Gas Price Increase More Than 50 Cents in 2 Months

[hattaresguy]

Originally Posted By: Burt
Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
Speculators are driving up the price because of the Crimea situation.

Which is why they should do away with oil future trading unless you take actual delivery.


Speculative trading is a zero sum game. For every winner there is a loser on the other side of the bet - and no, the consumer is not the loser as he takes actual delivery. Eventually you have to close out you position or take actual delivery.


It creates price instability because speculators only care if the price moves, and use any excuse to do so...

How come we had price stability for decades until the markets were deregulated?

 

[Burt]

Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
Originally Posted By: Burt
Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
Speculators are driving up the price because of the Crimea situation.

Which is why they should do away with oil future trading unless you take actual delivery.


Speculative trading is a zero sum game. For every winner there is a loser on the other side of the bet - and no, the consumer is not the loser as he takes actual delivery. Eventually you have to close out you position or take actual delivery.


It creates price instability because speculators only care if the price moves, and use any excuse to do so...

How come we had price stability for decades until the markets were deregulated?


As I recall when we have price controls (remember Whip-inflation-now?) we had stable gas price, but unfortunately shortages and gas lines. how soon we forget why we got rid of regulation.

 

[NHHEMI]

Originally Posted By: Burt
Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
Originally Posted By: Burt
Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
Speculators are driving up the price because of the Crimea situation.

Which is why they should do away with oil future trading unless you take actual delivery.


Speculative trading is a zero sum game. For every winner there is a loser on the other side of the bet - and no, the consumer is not the loser as he takes actual delivery. Eventually you have to close out you position or take actual delivery.


It creates price instability because speculators only care if the price moves, and use any excuse to do so...

How come we had price stability for decades until the markets were deregulated?


As I recall when we have price controls (remember Whip-inflation-now?) we had stable gas price, but unfortunately shortages and gas lines. how soon we forget why we got rid of regulation.


The only time we had gas lines, shortages, and rationing across the nation was during the oil embargo in the 70's or a war like WWII. An occasional blip during a natural disaster in some locals as well. Regulation NEVER lead to shortages, rationing, or lines at the pump. I think someone is forgetting things for sure here.

 

[hattaresguy]

Regulation never lead to shortages.

When you remove the speculators from the markets like oh in the 90's for example, fuel prices drop.

 

[redbone3]

Is that so. An excellent example is micro cars. They have been regulated out of existence in the US.

 

[Nick R]

Up around 20c/gallon over the past couple months here in Saratoga area. Filled up at $3.43 earlier today ($3.33 with the cumberland farms smartpay app!)

 

[rw19]

SAY YES TO THE KEYSTONE PIPE LINE!!!!!!!!

 

[Huie83]

This is why I've been running E85 almost exclusively this past few months in my FFV. The politics around oil and change in gas prices daily drives me crazy....

E85 is always a steady $2.55 a gallon, 87 octane gas has been ranging from $3.30-3.79 a gallon in MN, mostly hanging around that $3.60 mark the past month or so. Insane.

 

[grampi]

Prices here in Chicagoland have gone from $3.15 to $3.87 in the last 2 months...yes I know they are switching from winter to summer blends, but you can't tell me there isn't at least some gouging going on here...prices don't NEED to go up $.70 a gal...this is just ridiculous!

 

[strat81]

Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
Speculators are driving up the price because of the Crimea situation.

Which is why they should do away with oil future trading unless you take actual delivery.

Why not become a speculator yourself?

 

[grampi]

Originally Posted By: strat81
Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
Speculators are driving up the price because of the Crimea situation.

Which is why they should do away with oil future trading unless you take actual delivery.

Why not become a speculator yourself?


Why would he want to do that if he's suggesting we should get rid of speculators?

 

[strat81]

Originally Posted By: grampi
Originally Posted By: strat81
Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
Speculators are driving up the price because of the Crimea situation.

Which is why they should do away with oil future trading unless you take actual delivery.

Why not become a speculator yourself?


Why would he want to do that if he's suggesting we should get rid of speculators?


He said the speculators are driving up the price, presumably to profit from it. He could make some money for himself.

 

[rw19]

Speculators are critical to a open market system. Thinking before you speak helps!

http://www.investopedia.com/articles/basics/09/the-function-of-speculators.asp

This is a good read for beginners.

 

[Merkava_4]

What we need is E100.

 

[grampi]

Originally Posted By: rw19
Speculators are critical to a open market system. Thinking before you speak helps!

http://www.investopedia.com/articles/basics/09/the-function-of-speculators.asp

This is a good read for beginners.


