Could be lighter grade oil prior and/or fuel dilution or... i dunno
Fram Orange Can of Death vs. Purolator
- Thread starter Greg L
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Originally Posted By: Greg L
Just picked up my used 2002 Dodge Ram 1500 this weekend. Has the 4.7 engine.
WIX 51085
Just picked up my used 2002 Dodge Ram 1500 this weekend. Has the 4.7 engine.
WIX 51085
By the way, the Purolator was the white can....number L14670
KMart special.
KMart special.
Originally Posted By: Errtt
Could be lighter grade oil prior and/or fuel dilution or... i dunno
Fuel dilution is another possibility
Could be lighter grade oil prior and/or fuel dilution or... i dunno
Fuel dilution is another possibility
Not to derail the thread, but I noticed not many ever use Mobil 1 filters. It's either Purolator or now, Fram.
Originally Posted By: MileHigh18
Not to derail the thread, but I noticed not many ever use Mobil 1 filters. It's either Purolator or now, Fram.
correct me if i am wrong but mobil 1 is made by champion labs(owned by fram now), it costs more then fram ultra and isn't as efficient, the fram ultra is fully synthetic as well.
Not to derail the thread, but I noticed not many ever use Mobil 1 filters. It's either Purolator or now, Fram.
correct me if i am wrong but mobil 1 is made by champion labs(owned by fram now), it costs more then fram ultra and isn't as efficient, the fram ultra is fully synthetic as well.
Gotcha. I figured since M1 was such a highly regarded oil, that their filters would be as well.
Originally Posted By: MileHigh18
Not to derail the thread, but I noticed not many ever use Mobil 1 filters. It's either Purolator or now, Fram.
Mobil 1 is one of the top five best built filters in the world; it's up there with Royal Purple, K&N, Donaldson, and Amsoil.
Not to derail the thread, but I noticed not many ever use Mobil 1 filters. It's either Purolator or now, Fram.
Mobil 1 is one of the top five best built filters in the world; it's up there with Royal Purple, K&N, Donaldson, and Amsoil.
I use them, I got a boatload back when they were on sale at Farm & Fleet for $4.99, then I got a second boatload when they went on sale two weeks later for $3.99. They seem like very well made filters.
Originally Posted By: MileHigh18
Not to derail the thread, but I noticed not many ever use Mobil 1 filters. It's either Purolator or now, Fram.
Originally Posted By: MileHigh18
Not to derail the thread, but I noticed not many ever use Mobil 1 filters. It's either Purolator or now, Fram.
Originally Posted By: steveh
Who's to say this Purolator thing might just be a internet hoax. All it would take is a few people to cut open and damage a filter and post pictures of it.
We see you, Purolator Vice President... you can't fool us with "steveh"... busted
Who's to say this Purolator thing might just be a internet hoax. All it would take is a few people to cut open and damage a filter and post pictures of it.
We see you, Purolator Vice President... you can't fool us with "steveh"... busted
Support fram orange can support it
The Mobil 1 is a fine filter but it's not fully synthetic and cost is up there with the Fram Ultra which is a higher tier extended drain filter. They rate among the best synthetic blend filters though and are still very high quality. They hold up well to longer than average drains and produce good insolubles ratings too.
Is the Mobil 1 EP filter synthetic?
Originally Posted By: mrsilv04
Well, you've changed two variables... the filter *and* the oil.
Hard to tell at this point, as to which one might have caused the change in what you're seeing at the pressure gauge.
My bet is the oil is what changed the oil pressure. With a positive displacement oil pump the flow resistance of the oil filter isn't going to effect the volume of oil coming out of the oil pump.
Well, you've changed two variables... the filter *and* the oil.
Hard to tell at this point, as to which one might have caused the change in what you're seeing at the pressure gauge.
My bet is the oil is what changed the oil pressure. With a positive displacement oil pump the flow resistance of the oil filter isn't going to effect the volume of oil coming out of the oil pump.
Originally Posted By: MileHigh18
Not to derail the thread, but I noticed not many ever use Mobil 1 filters. It's either Purolator or now, Fram.
I've used them. They're Champion built (so now they're built by a Fram relative, but the two product lines still seem to retain their unique engineering features.) Champion filters built for third-party brands can be among the best built filters available- Amsoil EAO, Royal Purple, and Mobil 1 sure fall in that category. Of course they also build some much further down-scale filters also.
