 

[OVERKILL]

Group II is not synthesized to any degree. GTL is slightly more expensive than other Group III's.

What about Mobil's EHC Group "II+" bases, that are ALMOST Group III, but not quite. From what I recall, they are still hydrocracked, so would they not be a "synthetic" Group II?

 

[GI_GRIFF]

The finished product is the most important thing for a motor oil, but I am still looking at the HTHS Number and other things, but not with Valvoline Restore and Protect 5W-30!

The Valvoline Restore and Protect is pretty amazing stuff; they have something figured out that the others haven't figured out for the money anyhow. You are right though about the oci, however Valvoline doesn't market it as a long drain engine oil.

 

[SammyChevelleTypeS3]

Seems to me that the GTL motor oil from Pennzoil would be a great one to use in attempts to ward off engine gunk that has been reported seen when using some other oils. In conjunction of course with limited oci of no more than 3000 to 5000 mi depending on service seen. Yet I am surprised that we do not see much if any comments about folks using this oil. Especially with the very decent off the shelf prices & availability. Is it just because people are satisfied with the so very many other proven oils already out there?

 

[Japanese]

Seems to me that the GTL motor oil from Pennzoil would be a great one to use in attempts to ward off engine gunk that has been reported seen when using some other oils.

Pennzoil GTL oils are definitely quality oils at a good price (I haven't used any, yet) and they may keep the engine clean.
However, they are not proven to clean dirty engines with already sludge and varnish, and specifically stuck piston oil rings.
There are a few oils that are proven at that and people prefer those.

 

[GI_GRIFF]

Seems to me that the GTL motor oil from Pennzoil would be a great one to use in attempts to ward off engine gunk that has been reported seen when using some other oils. In conjunction of course with limited oci of no more than 3000 to 5000 mi depending on service seen. Yet I am surprised that we do not see much if any comments about folks using this oil. Especially with the very decent off the shelf prices & availability. Is it just because people are satisfied with the so very many other proven oils already out there?

I have thought about this myself. With the Pennzoil low NOACK numbers and as you said decent prices you are right. The Valvoline Restore and Protect is a big deal now; it is Valvoline's premium gas burner engine oil and can be run from the day the car is brand new. It is the best they offer but not a long drain interval oil, however. The cost is not much more than the other brand name Walmart shelf oils. Also, the Mobil 1 ESP 0W-30 is a big oil here for good reason. It has the European specs., the ACEA C3 rating that gives it the >3.5 HTHS. People that realize what that means like it, unless they are after that 1/10 of 1 mpg fuel milage increase you may or may not get by using a lesser oil. Anyhow, Pennzoil also make an oil with those European Specs. with the same GTL as the Pennzoil Ultra, it is called

Pennzoil Platinum Euro LX Full Synthetic 0W-30 Motor Oil.​

You are not going to find it on the Walmart shelves, however. I have ordered it from Amazon in the past.

 

[Dave P.]

"Yet I am surprised that we do not see much if any comments about folks using this oil."
I've used a lot of Pennzoil oil over the 50 years I've been driving. Everything from conventional with Z-7 in cardboard cans, Pennzoil Turbo which was a Consumer Reports darling when they did their big NYC Taxi study, Pennzoil Performax with Pennzane (used in the space program so it had to be good here on earth!) and now Pennzoil Pure Plus GTL products.
Would my car have gotten to 340,000 miles if I were using Castrol or Mobil 1 or Valvoline or Amsoil? Yeah, most likely.
I've always gravitated to Pennzoil because of their support of many forms of auto racing from Eddie Hill in Top Fuel NHRA, Rick Mears, Teo Fabi in Indy Car, Jerry Eckman in Pro Stock NHRA, The Wild Child in WoO sprint cars and now with Penske in NASCAR. To me, the Pennzoil cars always stood out.

 

[MolaKule]

What about Mobil's EHC Group "II+" bases, that are ALMOST Group III, but not quite. From what I recall, they are still hydrocracked, so would they not be a "synthetic" Group II?

I don't think so. The + to me only indicates a few additional hydroprocessing steps, with a slightly better VI, and slightly more saturation, which results in additional oxidation resistance.

https://www.stle.org/images/pdf/STLE_ORG/BOK/OM_OA/Base Oils/Base Oil Groups_Manufacture_Prop_Perform_April15 TLT.pdf

https://functionalproducts.com/wp-content/uploads/2026/02/Canton-Base-Oils-Talk-v5.pdf

 

[kschachn]

What about Mobil's EHC Group "II+" bases, that are ALMOST Group III, but not quite. From what I recall, they are still hydrocracked, so would they not be a "synthetic" Group II?

You could have a hydrocracked Group II, just as you could have a hydrocracked Group I. The group designations specifically exclude the method of manufacture, especially Groups I-III. So yes, you could have a synthetic Group II all day long since the group designations are determined by performance only.

I’m only saying you could, I’m not saying you do. Crazy world where you’d have a synthetic Group I based oil