Speculation isn't necessary for crude products...speculation is relatively new to the oil industry, it didn't come about until the 70s, and the person who said speculation adds to the cost is correct....remove speculation and the price of gas would drop 50 cents to a dollar a gallon almost immediately...

 

[Huie83]

Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
What we need is E100.


AGREED. with the current gas prices my cost per mile is less per mile with E85 than 87 octane. If we had E100 ( or whatever it would be called) i'd imagine the price would be even lower.

 

[SwampSurvivor]

Originally Posted By: Huie83
Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
What we need is E100.


AGREED. with the current gas prices my cost per mile is less per mile with E85 than 87 octane. If we had E100 ( or whatever it would be called) i'd imagine the price would be even lower.


Who will be paying for me to buy vehicles that can run on 100% ethanol?

Gas *might* be cheaper, but buying something that can run on ethanol won't. My Cherokee would probably get single digit gas mileage.

Food prices would be through the roof.

 

[strat81]

Originally Posted By: Huie83
Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
What we need is E100.


AGREED. with the current gas prices my cost per mile is less per mile with E85 than 87 octane. If we had E100 ( or whatever it would be called) i'd imagine the price would be even lower.


IIRC, straight ethanol does not have the cold-start properties necessary for typical ICEs. That's why it's blended with gasoline.

I also recall reading that an engine designed to run purely on E85 (i.e., not flex-fuel) can be more economical to operate compared to one designed to run anything from E0 to E85. The catch is that E85 is relatively uncommon so a straight E85 vehicle wouldn't sell because getting fuel would be difficult. I could be mistaken on some of that though.

Fuel infrastructure is a limiting factor in adoption of any new engine fuel. Hydrogen, E85, electricity, and unicorn farts all lag behind gasoline in terms of where and how fast a vehicle can refuel. My guess is that it will take significant government intervention to change that. I.e., the fed .gov will have to mandate the construction of alternative fuel station and/or provided significant financial incentives (grants, tax breaks, etc.) for them to even begin to approach the ubiquity of gasoline stations.

 

[kschachn]

I have a better idea that doesn't require changing cars at all and has no impact on the existing infrastructure whatsoever. How about we just drill for more of the oil that we know is here in the US, and permit it to flow freely to the market? Seeing how we have a boatload of oil here in the US it seems like a lot easier than any other "solution".

Originally Posted By: strat81
Originally Posted By: Huie83
Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
What we need is E100.
AGREED. with the current gas prices my cost per mile is less per mile with E85 than 87 octane. If we had E100 ( or whatever it would be called) i'd imagine the price would be even lower.
I also recall reading that an engine designed to run purely on E85 (i.e., not flex-fuel) can be more economical to operate compared to one designed to run anything from E0 to E85. The catch is that E85 is relatively uncommon so a straight E85 vehicle wouldn't sell because getting fuel would be difficult. I could be mistaken on some of that though.

Fuel infrastructure is a limiting factor in adoption of any new engine fuel. Hydrogen, E85, electricity, and unicorn farts all lag behind gasoline in terms of where and how fast a vehicle can refuel. My guess is that it will take significant government intervention to change that. I.e., the fed .gov will have to mandate the construction of alternative fuel station and/or provided significant financial incentives (grants, tax breaks, etc.) for them to even begin to approach the ubiquity of gasoline stations.

 

[SwampSurvivor]

Originally Posted By: strat81
Originally Posted By: Huie83
Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
What we need is E100.


AGREED. with the current gas prices my cost per mile is less per mile with E85 than 87 octane. If we had E100 ( or whatever it would be called) i'd imagine the price would be even lower.


IIRC, straight ethanol does not have the cold-start properties necessary for typical ICEs. That's why it's blended with gasoline.

I also recall reading that an engine designed to run purely on E85 (i.e., not flex-fuel) can be more economical to operate compared to one designed to run anything from E0 to E85. The catch is that E85 is relatively uncommon so a straight E85 vehicle wouldn't sell because getting fuel would be difficult. I could be mistaken on some of that though.

Fuel infrastructure is a limiting factor in adoption of any new engine fuel. Hydrogen, E85, electricity, and unicorn farts all lag behind gasoline in terms of where and how fast a vehicle can refuel. My guess is that it will take significant government intervention to change that. I.e., the fed .gov will have to mandate the construction of alternative fuel station and/or provided significant financial incentives (grants, tax breaks, etc.) for them to even begin to approach the ubiquity of gasoline stations.


Ford did testing of that on some of their flex fuel vehicles. Once the temperature gets below 0F, the vehicles wouldn't reliably start. Below -20F or -30F (can't remember which), they wouldn't start period.