GM dealer must install headlights?

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Our shop rate is $140/hr and we are on the low end for our area. I wonder if the parts person was either trying to be nice and tell you the install was rather complicated, or maybe implying that they would have to be aimed after installation. Whenever I sell a headlamp bulb I give people the warning about never touching the glass. Also on models I know that you have to take the front bumper cover off, I try to tell people ahead of time and print out the instructions from the shop manual. Amazing how some people are really stoked when I do that, while others are really annoyed and act like I am insulting them.
 
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Originally Posted by nthach
HID lights have all sorts of warning labels to keep most people away.
Truth. In reality, they're not bad. The "WARNING HIGH VOLTAGE" Plastered everywhere for HID's does make one pause.
 
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Originally Posted by Skippy722
Originally Posted by nthach
HID lights have all sorts of warning labels to keep most people away.
Truth. In reality, they're not bad. The "WARNING HIGH VOLTAGE" Plastered everywhere for HID's does make one pause.
It is really there for lawsuits. Btw SOME of the new vehicles you DO have to let the dealer install them, they have modules on them that are actually programmed by the vehicle ECU once installed to *do* the fancy LED stuff, often tied into the same circut as the lower fogs/signal lights, it's all one big system with data lines to ECU.......pulls hair out.
 
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Rockauto's start at $60cdn each. No dealer installation required:

Capture.JPG
 
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irv

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Originally Posted by tcp71
Rockauto's start at $60cdn each. No dealer installation required:
I just checked them out and the ones I need are $110, which are shown in your link. Shipping is just under $25 but I didn't check to see if that would be for both or each. So far the best price but I am curious if the are true OEM's as shown? If I continue to have no luck trying to get some elsewhere, then, so far, I'll use Rock Auto. Thanks for the info! cheers
 
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Originally Posted by Skippy722
Originally Posted by nthach
HID lights have all sorts of warning labels to keep most people away.
Truth. In reality, they're not bad. The "WARNING HIGH VOLTAGE" Plastered everywhere for HID's does make one pause.
^^^^^^^^^^ Right on... My car has HIDs... And what is mentioned here is right.
 
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Originally Posted by Vern_in_IL
Originally Posted by Skippy722
Originally Posted by nthach
HID lights have all sorts of warning labels to keep most people away.
Truth. In reality, they're not bad. The "WARNING HIGH VOLTAGE" Plastered everywhere for HID's does make one pause.
It is really there for lawsuits. Btw SOME of the new vehicles you DO have to let the dealer install them, they have modules on them that are actually programmed by the vehicle ECU once installed to *do* the fancy LED stuff, often tied into the same circut as the lower fogs/signal lights, it's all one big system with data lines to ECU.......pulls hair out.
Over on the durango forums/Durango pages on FB someone had their autoleveling system freak out. It was trying to correct for bumps and dips in the road, but it was about a second behind so they were just bouncing around like crazy. I had one of mine stick once when it was -15F once... just the passenger side till it got enough heat in it then it made a loud popping noise and it came back up. Nothing to make you more alert while driving home from at 3am than a loud noise like that!
 
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Originally Posted by Vern_in_IL
It is really there for lawsuits. Btw SOME of the new vehicles you DO have to let the dealer install them, they have modules on them that are actually programmed by the vehicle ECU once installed to *do* the fancy LED stuff, often tied into the same circut as the lower fogs/signal lights, it's all one big system with data lines to ECU.......pulls hair out.
My parent's Lexus has adaptive front headlights, which in this case is a bi-xenon projector mounted on a gimbal which allows the left headlight to tilt up to -15 degrees (turning left) and the right headlight to tilt 5 degrees(turning right) and there's a leveling feature to keep the HIDs from dazzling oncoming traffic(required by EU regulations, not so much by DOT). You can see the headlights dip up and down when they are first turned on to check the motion on the y-axis. The system relies on the steering angle sensor, suspension level sensor and an ECU. On newer cars with multi-LED array headlights like on newer Audis, Benzes and some Lexus models with triple-beam LED headlamps, the AFS function can be done by switching off an LED or two, or what Audi calls a "pixel".
 