My only beef with the M1 is that its overly expensive for what it is. It costs in the same price range as a Puorlator Synthetic, almost as much as a Royal Purple, and more than a Fram Ultra- all of which have full wire-backed synthetic media whereas the M1 is just a blend similar to the Pure One, Wix, and Fram TG media. For the price you can have a wire-backed media, so there's no reason to pick M1 any longer. In my opinion anyway... ;-)
Not to derail the thread, but I noticed not many ever use Mobil 1 filters. It's either Purolator or now, Fram.
I've used them. They're Champion built (so now they're built by a Fram relative, but the two product lines still seem to retain their unique engineering features.) Champion filters built for third-party brands can be among the best built filters available- Amsoil EAO, Royal Purple, and Mobil 1 sure fall in that category. Of course they also build some much further down-scale filters also.
My only beef with the M1 is that its overly expensive for what it is. It costs in the same price range as a Puorlator Synthetic, almost as much as a Royal Purple, and more than a Fram Ultra- all of which have full wire-backed synthetic media whereas the M1 is just a blend similar to the Pure One, Wix, and Fram TG media. For the price you can have a wire-backed media, so there's no reason to pick M1 any longer. In my opinion anyway... ;-)
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: mrsilv04
Well, you've changed two variables... the filter *and* the oil.
Hard to tell at this point, as to which one might have caused the change in what you're seeing at the pressure gauge.
My bet is the oil is what changed the oil pressure. With a positive displacement oil pump the flow resistance of the oil filter isn't going to effect the volume of oil coming out of the oil pump.
If oil pumps were *truly* positive-displacement, that would be true. But they all have rotor tip and rotor side leakage, and in most cases the relief valve is between the pump and the filter. On Mopars in particular, the relief valve tends to be open most of the time so that the oiling system operates as a constant supply-pressure system over most of the RPM range (notable exception: the Pentastar V6, where the oil pressure is computer controlled with a variable displacement pump and will suddenly drop from 80 to 40 or shoot from 40 to 80 as needed). When the relief valve lifts, you have a fixed pressure upstream of the filter, so the gauge DOES vary with filter Delta-P.
Originally Posted By: mrsilv04
Well, you've changed two variables... the filter *and* the oil.
Hard to tell at this point, as to which one might have caused the change in what you're seeing at the pressure gauge.
My bet is the oil is what changed the oil pressure. With a positive displacement oil pump the flow resistance of the oil filter isn't going to effect the volume of oil coming out of the oil pump.
If oil pumps were *truly* positive-displacement, that would be true. But they all have rotor tip and rotor side leakage, and in most cases the relief valve is between the pump and the filter. On Mopars in particular, the relief valve tends to be open most of the time so that the oiling system operates as a constant supply-pressure system over most of the RPM range (notable exception: the Pentastar V6, where the oil pressure is computer controlled with a variable displacement pump and will suddenly drop from 80 to 40 or shoot from 40 to 80 as needed). When the relief valve lifts, you have a fixed pressure upstream of the filter, so the gauge DOES vary with filter Delta-P.
Originally Posted By: steveh
Who's to say this Purolator thing might just be a internet hoax. All it would take is a few people to cut open and damage a filter and post pictures of it.
It's not a hoax. Some guy on the internet also thought the sink hole at the Corvette Museum was all a hoax too.
Who's to say this Purolator thing might just be a internet hoax. All it would take is a few people to cut open and damage a filter and post pictures of it.
It's not a hoax. Some guy on the internet also thought the sink hole at the Corvette Museum was all a hoax too.
Originally Posted By: 440Magnum
As others have said, you have a new filter (with more media and less restrictive than the Fram- regardless of whether its torn or not), and you've also changed to fresh oil. BOTH can raise the oil pressure, including the fact that the basic Fram has so little media area that it causes a bigger delta-P than other filters.
Any slight change in flow restrictiveness of the oil filter isn't going to change the oil pressure when there is a positive displacement oil pump feeding the filter & engine.
The only time it could make a different in seen oil pressure would be with pretty cold/thick oil at very high engine RPM, or if the filter was basically totally clogged up.
As others have said, you have a new filter (with more media and less restrictive than the Fram- regardless of whether its torn or not), and you've also changed to fresh oil. BOTH can raise the oil pressure, including the fact that the basic Fram has so little media area that it causes a bigger delta-P than other filters.
Any slight change in flow restrictiveness of the oil filter isn't going to change the oil pressure when there is a positive displacement oil pump feeding the filter & engine.
