quote:
Originally posted by Patman:
Run that unknown dino vs GC for a 10k interval though, and I bet it's performance suffers!
Moot point, as the longest interval on EC so far is only 5500 miles. Are you running it for 10k miles in your Firebird? Or letting your sister's car go that long? C'mon man! I'm running M1 0W-40 for 10k miles in my beat'em-up turbo fer-cryin'-out-loud-in-the-rain-dontcha-know!
OK
Patman, just for comparison's sake, let's look at EC vs my fave:
-it's a 0w oil, so it'll flow under the coldest conditions you can throw at it
-3.6 HTHS
-passes many stringent European tests including BMW longlife
-this oil is very versatile, can be run in many different engines
-it's truly an oil you can use all year round, from the coldest winter morning to the hottest summer afternoon
[
Well, so far I'd say it's a wash. Waddaya think?]
-it's a thicker 30wt oil, perfect for many looser clearance engines
[
Hmmmm ... there may be some merit here, but isn't this the usual "complaint" about M1 0W-40? And wasn't there some debate recently about how much difference 1 or 1.5 cSt really makes? I mean, what kind of clearance differences are we talking about that can benefit from this small of a change?]
-it holds it's viscosity very well based on the UOAs we've seen so far
-it holds it's TBN well
-has shown very low wear in UOAs so far
[
No better than M1 0W-40 when run for equivalent miles in comparable engines & similar seasonal conditions.]
-I can find this oil at Walmart and Canadian Tire and for less than Mobil 1, and considerably less than other "high ester content" synthetics
[
Ah! We may have a winner here! Less cost for equal performance is always good. And especially considering the "high ester content" of this ... wait a minute ... isn't "high ester content" simply a supposition being made WRT it's claimed pour point? And isn't the veracity of this claim now being questioned? Has anyone proven it's got "high ester content"? Or is this another moot point?]
[
But we can still use the price/performance aspect, right? Whew!]
Oka-a-a-y ... so ... looking at the tally here ... we've got:
Winning points:
1) Emotional attachment (it's new)
2) Physical attraction (it's green & sweet-smelling)
3) Lower cost (than M1)
Questionable advatages:
1) Basically, all the typical stuff you look for in any oil: Viscosity range, visc & TBN retention, HT/HS
Red herrings:
1) Extended drain performance
2) "High ester content"
Obviously, this is just a fun little exercise. (Albeit a fun little exercise
with data.)
Patman knows I'm not beating up on him (you
do know that, right?), I'm just trying to break down his argument.
YZF150,
Excellent counterpoint! (Are there pointy ears on your head?) I disagree with your assertion that it has not been paraded around as the New Messiah of engine oils, as the literally hundreds of posts by fervent believers will attest. As you say, there may be only a few overly-enthusiastic individuals, but the sheer volume of posts is beyond excessive for any oil displaying these limited results. If this occurred with, say, Schaeffer's or Amsoil, people would be crying "Foul!" in an instant!
I agree with your observations regarding uncertainty of future supplies, wishful thinking & the confusion between desire & knowledge. I can see where this rounds out the "Emotional" aspect, beyond my "Look! A shiny round object!" interpretation. And I'm not saying the results aren't "solid UOA reports," just that they're not
good enough to justify the absurd devotion being displayed.
I'm not suggesting that anyone should switch from EC to M1, especially if they're disappointed with M1 & happy with EC. That's not my quest. Again, I'm simply looking for reasons why
anyone would drive for five or six hours in a single day to find this stuff, or stock up with enough to carry them thru the next two API upgrades?
Anyone else care to jump into this good-natured fray ... ?
o Command> Reason