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Originally Posted by bdcardinal
Our shop rate is $140/hr and we are on the low end for our area. I wonder if the parts person was either trying to be nice and tell you the install was rather complicated, or maybe implying that they would have to be aimed after installation. Whenever I sell a headlamp bulb I give people the warning about never touching the glass. Also on models I know that you have to take the front bumper cover off, I try to tell people ahead of time and print out the instructions from the shop manual. Amazing how some people are really stoked when I do that, while others are really annoyed and act like I am insulting them.
That's awful nice of you to do that, seriously
 
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Originally Posted by JetStar
That's awful nice of you to do that, seriously
I try to not be the generic parts counter person that everyone on here complains about. I mostly do back counter so I am dealing with technicians most of the time. Whenever I do front counter I either get people who are super happy when they barely get out the part they want and I wander off to pull it off the shelf, or people who complain that I don't do small talk and are upset that I get their part at a good price and don't want to talk about the cars they had 40 years ago.
 
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I would be quite pleased to get free factory manual pages printed for me, even if I didn't really need them. I try to be very pleasant with the dealer parts counter guy, because I know a discount could be in there, if he so chooses/is able. Back to the OP's original topic, aftermarket headlight assemblies vary in the quality of the reflector geometry, which is critical for a good beam pattern, and matching beam patterns left & right. I'm not condemning all of them, and it's quite possible an aftermarket assembly listed for $50 and another listed for $100 come from the same factory in China. However some really are awful, some are passable, some are quiet good. Your best reference there would be other owners posting to that topic in your vehicle's forum, such threads probably already exist. Lacking that info, I pay a little extra for headlight assemblies that have the bodyshop association certifications on them such as NSF and/or CAPA. For the paranoid, if I get an accident blamed on me and my equipment, I can always say "hey the parts are CERTIFIED." But the real reason I buy certified headlight assemblies, is I think I get a better beam pattern out of them then the cheapest models.
 
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Originally Posted by nthach
Originally Posted by Vern_in_IL
It is really there for lawsuits. Btw SOME of the new vehicles you DO have to let the dealer install them, they have modules on them that are actually programmed by the vehicle ECU once installed to *do* the fancy LED stuff, often tied into the same circut as the lower fogs/signal lights, it's all one big system with data lines to ECU.......pulls hair out.
My parent's Lexus has adaptive front headlights, which in this case is a bi-xenon projector mounted on a gimbal which allows the left headlight to tilt up to -15 degrees (turning left) and the right headlight to tilt 5 degrees(turning right) and there's a leveling feature to keep the HIDs from dazzling oncoming traffic(required by EU regulations, not so much by DOT). You can see the headlights dip up and down when they are first turned on to check the motion on the y-axis. The system relies on the steering angle sensor, suspension level sensor and an ECU. On newer cars with multi-LED array headlights like on newer Audis, Benzes and some Lexus models with triple-beam LED headlamps, the AFS function can be done by switching off an LED or two, or what Audi calls a "pixel".
Interesting. I read that Mercedes does 12 degrees, both sides. When you first turn them on, they do swivel from side to side by what appears to be an equal amount. Only way to really notice it while driving is to turn the steering wheel while driving in a parking lot at night. Otherwise, you kinda just notice that the road is illuminated instead of the guard rail when you're driving on a curve at night. Also it's nice to have the sticker on there, it's one way to tell when buying a used car whether it has bixenons or not.
 
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Maybe I'm just old and out of date but the last time I changed a headlamp it cost me something like $13 and took 15 minutes. This talk of $100 a bulb and programming the ECWhat is making me dizzy. What the he!! has happened to this world. $100 a bulb....are we moving backwards?
 
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I will say one thing. I agree that some of this certainly seems to be moving backwards, but another aspect is that I've changed a lot less bulbs than I have in the past. The biggest step backwards, if you ask me, was the abandonment of sealed beams. However, once that was over with, might as well go all the way and bring in the best bulb technology, at least. With the taxis, having to have a few headlights in stock, not to mention boxes and boxes of marker, signal, and brake lamps in stock.... They certainly didn't last.
 