The only time it could make a different in seen oil pressure would be with pretty cold/thick oil at very high engine RPM, or if the filter was basically totally clogged up.
Originally Posted By: 440Magnum
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: mrsilv04
Well, you've changed two variables... the filter *and* the oil.
Hard to tell at this point, as to which one might have caused the change in what you're seeing at the pressure gauge.
My bet is the oil is what changed the oil pressure. With a positive displacement oil pump the flow resistance of the oil filter isn't going to effect the volume of oil coming out of the oil pump.
If oil pumps were *truly* positive-displacement, that would be true. But they all have rotor tip and rotor side leakage, and in most cases the relief valve is between the pump and the filter.
If the oil pump is in good shape, the rotor leakage isn't going to change anything enough to see any effect on oil pressure based on what oil filter is used. I've used 4 or 5 different brand/model oil filters on my Z06 and I've recorded oil pressure vs. oil temperature and engine RPM for all of them. They all give the same exact oil pressures throughout the RPM (idle to 6000) and temperature (50 to 220 deg F) ranges using Mobil 1 5W-30 full synthetic oil.
The relief valve should only start bleeding off oil volume at high RPM with hot oil, thereby controlling the oil pressure supplied to the engine. Most engines have oil pressure gauges located after the oil filter, so you can't directly see the effect of the oil filter. But besides, there will typically only be +/- a couple of PSI difference in delta-p between any given quality oil filter.
Originally Posted By: 440Magnum
On Mopars in particular, the relief valve tends to be open most of the time so that the oiling system operates as a constant supply-pressure system over most of the RPM range (notable exception: the Pentastar V6, where the oil pressure is computer controlled with a variable displacement pump and will suddenly drop from 80 to 40 or shoot from 40 to 80 as needed). When the relief valve lifts, you have a fixed pressure upstream of the filter, so the gauge DOES vary with filter Delta-P.
So Mopars have 70~80 PSI of oil pressure at idle with hot oil? I'm not talking about "computer controlled" oil pumps, etc ... just old fashioned positive displacement oil pumps. Again, if the oil pressure gauge is down stream of the oil filter, you will never see the effect of the filter's delat-p on the engine's oil pressure gauge - unless the oil pump is in pressure relief. You would have to place the oil pressure gauge before the oil filter to see the filter's effective flow resistance.
Originally Posted By: ZeeOSix
Originally Posted By: mrsilv04
Well, you've changed two variables... the filter *and* the oil.
Hard to tell at this point, as to which one might have caused the change in what you're seeing at the pressure gauge.
My bet is the oil is what changed the oil pressure. With a positive displacement oil pump the flow resistance of the oil filter isn't going to effect the volume of oil coming out of the oil pump.
If oil pumps were *truly* positive-displacement, that would be true. But they all have rotor tip and rotor side leakage, and in most cases the relief valve is between the pump and the filter.
If the oil pump is in good shape, the rotor leakage isn't going to change anything enough to see any effect on oil pressure based on what oil filter is used. I've used 4 or 5 different brand/model oil filters on my Z06 and I've recorded oil pressure vs. oil temperature and engine RPM for all of them. They all give the same exact oil pressures throughout the RPM (idle to 6000) and temperature (50 to 220 deg F) ranges using Mobil 1 5W-30 full synthetic oil.
The relief valve should only start bleeding off oil volume at high RPM with hot oil, thereby controlling the oil pressure supplied to the engine. Most engines have oil pressure gauges located after the oil filter, so you can't directly see the effect of the oil filter. But besides, there will typically only be +/- a couple of PSI difference in delta-p between any given quality oil filter.
Originally Posted By: 440Magnum
On Mopars in particular, the relief valve tends to be open most of the time so that the oiling system operates as a constant supply-pressure system over most of the RPM range (notable exception: the Pentastar V6, where the oil pressure is computer controlled with a variable displacement pump and will suddenly drop from 80 to 40 or shoot from 40 to 80 as needed). When the relief valve lifts, you have a fixed pressure upstream of the filter, so the gauge DOES vary with filter Delta-P.
So Mopars have 70~80 PSI of oil pressure at idle with hot oil? I'm not talking about "computer controlled" oil pumps, etc ... just old fashioned positive displacement oil pumps. Again, if the oil pressure gauge is down stream of the oil filter, you will never see the effect of the filter's delat-p on the engine's oil pressure gauge - unless the oil pump is in pressure relief. You would have to place the oil pressure gauge before the oil filter to see the filter's effective flow resistance.
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