Getting More Old Oil Out When Doing a Change

Astro14

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No offense taken. I was just trying to help the OP understand what would, and would not, work in his quest to change the oil more completely.

So, back to his problem, you and I agree - you can't get all of the old oil out, and the engine will run just fine, and last a long time, with a drain and fill and a new filter. Some engines are helped a bit by an oil extractor. Some are not (they really don't work on my Tundra or Mercedes, for example).

As far as transmission drain plugs - yeah, domestics gave up on them a while back. In the current fleet, I've got two NAG-1 (drainplugs), three AW-55s (drainplugs) an A750 (drain plug, but the fill plug is a complete PITA) and two manuals, both with drain plugs.

The AW-55s are the most problematic. The filter is internal, and it can't be replaced without removing the transmission and splitting the cases. I've added an external filter to those.

But hey, at least there is a drain plug, and a magnetic one at that, from the factory.
 

Astro14

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If it was designed that way it isn't an issue. New oil will replenish the additives in the old oil.
Agreed. That engine is known for a long life. So, I wouldn't sweat it. Nothing can really be done in his case to change the percentage of old oil remaining. If he hadn't looked it up, he would have never known...
 
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To the OP, I had a 2017 Camry 4 cylinder. What you're worrying about is just not worth it. If it was, Toyota engineers would have designed the engine differently.
 
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If you leave it on ramps and let it drain overnight it should get some more out.
 
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If he hadn't looked it up, he would have never known...
Exactly... Now I don't know if the OP has owned it from new or only a few years, but I know it's not new to him. This travesty of 1+ quarts of old, dirty, horrible oil being left in the engine hasn't been a problem before.
 

SammyChevelleTypeS3

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No offense taken. I was just trying to help the OP understand what would, and would not, work in his quest to change the oil more completely.

But hey, at least there is a drain plug, and a magnetic one at that, from the factory.
I see you are a fan of the Volvo. Me too. If I had not put so much time , money and energy into my GMC / Chevy / Olds classics I would have gotten around to owning a Volvo. I was always told wife how much I liked them, especially the S60 and S80 models. Oh well some things not meant to be. I already got the urge for another classic, less than 24 months after selling my last one. Probably going for a mid 80s to mid 90s Pontiac Formula this time. That is just another from a long list I have always had the itch to own and drive.
 
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When the motor is cooled off, use a fluid pump and siphon 1 quart out the dipstick tube, add extra quart, circulate, then proceed to do your oil change. After it cools, I do add 8 to 12 ounces of oil to push the residual out of the oil pan. I try to avoid adding oil to a hot engine, been told you could crack the head, have never experienced that though to be any kind of an expert.
 
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Four pages of yapping, but I have NEVER had an engine retain 1.5 qts
during an oil change unless I was performing the OC improperly. NEVER.

This needs to be addressed first. I could understand 0.5 qt but not 1.5qt Shel_B experienced.
The fill qty in the OM accounts for oil left in the engine and filter capacity. In a shop manual you will see the absolute capacity
of a new, dry engine.
 
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Four pages of yapping, but I have NEVER had an engine retain 1.5 qts
during an oil change unless I was performing the OC improperly. NEVER.

This needs to be addressed first. I could understand 0.5 qt but not 1.5qt Shel_B experienced.
The fill qty in the OM accounts for oil left in the engine and filter capacity. In a shop manual you will see the absolute capacity
of a new, dry engine.
Apparently this engine can. No idea why, and I have to say, I'm in no rush to tear mine apart to find out why. Shel_B showed a snip of the manual, so it seems real.

I do know I dump in 5 quarts into mine; unfortunately I don't accurately measure what comes out. It fills up a 5 quart bottle so it's "around" that being drained, minus whatever is lost to oil filter (cartridge though) and the half-roll of paper towels that I seem to kill on every oil change.
 
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I have the same car and same engine. My oil after my recent change is as hard to see on the stick as it was 150 miles ago when I changed it. I wouldn’t worry about the 1.5 quarts.
 

Shel_B

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Apparently this engine can. No idea why, and I have to say, I'm in no rush to tear mine apart to find out why. Shel_B showed a snip of the manual, so it seems real.
I have looked into this a bit, and there are numerous engines that have a substantially greater dry fill than service fill. Some Porsche engines have a difference of several quarts ... here are a couple more Toyotas:

Engine
Land Cruiser 5.7 V8 4WD (USA) URJ200
Capacity7 L (Service fill), 8,4 L (Dry fill), Filter capacity 0,4 L

Engine
Land Cruiser 5.7 V8 4WD (USA) URJ200
Capacity7,5 L (Service fill green dipstick), 9,3 L (Dry fill green dipstick),

7 L (Service fill blue dipstick), 8,4 L (Dry fill blue dipstick)
 
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I have looked into this a bit, and there are numerous engines that have a substantially greater dry fill than service fill. Some Porsche engines have a difference of several quarts ... here are a couple more Toyotas:
But on your service fill the volume drained should be roughly = the volume stated in the manual for an oil change = the volume you will replace ... if the dipstick was reading near the full mark.

We never use the dry fill for an typical OCI as we (hopefully) haven't just remanned the engine.

The purpose of an OC is to get a goodly % of unused oil into the sump. Not to evacuate the last cc or litre of used oil.

When I was younger using low specification lubricants, I used to do a "annual refresh" fill where I would do an intermediate OC with a bargain clearance oil, then approximately a week later, change it again - all in an effort to do a "deep clean" The engines of that era seemed to respond well to this.

I cannot recommend this practice now - except on maybe some abused and neglected ODPE that only take 28 oz.

But Shel, what is you exact process of changing you oil so we might have insight into why so much oil is left behind?

-Ken
 
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My engine retains about 1.5 quarts of old oil when doing a change. That's a pretty big percentage in relation to the total capacity. I'd like to get more of the old oil out when making a change.

My thought was to add some extra, clean oil to the engine just before making the change. I have a quart of M1 that I won't be using in this engine, so I thought of adding it to the crankcase prior to making the change, running the engine a short distance (from home to the shop that's doing the work, just a few miles) and then draining the engine.

Would that dilute the oil so that there's less old oil remaining in the crankcase, and give me more fresh oil, by percentage, when doing the change? Thoughts?
I've read a lot of your posts on these forums so I'm sure you are changing oil & filter at regular intervals and the engine is pretty clean inside. It may seem like 1.4 quarts is a lot to stay inside the engine, but remember, that old oil is not completely spent and still has some life left. So really it won't matter and won't be worth the effort trying to get it out. Just keep up with regular oil and filter changes, it will be fine.
 
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Shel, every internally lubricated motor is going to have a dry fill and service fill capacity. Transmissions as well. When you drain the oil there is still a considerable amount of oil in the cylinder heads, bearings, timing chain rollers, and literally everywhere else. Oil also clings to the sides of the engine block/cylinder head and virtually every internal component and prevents corrosion. Have you ever been to Niagara Falls and been on the Maid of the Mist boat tour? If not, I highly recommend it, it’s awesome. But the inside of an engine gets misted in oil just like you would be misted with water when you ride on the Maid of the Mist boat.

Thank God oil is retained inside the engine during an oil change, otherwise it would be dry start city after an oil change.
 
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