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Originally Posted by Garak
I will say one thing. I agree that some of this certainly seems to be moving backwards, but another aspect is that I've changed a lot less bulbs than I have in the past. The biggest step backwards, if you ask me, was the abandonment of sealed beams. However, once that was over with, might as well go all the way and bring in the best bulb technology, at least. With the taxis, having to have a few headlights in stock, not to mention boxes and boxes of marker, signal, and brake lamps in stock.... They certainly didn't last.
I would want LEDs everywhere except headlights. It might be nice to mimic a filament bulb taking 1/10 second to light and dim on a turn signal, which could be done. But for headlights, I want some halogens. Automatic 100 Color Rendition Index. Automatic heat available for de-icing. And it's a simple process when I hit the high beam paddle for flash-to-pass, and I'm not warming up some ballast or whatever like with HID.
 
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I'm still on the original bulbs on my 2008 E350. They went to LED in 2014 so in theory they should be lifetime. The bulbs are about $50 each, but if you go to the dealer, they can easily be $200-$300 to change one bulb. I'm tempted to change them out, but they're not that easy to do so I'll wait. No programming needed on just changing a bulb. And yes, the bixenons come with headlamp washers and the windshield washer fluid is heated. And the flash to pass has a separate set of halogen bulbs for when you use the flash to pass feature, you don't have to wait for the shutter to move.
 
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Originally Posted by eljefino
Originally Posted by Garak
I will say one thing. I agree that some of this certainly seems to be moving backwards, but another aspect is that I've changed a lot less bulbs than I have in the past. The biggest step backwards, if you ask me, was the abandonment of sealed beams. However, once that was over with, might as well go all the way and bring in the best bulb technology, at least. With the taxis, having to have a few headlights in stock, not to mention boxes and boxes of marker, signal, and brake lamps in stock.... They certainly didn't last.
I would want LEDs everywhere except headlights. It might be nice to mimic a filament bulb taking 1/10 second to light and dim on a turn signal, which could be done. But for headlights, I want some halogens. Automatic 100 Color Rendition Index. Automatic heat available for de-icing. And it's a simple process when I hit the high beam paddle for flash-to-pass, and I'm not warming up some ballast or whatever like with HID.
Projector halogens suffer the same issue, at least in my own experience, the same icing/snow covered issues that LED's do. The 100 CRI is incredibly nice though, and I find my halogens pinch through fog and snow better than my HID's on another vehicle. As for hid warm up... factory ones warm up incredibly fast, less than 5 seconds to full brightness even in absolutely frigid temperatures.
 
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Originally Posted by Skippy722
Originally Posted by eljefino
Originally Posted by Garak
I will say one thing. I agree that some of this certainly seems to be moving backwards, but another aspect is that I've changed a lot less bulbs than I have in the past. The biggest step backwards, if you ask me, was the abandonment of sealed beams. However, once that was over with, might as well go all the way and bring in the best bulb technology, at least. With the taxis, having to have a few headlights in stock, not to mention boxes and boxes of marker, signal, and brake lamps in stock.... They certainly didn't last.
I would want LEDs everywhere except headlights. It might be nice to mimic a filament bulb taking 1/10 second to light and dim on a turn signal, which could be done. But for headlights, I want some halogens. Automatic 100 Color Rendition Index. Automatic heat available for de-icing. And it's a simple process when I hit the high beam paddle for flash-to-pass, and I'm not warming up some ballast or whatever like with HID.
Projector halogens suffer the same issue, at least in my own experience, the same icing/snow covered issues that LED's do. The 100 CRI is incredibly nice though, and I find my halogens pinch through fog and snow better than my HID's on another vehicle. As for hid warm up... factory ones warm up incredibly fast, less than 5 seconds to full brightness even in absolutely frigid temperatures.
That's why you need heated windshield washer fluid with headlamp washers. HID's also tend to scatter the light when dirty so it's good to have the headlamp washers. Only used mine a few times during a storm. Some people complain that the spray ends up on your hood, but when the weather's bad, it's going to be covered in snow/rain anyway.
 
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